Dan Girardi: Part IV

[Filthy Dangles]

You do realize you're taking the whole ECHL-caliber player comment out of context right?

No I am not. People literally call Girardi an ECHL'er and provide their pretty little precious charts/numbers to prove it.

What a joke.

EDIT: SF is the only rational one when it comes to charts/numbers and Girardi, who concedes he's an overused/outmatched #2 when in reality he's a number 3/4.

 

[Raspewtin]

Are you surprised people thought McDonagh was a great defenseman when he had a Norris caliber season before he was 25 years old?

Also, he was playing injured this year.

No argument from me that McDonagh firmly cemeneted his reputation as a great defenseman in the league since his 1st full year. But, he had one top 10 defenseman year, and we all had no problem labeling him as such. That's my point.

No I am not. People literally call Girardi an ECHL'er and provide their pretty little precious charts/numbers to prove it.

What a joke.

EDIT: SF is the only rational one when it comes to charts/numbers and Girardi, who concedes he's an overused/outmatched #2 when in reality he's a number 3/4.

No what you actually meant is

"SF is rational because he agrees with me and all those other mean nerds are just brainwashed stat sheet addicts who don't actually watch the games"

 

[Filthy Dangles]

No argument from me that McDonagh firmly cemeneted his reputation as a great defenseman in the league since his 1st full year. But, he had one top 10 defenseman year, and we all had no problem labeling him as such. That's my point.



No what you actually meant is

"SF is rational because he agrees with me and all those other mean nerds are just brainwashed stat sheet addicts who don't actually watch the games"

Dan Girardi is actually a legit #2 to me, so we actually don't agree. Saying he's a 3/4 is not a problem. Sitting there with a straight face saying he belongs in the ECHL is a big joke and it's hard to take what you say seriously if that's where you seriously think he belongs.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

How do you know that he was injured this whole year?

Did you wear your glasses this year? because I know you watched.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Did you wear your glasses this year? because I know you watched.

I'm just saying. Seemed mental more so than physical.

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

I'm just saying. Seemed mental more so than physical.

It was a mix of both

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

It was a mix of both

Perhaps to begin the season. The shoulder injury had me convinced he needed surgery to repair something lingering from the Burrows hit.

But as the season progressed, I think the pressure of being such a young captain on a team with sky high expectations forced him to crumple.

Logic would prevail that he will learn from this and come back stronger and more confident. But you never know. Here's to hoping.

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

Perhaps to begin the season. The shoulder injury had me convinced he needed surgery to repair something lingering from the Burrows hit.

But as the season progressed, I think the pressure of being such a young captain on a team with sky high expectations forced him to crumple.

Logic would prevail that he will learn from this and come back stronger and more confident. But you never know. Here's to hoping.

Remember he reinjured it thanks to E.Kane


Also the pressure wasn't the problem he said being a captain at first was distracting him from preparing from the game. But this isn't the McD thread so I'll end it there

 

[Machinehead]

Talking about Girardi and NOT talking about advanced stats

http://mcdonaghandfries.blogspot.com/2015/08/five-reasons-rangers-must-move-dan.html

 

[DanielBrassard]

Good article Machinehead, hard to argue even if you are a Girardi fan.

Something I wanted to bring up, was with the new addition to HERO charts with the TOI leading or trailing, Girardi's usage indicates that he's not favored either way, so the argument of his numbers being affected by the score isn't a great argument.

 

[Tawnos]

Talking about Girardi and NOT talking about advanced stats

http://mcdonaghandfries.blogspot.com/2015/08/five-reasons-rangers-must-move-dan.html

And doing a ****** job. The analysis of his cap hit is flawed. Comparisons with RFA contracts is terrible. Comparisons with defenseman who were never 1st pair guys before their current deals are terrible. Just awful contract analysis.

On his second point, let's worry about what his style combined with his age does when it does it. "He will soon." No. Sorry. You can't predict things like that. You can't predict when a physical decline really happens and you can't predict how a guy adjusts.

Point 3: "Current Rangers coach AV likes to employ a mobile defense." You know who else AV likes to employ? Dan Girardi. Also, revisionist history. Rangers fans considered Girardi a first pairing D way back when he was paired with Marc Staal. That's 2 seasons before the writer states.

Point 4 has some validity. The main problem I have with it is that he considers 'D' to be one position. It's two different positions. When you look at it as having Girardi, Klein and Boyle on RD, things don't look quite so rosy imagining it without him.

Point 5 is self-reinforcing from the rest of the article. It's not a point that stands on its own.

So, no Daniel Brassard. Pretty easy to argue against. Incredibly in fact. Then again, I have a lot of practice around here.

 

[Machinehead]

And doing a ****** job. The analysis of his cap hit is flawed. Comparisons with RFA contracts is terrible. Comparisons with defenseman who were never 1st pair guys before their current deals are terrible. Just awful contract analysis.

On his second point, let's worry about what his style combined with his age does when it does it. "He will soon." No. Sorry. You can't predict things like that. You can't predict when a physical decline really happens and you can't predict how a guy adjusts.

Point 3: "Current Rangers coach AV likes to employ a mobile defense." You know who else AV likes to employ? Dan Girardi. Also, revisionist history. Rangers fans considered Girardi a first pairing D way back when he was paired with Marc Staal. That's 2 seasons before the writer states.

Point 4 has some validity. The main problem I have with it is that he considers 'D' to be one position. It's two different positions. When you look at it as having Girardi, Klein and Boyle on RD, things don't look quite so rosy imagining it without him.

Point 5 is self-reinforcing from the rest of the article. It's not a point that stands on its own.

So, no Daniel Brassard. Pretty easy to argue against. Incredibly in fact. Then again, I have a lot of practice around here.

1)What comparable player makes Girardi's money and is considered to be on a good contract?

2)I'd say he's already noticeably declined.

3)Girardi was here before AV, it's not really AV's decision to employ him. But this team has objectively changed under AV. Girardi and Staal are the only Torts-style players left. Why hasn't the change come at that spot?

4)AV has to get over that. There aren't enough good RD to go around to do that on every pair and have it be effective. The majority of players are left-handed.

5)The point you didn't address is what else can we do to keep the players who are free agents next summer?

 

[haveandare]

1)What comparable player makes Girardi's money and is considered to be on a good contract?

2)I'd say he's already noticeably declined.

3)Girardi was here before AV, it's not really AV's decision to employ him. But this team has objectively changed under AV. Girardi and Staal are the only Torts-style players left. Why hasn't the change come at that spot?

4)AV has to get over that. There aren't enough good RD to go around to do that on every pair and have it be effective. The majority of players are left-handed.

5)The point you didn't address is what else can we do to keep the players who are free agents next summer?

Not really taking a side on the whole, but for 3, he could have given Boyle those minutes, or he could have gotten over his handedness thing and given Yandle those minutes, or even Staal. Also, Klein is a "Tort's-style" player still IMO.

 

[eco's bones]

1)What comparable player makes Girardi's money and is considered to be on a good contract?

2)I'd say he's already noticeably declined.

3)Girardi was here before AV, it's not really AV's decision to employ him. But this team has objectively changed under AV. Girardi and Staal are the only Torts-style players left. Why hasn't the change come at that spot?

4)AV has to get over that. There aren't enough good RD to go around to do that on every pair and have it be effective. The majority of players are left-handed.

5)The point you didn't address is what else can we do to keep the players who are free agents next summer?

Girardi was here before AV--so what? AV in his two seasons here still played him as the top RD. He played him over Stralman in 13-14 and Boyle in 14-15. Unless you have evidence to the contrary you can't say anyone forced AV to do that without your opinion on this appearing ridiculous.

.....and because of that the remark by the writer of the article that--Girardi doesn't fit AV's system--is just **** if only because in critical situations Girardi is AV's go to right side defender and whether either one of us or anyone else on these boards likes it or not--that's the way it is because that's who AV has given more minutes and bigger moments to. You can infer all you like that he doesn't deserve it but apparently his coach thinks he does.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

And doing a ****** job. The analysis of his cap hit is flawed. Comparisons with RFA contracts is terrible. Comparisons with defenseman who were never 1st pair guys before their current deals are terrible. Just awful contract analysis.

On his second point, let's worry about what his style combined with his age does when it does it. "He will soon." No. Sorry. You can't predict things like that. You can't predict when a physical decline really happens and you can't predict how a guy adjusts.

Point 3: "Current Rangers coach AV likes to employ a mobile defense." You know who else AV likes to employ? Dan Girardi. Also, revisionist history. Rangers fans considered Girardi a first pairing D way back when he was paired with Marc Staal. That's 2 seasons before the writer states.

Point 4 has some validity. The main problem I have with it is that he considers 'D' to be one position. It's two different positions. When you look at it as having Girardi, Klein and Boyle on RD, things don't look quite so rosy imagining it without him.

Point 5 is self-reinforcing from the rest of the article. It's not a point that stands on its own.

So, no Daniel Brassard. Pretty easy to argue against. Incredibly in fact. Then again, I have a lot of practice around here.

Agreed. All of those points are flimsy.

Not to mention the bottom line, it presents absolutely no reason to trade Girardi right now.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Girardi was here before AV--so what? AV in his two seasons here still played him as the top RD. He played him over Stralman in 13-14 and Boyle in 14-15. Unless you have evidence to the contrary you can't say anyone forced AV to do that without your opinion on this appearing ridiculous.

.....and because of that the remark by the writer of the article that--Girardi doesn't fit AV's system--is just **** if only because in critical situations Girardi is AV's go to right side defender and whether either one of us or anyone else on these boards likes it or not--that's the way it is because that's who AV has given more minutes and bigger moments to. You can infer all you like that he doesn't deserve it but apparently his coach thinks he does.

Its pretty simple. Coaches that are employed in the NHL and want to stay employed will choose to stop the best forwards in the world rather than take it to them and very likely get burned

 

[Filthy Dangles]

MHs points were fair.

But, Girardi aint going nowhere. Rangers are still contending for the cup well within the window. The Rangers can't just hope someone will fill Dan G's minutes on the top pair. Boyle should not be trusted, nor Klein.

If the Rangers still had Stralman, moving Girardi might be a viable option, but even then, I'd still want that depth at RHD in G and Strals. Despite advanced stats, G is a guy you want out there when the game is on the line, see the below chart.


I don't think Dan G has hurt this teams chances at a cup.

Seems like a guy you want on the ice in the PO when the game is on the line.

 

[Raspewtin]

Not really taking a side on the whole, but for 3, he could have given Boyle those minutes, or he could have gotten over his handedness thing and given Yandle those minutes, or even Staal. Also, Klein is a "Tort's-style" player still IMO.

I think after his disaster last season with SJ, concussion or not, was a hefty strike against using Boyle like he's historically been used. It's not that I totally disagree with it, but Boyle can't be used this year like he was last year.

Girardi was here before AV--so what? AV in his two seasons here still played him as the top RD. He played him over Stralman in 13-14 and Boyle in 14-15. Unless you have evidence to the contrary you can't say anyone forced AV to do that without your opinion on this appearing ridiculous.

Clearly wasn't a great decision considering Stralman is 4x the player Girardi is. And that was on full display this season.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

I'd rather have Girardi in Girardi's role than Stralman in Girardi's role. But I'd rather have Stralman over Dan G, generally.

Stralman overall is the better player at this point in their careers but again if the game is on the line I trust Girardi more than Stralman.

It sucks we don't have them both. That was the best core in the NHL. McDonagh and Stralman carried their respective pairings but Staal and Girardi were still very capable #2/#4's respectively.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Girardi really brought this on himself. He has no one to blame but Daniel.

If he would just score a bunch in the regular season, and just flake and play the perimeter in the playoffs, the fans would finally notice the defense he brings to the game and get off his back.

 

[NYR2007]

This bum is still on the team ... i figured he would be traded by now for the top 6 sniper and we resigned Yandle to a 6 year $4M annual cap hit

 

[DanielBrassard]

Girardi really brought this on himself. He has no one to blame but Daniel.

If he would just score a bunch in the regular season, and just flake and play the perimeter in the playoffs, the fans would finally notice the defense he brings to the game and get off his back.

Luckily for Girardi hes poor in the regular and postseason so he cant be labeled a choker.

 

[Machinehead]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?p=106554741

Watching this landslide unfold. I did this to show that what we think Girardi is and what everyone else thinks Girardi is are two very different things.

 

[sbjnyc]

Why would you compare Girardi to Letang? I think most (all?) of us would swap G for Letang in a heartbeat.

 

[Machinehead]

Why would you compare Girardi to Letang? I think most (all?) of us would swap G for Letang in a heartbeat.

That's what I thought...