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CXLVII - Is this the 'Final Countdown' in Arizona?

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Ciao said:
@Warden of the North --- You're probably much more up-to-date on the current situation than I am. I've never been to Phoenix and I'm not really able to follow the coverations about this neighbourhood or that, much less the travel times etc.

My commute to downtown Toronto is nearly hours each way, three time a week, but I still get to as many Leafs and Blue Jay games as I can afford. Not many Leafs games. Quite a few Blue Jays games. The difference in cost is significant.

I would imagine that almost every other big-league market deals with similar issues about commuting times and expense.

From what I'm reading here, and from very far away, it sort of looks like a circular firing squad within the Greater Phoenix Area as to where and how to host an NHL franchise. I'm sure the market is fine. I'm not sure they will come up with the right place and conditions to find an arena.

Maybe the right place already exists?

If not, it seems like finding and acre of land between the salt water and the sea strands.

BTW @awfulwaffle , I don't really buy the idea that the hockey team and arena is just a viable loss-leader for some other type of investment or real estate development. I'm not there, as you are, but businesses usually offload or close down their unprofitable enterprises before too long. If a self-made billionaire really wants a hotel, casino, condos type of deal then that's what usually happens without an anchor attached, that would soon enough get thrown overboard anyway. Not to say the Coyotes would actually be an anchor -- really, they should be quite profitable in a market like Phoenix, Arizona -- but the loss-leader idea just doesn't make much sense to me.
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And this is why these threads stay open, because it's the same stuff over and over and over again. It's been regurgitated multiple times why Muerelo might want a district instead of just the team itself.
 
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Yukon Joe said:
Hey has anyone out there watched the Canadian movie Blackberry?

en.wikipedia.org

BlackBerry (film) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

It's apparently a biopic-comedy about the rise and fall of Blackberry, but it does include a couple of scenes about Balsillie's attempt to purchase the Penguins and the Coyotes.

As far as I can tell it's for rent on all major streaming platforms. It's free on Crave TV (Canada only), and an extended mini-series length version is available on CBC Gem (free with ads, only in Canada, but a VPN might work to get around the geo-lock).

I kind of want to watch it - I mean Gary Bettman is even a (minor) character in the movie!
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I’ve watched it. It’s not too bad. Kinda funny. Has Glen Howerton from its always sunny in Philadelphia.
 
If this was a fake year, with the backup plan to relocate for the start of the 2024/2025 season in the new location, but it was too late to announce after the Tempe plan failed last summer, and this entire past few months just theatre to keep ticket sales up, we should have some rumblings soon or even already.

(Those in the know in Winnipeg were making noise about the potential relocation on New Year's Day 2011 - And that deal was incredibly last-second.) I guess it is possible it's more low-key in a less hockey mad market, and easier to keep a potential deal buttoned up.

The Tempe option was probably their best shot at an arena - I would have supported it for my local municipality - and it was resoundingly defeated.

I'm now fairly certain at this point next year will be a repeat of this year - Just based on there being no other viable option. And since I also have doubts they'll pull an Arizona arena out of their hat, this is as uncertain I've ever been about the medium-term future of this team. Even in the "15-minutes away" meeting, there was a concrete plan if the Arizona option had unexpectedly dried up.
 
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Tom ServoMST3K said:
If this was a fake year, with the backup plan to relocate for the start of the 2024/2025 season in the new location, but it was too late to announce after the Tempe plan failed last summer, and this entire past few months just theatre to keep ticket sales up, we should have some rumblings soon or even already.

(Those in the know in Winnipeg were making noise about the potential relocation on New Year's Day 2011 - And that deal was incredibly last-second.) I guess it is possible it's more low-key in a less hockey mad market, and easier to keep a potential deal buttoned up.

The Tempe option was probably their best shot at an arena - I would have supported it for my local municipality - and it was resoundingly defeated.

I'm now fairly certain at this point next year will be a repeat of this year - Just based on there being no other viable option. And since I also have doubts they'll pull an Arizona arena out of their hat, this is as uncertain I've ever been about the medium-term future of this team. Even in the "15-minutes away" meeting, there was a concrete plan if the Arizona option had unexpectedly dried up.
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This was the latest news posted a on January 6 by @Llama19:
Coyotes on ‘precipice’ of announcing location organization will focus on for new arena

To quote:

"The Arizona Coyotes are close to announcing a location the organization will focus on for its new arena, president and CEO Xavier Gutierrez told Arizona Sports’ Burns & Gambo on Friday.

“We still envision this to be a landmark project, privately funded, we’re gonna buy the land and build the buildings and maintain them ourselves like we’ve said all along,” he added.

He said on Friday the goal remains to have a deal done by the end of the season.

“We did commit to the NHL that by the end of this season we would have this in place,” Gutierrez said. “But the first step is to just make that public announcement of saying ‘Here’s the location, here’s the project, here’s the deal,’ and then get it done and closed by the end of the season. That’s still our timeline.”"

Source (Audio): arizonasports.com/story/3540916/coyotes-precipice-announcing-location-organization-focus-new-arena/
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Does anyone know if there's been anymore on this?
 
rojac said:
This was the latest news posted a on January 6 by @Llama19:


Does anyone know if there's been anymore on this?
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The only thing that has occurred...that is tangible...
is there has been...none...not-ta...zip...
new state land/s listed for auction...
on the Arizona State Land Department's website...
if that north Phoenix/Scottsdale/Desert Ridge location rumor is true...

Which is quite curious...since we had that ‘precipice’ announcement...

By all appearances...those plans...may have fallen...over that same 'precipice'...
 
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Tom ServoMST3K said:
If this was a fake year, with the backup plan to relocate for the start of the 2024/2025 season in the new location, but it was too late to announce after the Tempe plan failed last summer, and this entire past few months just theatre to keep ticket sales up, we should have some rumblings soon or even already.

(Those in the know in Winnipeg were making noise about the potential relocation on New Year's Day 2011 - And that deal was incredibly last-second.) I guess it is possible it's more low-key in a less hockey mad market, and easier to keep a potential deal buttoned up.

The Tempe option was probably their best shot at an arena - I would have supported it for my local municipality - and it was resoundingly defeated.

I'm now fairly certain at this point next year will be a repeat of this year - Just based on there being no other viable option. And since I also have doubts they'll pull an Arizona arena out of their hat, this is as uncertain I've ever been about the medium-term future of this team. Even in the "15-minutes away" meeting, there was a concrete plan if the Arizona option had unexpectedly dried up.
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Completely agree that next year will be a repeat of this year. But if AM is able to absorb the losses, keeping the Coyotes alive for another year and another round of searching/planning/promoting a new arena isn't necessarily a bad thing.
 
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Llama19 said:
The only thing that has occurred...that is tangible...
is there has been...none...not-ta...zip...
new state land/s listed for auction...
on the Arizona State Land Department's website...
if that north Phoenix/Scottsdale/Desert Ridge location rumor is true...

Which is quite curious...since we had that ‘precipice’ announcement...

By all appearances...those plans...may have fallen...over that same 'precipice'...
Click to expand...

Build the arena, AM!

kick-the-football-charlie-brown-9781481462099_hr.jpg
 
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LadyStanley said:
Land Coyotes inerested in going to auction
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If there's a particular piece of land the Coyotes want, they're the ones who have to work with the state to do all the studies etc. to bring it to auction. Which can take one or more years.

Brookfield for years worked with state officials to bring the land to auction and helped structure the deal's unique financing terms, and arguably stands to benefit most from the sale.
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Sahid said it takes about 12 months from start to finish for an auction to occur.

"Many of the studies are performed by the applicant, so the timeline varies depending on the applicant," she said.
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So given that we're only a half-year from the failure of the Tempe vote it *could* be plausible that Alex/Xavier are doing the required work and expect the auction to go down sometime over summer 2024.

or they simply know there's a parcel in the pipeline they are interested in.

Currently, there are applications active at Vistancia in Peoria, Desert Ridge for retail and homebuilding as well as north Phoenix for commercial and homebuilding projects, she said.
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in any event as I've posted on this before that given the valley's ever dwindling land availability these auctions are no joke.

Two healthcare companies spite-bid each other to the tune of $84,000,000 for a 48 acre parcel in the area Meruelo is looking at and also in the area Mayo Clinic paid* over $100,000,000 for the 228 acre parcel next to their campus.

So to say the least this is an incredibly risky maneuver for someone like Alex to have this be his plan to save the Coyotes.

I'm excited to watch it play out though :popcorn:
 
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The Business of Sports: New era of media consumption pivotal for Arizona's pro teams

To quote:

"Eight months ago, Tempe residents voted down the Coyotes' plans to build a multibillion entertainment district that would have created the long-term new home of the team along with hotels, restaurants, offices and thousands of new apartment units. While the team has maintained it would like to remain in Arizona for the long haul, the exact location of a future full-time home remains unclear.

[CEO Xavier] Gutierrez reiterated the commitment to the market by owner Alex Meruelo and said at the panel that the Coyotes have narrowed down one site in particular the team would like to pursue, but he did not go into specifics, other than to say the team's goal is to build an arena along with other amenities to create an entertainment district around the venue. He added that the goal is to avoid subjecting an upcoming arena project to a public vote.

"Our goal is to be here," he said. "[The Valley] is a sports town and hockey town as well."

The Coyotes have said they expect to have a deal in place for a permanent arena solution by the end of Q1 2024, according to previous Business Journal reporting."

Source (Paywall): www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/news/2024/01/17/pbj-business-sports-panel-discussion.html
 
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Coyotedroppings said:
That's quite ominous. I've been told verbally that the land in N Phx is indeed up for auction, but have seen no such proof. I question the verbalists as to why (if it was up for auction) does XG continues to move the goalposts on a date of any announcement?
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There is only one auction up on their website currently...but it is the I-17/303 area...

1705869694435.png

The postings parameters are...an auction is posted...at least 90 days prior...to the actual auction...

At that rate...even if this North Phoenix/Scottsdale/Desert Ridge location is the one...its posting would have to be soon...as the auction...would be well after the end of this season...
 
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Llama19 said:
There is only one auction up on their website currently...but it is the I-17/303 area...

View attachment 807618
The postings parameters are...an auction is posted...at least 90 days prior...to the actual auction...

At that rate...even if this North Phoenix/Scottsdale/Desert Ridge location is the one...its posting would have to be soon...as the auction...would be well after the end of this season...
Click to expand...
Considering this:
If there's a particular piece of land the Coyotes want, they're the ones who have to work with the state to do all the studies etc. to bring it to auction.
It would not surprise me if XG has naively thought he’s been “on the precipice” multiple times.

XG, AM’s greatest mistake.
 
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Coyotedroppings said:
Considering this:
If there's a particular piece of land the Coyotes want, they're the ones who have to work with the state to do all the studies etc. to bring it to auction.
It would not surprise me if XG has naively thought he’s been “on the precipice” multiple times.

XG, AM’s greatest mistake.
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Not talking in public at all and delegating it all is a huge mistake.
 
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aqib said:
Not talking in public at all and delegating it all is a huge mistake.
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There’s a very course line between what is currently being communicated and going full Anthony LeBlanc, that would be most welcome.
As for delegating, I certainly wouldn’t be delegating to XG, seems merely flashing pseudo California smiles and talking bs isn’t working with the bureaucrats.
 
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Coyotedroppings said:
There’s a very course line between what is currently being communicated and going full Anthony LeBlanc, that would be welcome.
As for delegating, I certainly wouldn’t be delegating to XG, seems merely flashing pseudo California smiles and talking bs isn’t working with the bureaucrats.
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Unfortunately it speaks volumes about Mureulo himself for him to choose someone so obviously disingenuous & transparent as XG to be the face of the franchise.
 
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