D Cale Makar - UMass (Amherst), NCAA (2017, 4th, COL)

[lawrence]

Whats his ETA to the NHL

Umass coach said he's only there for one season then plans to go to the ahl the year after. This kid kinda has an idea of what needs to be done. The main question is.... why 1 year in college but not the chl were he can play 70 games instead of 40 ? Is there a 1 year degree in school he badly wants?

The RBC final has teams that all rival Major junior teams and in most cases are probably better than half the major jr teams in Canada.

I have to disagree with this. They will get eaten alive by the worst of the chl.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Umass coach said he's only there for one season then plans to go to the ahl the year after. This kid kinda has an idea of what needs to be done. The main question is.... why 1 year in college but not the chl were he can play 70 games instead of 40 ? Is there a 1 year degree in school he badly wants?



I have to disagree with this. They will get eaten alive by the worst of the chl.

I still think he will go to WHL next season

I said before and im sticking with it, Regina will acquire his rights and he will join the Pats. Regina is going to have a very long season next year

 

[lawrence]

I still think he will go to WHL next season

I said before and im sticking with it, Regina will acquire his rights and he will join the Pats. Regina is going to have a very long season next year

I'm down with that. I personally think if he's going to develop the CHL is a better option then college.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Would he go any higher in the draft if he was a forward? Just a random thought.

 

[docbenton]

I'm down with that. I personally think if he's going to develop the CHL is a better option then college.

Disagree, I think college is a great developmental track. Junior players play too many games, IMO. They need more time practicing and training and maturing as players and people. In the NCAA pretty much every game is a big game, so players have fewer opportunities to develop bad habits.

 

[lawrence]

Disagree, I think college is a great developmental track. Junior players play too many games, IMO. They need more time practicing and training and maturing as players and people. In the NCAA pretty much every game is a big game, so players have fewer opportunities to develop bad habits.

Junior players play too many games

They need more time practicing and training and maturing as players

.... they have plenty of time for that, not to mention they have their own high end facilities to train in, on top of that the entire summer to train if needed.

players have fewer opportunities to develop bad habits.

????? what bad habbits?

70 games emulating NHL rules >>>>> 40 games on a different ice surface and different rules.

btw, I never said NCAA was bad at all. CHL just better for developement. since game time trumps heck out of training time.

 

[Firecracker]

.... they have plenty of time for that, not to mention they have their own high end facilities to train in, on top of that the entire summer to train if needed.



????? what bad habbits?

70 games emulating NHL rules >>>>> 40 games on a different ice surface and different rules.

btw, I never said NCAA was bad at all. CHL just better for developement. since game time trumps heck out of training time.

Prospects in NCAA can train over the summer and have their own high end facilities. With that said like the CHI some teams have better facilities then others. Also going to have to disagree on the CHL being a better development league. I think that it is a case by case thing, some players benefit from the games while some will benefit from the extra time at practice or in the weight room and such.

 

[lawrence]

Prospects in NCAA can train over the summer and have their own high end facilities. With that said like the CHI some teams have better facilities then others. Also going to have to disagree on the CHL being a better development league. I think that it is a case by case thing, some players benefit from the games while some will benefit from the extra time at practice or in the weight room and such.

will benefit from the extra time at practice or in the weight room and such.

CHL teams have more then adequate enough "practice" time already, and you can't really become a better player by going to a gym, although that is important, CHL teams already have access to good enough facilities, rather moot point, lets just agree to disagree, I think Makar takes the college route. Again I'm a games played development type of guy. 70 games>>> 40 games.

 

[Club]

Would he go any higher in the draft if he was a forward? Just a random thought.

Probably #4 or 5 OA. Just my onion.

 

[ceg195]

I have to disagree with this. They will get eaten alive by the worst of the chl.

Nope. Watched the Oshawa Generals play a few times this year and I know for a fact they would give them a run for their money.

 

[lawrence]

Nope. Watched the Oshawa Generals play a few times this year and I know for a fact they would give them a run for their money.

I take back the "eaten alive"

I've seen the Vancouver Giants play enough to see a bad CHL team.

the fact that most of these players can't even make the CHL, or even get drafted into a NHL team speaks for itself.

 

[Hiishawk]

I take back the "eaten alive"

I've seen the Vancouver Giants play enough to see a bad CHL team.

the fact that most of these players can't even make the CHL, or even get drafted into a NHL team speaks for itself.

I think a lot of HF boards fans underestimate the quality of the best Junior A teams because this is a board for prospects, usually meaning draft prospects, and the CHL has far more of those sexy names than Junior A.

But a higher quality of prospects doesn't necessarily mean that the better Junior A teams and weaker CHL teams aren't often close in actual current talent or quality of play. For one thing, Junior A teams are allowed 6-8 overage players, as opposed to the CHL's three. The average age of most junior A teams is actually higher than CHL clubs (the recent RBC Champs Cobourg averaged 18.8 years). In the teenage years that's a quality huge factor.

Several of those older players in fact have played in the CHL. However, if they don't show pro potential they are often dropped by (or leave) the CHL in favour of younger (16-17 year old) players who perhaps aren't as effective right now, but hold far more long-term potential. The CHL is about showing off and developing NHL prospects, so 'OK' 19-20 year olds are often shown the door in favour of more promising, but currently less impacting, 16 or 17 year olds.

Besides that, look at the Penticton Vees. Their roster included 20 (!) NCAA commits, mostly for next season, most Division 1. Now we know that NCAA teams are usually superior to CHL teams (again age and all) and virtually all their players are going to play there next season. It's not as if these Junior A teams are farm teams for a CHL club or something. They are prepping players for NCAA play. I'm pretty certain that Penticton (or Chilliwack) of the BCHL was a superior team to WHL's Kootenay and Vancouver this past season.

 

[lawrence]

I think a lot of HF boards fans underestimate the quality of the best Junior A teams because this is a board for prospects, usually meaning draft prospects, and the CHL has far more of those sexy names than Junior A.

But a higher quality of prospects doesn't necessarily mean that the better Junior A teams and weaker CHL teams aren't often close in actual current talent or quality of play. For one thing, Junior A teams are allowed 6-8 overage players, as opposed to the CHL's three. The average age of most junior A teams is actually higher than CHL clubs (the recent RBC Champs Cobourg averaged 18.8 years). In the teenage years that's a quality huge factor.

Several of those older players in fact have played in the CHL. However, if they don't show pro potential they are often dropped by (or leave) the CHL in favour of younger (16-17 year old) players who perhaps aren't as effective right now, but hold far more long-term potential. The CHL is about showing off and developing NHL prospects, so 'OK' 19-20 year olds are often shown the door in favour of more promising, but currently less impacting, 16 or 17 year olds.

Besides that, look at the Penticton Vees. Their roster included 20 (!) NCAA commits, mostly for next season, most Division 1. Now we know that NCAA teams are usually superior to CHL teams (again age and all) and virtually all their players are going to play there next season. It's not as if these Junior A teams are farm teams for a CHL club or something. They are prepping players for NCAA play. I'm pretty certain that Penticton (or Chilliwack) of the BCHL was a superior team to WHL's Kootenay and Vancouver this past season.

now there's another thing that needs to be considered, their going after players that couldn't make the CHL, or most of them couldn't make the CHL so to say "usually superior" is way off. SO NCAA are recruiting players that most of them couldn't make the CHL. But of course in the game of hockey, if France can beat Canada (WHC 2 years ago, and if Swiss can beat canada (olympics) consisting of a players that didn't even get drafted) yea sure.... a Junior A team can probably beat a CHL team. Also considering the last 3 opponents the Bandits played against, consisted of zero drafted players.

Lets put it this way, in a best of 7, Giants vs Vee's, I will bet everything with confident that the Giants will beat them in 4. No contest. Bunch of players that couldn't make the CHL vs a bunch of players that made the CHL. I give some leeway, that 5 of them decided to stick around in the BCHL in hopes of college, fine, 5 of them. They have 5 CHL players against a team of CHL players.

Still wouldn't win. That said I'm not slamming Junior A... no, these guys play as hard they come. To me its like asking me if the best AHL team can beat the worst NHL team, which is the Avalanche or Canucks, and it's a definite no. Not a chance.

 

[StayAtHomeAv]

CHL teams have more then adequate enough "practice" time already, and you can't really become a better player by going to a gym, although that is important, CHL teams already have access to good enough facilities, rather moot point, lets just agree to disagree, I think Makar takes the college route. Again I'm a games played development type of guy. 70 games>>> 40 games.

Going to the gym is a huge part of development.

 

[lawrence]

Going to the gym is a huge part of development.

which chl players have access too

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Going to the gym is a huge part of development.

hes graduated highschool so he has access to unreal top end workout facilities in CHL all day after practice and days off and wont have to worry about taking any classes all day

 

[covfefe]

I take back the "eaten alive"

I've seen the Vancouver Giants play enough to see a bad CHL team.

the fact that most of these players can't even make the CHL, or even get drafted into a NHL team speaks for itself.

The overwhelming majority of CHL players don't get drafted into the NHL.

It's no secret that this is worse hockey than that in the WHL. And again, it's no secret that Makar would also be an excellent WHL player. Just as Jost and Fabbro would have been last year. I am not one for hypotheticals, but you can certainly extrapolate his dominance at this level to the WHL. Think about this player in 5, 10 years...not in terms of where he is today

 

[StayAtHomeAv]

which chl players have access too

Thanks captain obvious.

You said you cant really become a better player by going to a gym. That's just not true. Working out is a vital aspect to becoming the best player you can be.

 

[Hiishawk]

To me its like asking me if the best AHL team can beat the worst NHL team, which is the Avalanche or Canucks, and it's a definite no. Not a chance.

You kind of ignored most of what I wrote earlier... but I'll try one more time.

The AHL-NHL analogy is bad one. Junior A teams are not farm teams. Their players weren't all attending CHL camps and were then cut and sent down (I'll admit a few were). But in the case of the Penticton Vees, I don't know of one player on that team who had the intention of trying to make a CHL team but failed. They all came to prepare for NCAA.

But OK, the Vees are a little special. The other top BCHL teams have similar NCAA commits (never attended any CHL team camp) but also some who did try to make the CHL at ages 16 or 17 and didn't make it. And here's the thing: those players are now 19 or 20. They've gained two or three years experience. If they were currently playing in the CHL, they would undoubtedly be playing better than your run-of-the-mill CHL 17 year old, but CHL teams will keep 16 or 17 year olds up instead for development purposes. CHL teams will keep the 16/17 year old with potential over a currently superior 19 or 20 year old trying to go from Junior A any day. And some of these 16 and 17 year olds never really develop well -- resulting in bad CHL teams.

Bottom rung CHL teams are typically full of 17 year old draft eligible players who have no hope of getting drafted and 19 year olds who never fulfilled their potential. Good Junior A teams will be stocked up on NCAA commits plus a LOT of 19 and 20 year olds who gave up on the CHL at age 17 but have continued developing -- many of whom will enter NCAA or ECHL hockey next season. That age factor makes all the difference in the world when measuring level of competition (as opposed to using the number of future NHL prospects as the main criterion).

 

[bigdog16]

Lot of people here severely underestimating the talent level of top Jr A teams. The top ones can beat the lower end CHL teams. If you disagree then I just highly doubt you've watched much Jr A hockeh

 

[Adonis Creed]

Top 19-20 years old in JR A are at best decent 3rd liner in avg CHL team....

I know Terrebonne best 2-3 players we're avg 4th liner in CHL.

Might be some good 17 years old who go NCAA route...but they represent a minority...

Makar still an amazing prospect

 

[AlternateSideParking]

Major junior is the best development league in North America. This isn't up for debate. The USHL, NTDP and NCAA are all intertwined, but they come a distant second.

Junior A is several rungs below Major Junior. It's like the USHL and the NAHL. Night and day.

 

[Daximus]

Major junior is the best development league in North America. This isn't up for debate. The USHL, NTDP and NCAA are all intertwined, but they come a distant second.

Junior A is several rungs below Major Junior. It's like the USHL and the NAHL. Night and day.

Absolutely agree. It's no contest. I knew several kids growing up that were drafted into the WHL and were cut and played for BCHL, AJHL, SJHL teams. Of course any of them would take an NCAA offer to keep playing but none of them ever made it further. Some even had to go the CIS route because even the NCAA didn't want them.

 

[Breakers]

People comparing CHL training facilities to NCAA

It's not even close.

 

[Breakers]

Major junior is the best development league in North America. This isn't up for debate. The USHL, NTDP and NCAA are all intertwined, but they come a distant second.

Junior A is several rungs below Major Junior. It's like the USHL and the NAHL. Night and day.

You are literally comparing apples to oranges.
The CHL is 60 teams. The USHL is 17.

So it would sense to compare the USHL to an individual league, like the QMJHL for instance.

Total USHL drafted players in 2016 = 32 (+15 Alumni)
Total QMJHL drafted players in 2016 = 14
Total OHL drafted players in 2016 = 48
Total WHL drafted players in 2016 = 34