CXLIV - The Tempe era set to begin as ASU opens Mullett Arena

[Devils 3silverones]

Aside, I was suprised to discover two weeks ago Edmonton doesn't have Lyft (does have Uber). Apparently Lyft is only in Vancouver, Ottawa, GTA.

Aside, it is amazing how people get around... The amount of travelling people do... With no Lyft.

 

[MNNumbers]

Tempe city council tonight approved the resolution 7-0 to hold the special election in May of ‘23.

Please tell us what is meant by "Hold the special election?" Are they calling for it themselves, or merely reserving a place for it on the ballot?

 

[TheLegend]

Please tell us what is meant by "Hold the special election?" Are they calling for it themselves, or merely reserving a place for it on the ballot?

My understanding is they’re only calling for a special election. It’s necessary because it requires 180 days advanced notice if you need to hold one.

As of now there is nothing to vote on. That may come later if (or when) they adopt another resolution approving the TED proposal.

The city can then chose at that time to put the referendum on the ballot themselves OR a citizen’s group can petition for one.

This was just setting the date in case it’s needed and May ‘23 is the earliest they can hold one. Otherwise you’re looking at between August and November 2023 and the Coyotes need a final answer sooner than that.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Aside, it is amazing how people get around... The amount of travelling people do... With no Lyft.

(The thing about Uber/Lyft for me is how their drivers can't act like...well...taxi drivers. Act like an entitled jerk and you won't have a job very long as a rideshare driver. I'd taken maybe 3 taxis in 20 years before they came along. Would do anything to avoid, including a walk or ride a bus.)

 

[Devils 3silverones]

(The thing about Uber/Lyft for me is how their drivers can't act like...well...taxi drivers. Act like an entitled jerk and you won't have a job very long as a rideshare driver. I'd taken maybe 3 taxis in 20 years before they came along. Would do anything to avoid, including a walk or ride a bus.)

Your choices of transportation are up to you. I dunno.

My understanding is they’re only calling for a special election. It’s necessary because it requires 180 days advanced notice if you need to hold one.

As of now there is nothing to vote on. That may come later if (or when) they adopt another resolution approving the TED proposal.

The city can then chose at that time to put the referendum on the ballot themselves OR a citizen’s group can petition for one.

This was just setting the date in case it’s needed and May ‘23 is the earliest they can hold one. Otherwise you’re looking at between August and November 2023 and the Coyotes need a final answer sooner than that.

I'd like CF on this.. I get it but...

 

[TheLegend]

Your choices of transportation are up to you. I dunno.


I'd like CF on this.. I get it but...

Actually, so would I.

Might see him once we get more details of the proposal.

 

[Devils 3silverones]

Actually, so would I.

Might see him once we get more details of the proposal.

The small ( HUGE) things we miss..

 

[Llama19]

Tempe Entertainment District: City Council votes to put project on May 2023 ballot

To quote:

"The project, which contains a new home for the Arizona Coyotes and an entertainment district, will be put to Tempe voters, contingent on the project receiving approval from city officials."

Source (Video): www.fox10phoenix.com/video/1141918

 

[TheLegend]

Listened to the PHNX_Coyotes post game podcast a little bit ago and their reporter who covered tonight's city council meeting joined them and his is what I got from it.

- The public referendum request came from the Coyotes. Not the city council as some have presumed.

- Tempe and the Coyotes are hoping to release information on the proposal soon. Tempe is hoping to have information of the proposal available on their website and the Coyotes will also be doing the same. I am presuming this will happen prior to the Nov. 29th meeting.

- There were two possible dates they could have chosen. One in May and/or one in August.

- Both parties preferred May for a couple of reasons. One of course was to get the project rolling ASAP, The other was more residents are away in August than in May. And that includes ASU students, who will also be able to participate. Both Tempe and the Coyotes seem to want maximum participation in this.

- Talks have been continually going on between Tempe and Phoenix. No idea to the nature of it but they are talking.

 

[TheLegend]

 

[PredsHead]

I can't imagine the Coyotes are asking for a referendum if the prime interest rate is still at ~3.5%....

 

[Boris Zubov]

It is legitimately true. Does Uber exist in Canadian NHL (or potential) markets? It's $90 to the game, and like $145 after the game

there is legit a website to see my whole "North Korea nuclear arsenal" thing. I'm not waxing poetic here.

I used to 100% agree that Quebec deserved a team and Phoenix did not.... UNTIL I LIVED HERE and saw how freaking ridiculous it was to get to freaking Glendale! (Again, QC and PHX aren't competing, they should both have teams)

And now I still believe Quebec deserves a team, but also that anyone talking smack of Arizona needs to STFU, because they don't know anything. The Coyotes have never had a chance. And as someone who saw Quebec, Minnesota and Quebec lose a team for having and old arena that wasn't replaced and being an Islanders fan who saw my team just needing an new arena in a right place for 30 years... and just now getting it and jumping to #10 in franchise values...

The Coyotes deserve a chance to sink or swim in ideal conditions. If they don't get an arena deal done in Tempe, move 'em. If they get the arena done and can't be out of the bottom 5 in revenues, move 'em.

But they've never been in an actual NHL arena, in their actual metro arena, (effing) EVER.

I understand your point, but your argument is flawed. Half the Valley will still have to travel to games & now the west side fans will get to make the commute & sit in traffic. The notion that more fans live on the east side seems bogus...they're just the ones who bitched the most because the arena was in Glendale. The new location may be a blessing for some fans, but it's not the cure all this market needs. It's a fair weather fan-base to begin with & the team has sucked for way too long. I really respect the Yotes fans on these boards & especially the guys in Forum 40. They're loyal, extremely passionate & they deserve to keep their team....the biggest problem is, there's simply not enough of them in the region. 6M people in the metro area, yet they only average 11,000 viewers per game on local TV broadcasts.

And before you tell me I don't understand Phoenix blah blah blah, I lived in Vegas for over a decade & would drive to Phoenix multiple times a year for business. I've been all over the Valley, so I've dealt with the traffic headaches. Plenty of fans from all over the country, including Long Island, travel further than 70 minutes to go see their teams play. I live in Central Connecticut now & it's 125 minutes to MSG or 100 minutes to Boston. I've done both in the past year.

Or you get an old guy to sit outside the library in killer heat to collect signatures.

No killer heat in December in the Phoenix area...it's actually the perfect time of year to sit outside the local library.

 

[Stumbledore]

No killer heat in December in the Phoenix area...it's actually the perfect time of year to sit outside the local library.

True, but I was alluding to something a long time ago. Well, longer than 2 weeks anyway...

 

[mouser]

I understand your point, but your argument is flawed. Half the Valley will still have to travel to games & now the west side fans will get to make the commute & sit in traffic. The notion that more fans live on the east side seems bogus...they're just the ones who bitched the most because the arena was in Glendale. The new location may be a blessing for some fans, but it's not the cure all this market needs. It's a fair weather fan-base to begin with & the team has sucked for way too long. I really respect the Yotes fans on these boards & especially the guys in Forum 40. They're loyal, extremely passionate & they deserve to keep their team....the biggest problem is, there's simply not enough of them in the region. 6M people in the metro area, yet they only average 11,000 viewers per game on local TV broadcasts.

And before you tell me I don't understand Phoenix blah blah blah, I lived in Vegas for over a decade & would drive to Phoenix multiple times a year for business. I've been all over the Valley, so I've dealt with the traffic headaches. Plenty of fans from all over the country, including Long Island, travel further than 70 minutes to go see their teams play. I live in Central Connecticut now & it's 125 minutes to MSG or 100 minutes to Boston. I've done both in the past year.


No killer heat in December in the Phoenix area...it's actually the perfect time of year to sit outside the local library.

Yes west side fans will have a longer commute. A large portion of that commute will be in the opposite direction of the primary rush hour traffic flow though. It simply distills down to Tempe being a much more central location then Glendale, with better freeway access from multiple directions, plus public transit options (light rail, streetcar) that don’t exist in Glendale.

The worst drive from the west valley to Tempe should be markedly better than the current worst drive from the east valley to Glendale.

 

[TheLegend]

Yes west side fans will have a longer commute. A large portion of that commute will be in the opposite direction of the primary rush hour traffic flow though. It simply distills down to Tempe being a much more central location then Glendale, with better freeway access from multiple directions, plus public transit options (light rail, streetcar) that don’t exist in Glendale.

The worst drive from the west valley to Tempe should be markedly better than the current worst drive from the east valley to Glendale.

Speaking from experience… it will. The I-10 inbound from the west is great until you hit the downtown core. It’s only about 6 miles of outbound traffic to Tempe from that point, and there are options.

Going the other way it’s 15 miles worth of outbound to Glendale.

The worst would be getting there from the Peoria-Surprise area. There’s two options there but the longest route (Loop 101 >> Loop 202) might be the better of the two.

 

[mouser]

Speaking from experience… it will. The I-10 inbound from the west is great until you hit the downtown core. It’s only about 6 miles of outbound traffic to Tempe from that point, and there are options.

Going the other way it’s 15 miles worth of outbound to Glendale.

The worst would be getting there from the Peoria-Surprise area. There’s two options there but the longest route (Loop 101 >> Loop 202) might be the better of the two.

The I-10 Broadway curve project will hopefully improve that last 6 miles of commute from the west side to Tempe. Construction started last year, finished in 2024.

Should greatly improve traffic flow through the corridor connecting I-10, I-17, 60, 143, 202, and everything feeding into that traffic artery.

They have six lanes recently opened now in parts of the I-10 south of Baseline. Can see a big difference there.

About This Project – I-10 Broadway Curve Improvement Project

i10broadwaycurve.com

 

[GordonGraham]

6 more months of delay so another year in the peewee arena

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

6 more months of delay so another year in the peewee arena

3 more as co-tenants

 

[TheLegend]

6 more months of delay so another year in the peewee arena

They had the optional fourth year for a reason.

Even so they could move mid-season if the arena was ready. Just like they did when they moved out to Glendale.

 

[Crescent Street]

I have been very removed from the Yotes situation for a while now. Can someone explain how there is still viability for them to remain where they are and not be sold and relocated to some place like Houston? I understand it's not as easy as just pick up and move somewhere. I had thought at one time the league's interest in AZ was to secure a SW TV market. Now that Vegas has really taken off and should secure the SW market, is this still the end game for AZ and the league?

 

[Dirty Old Man]

I have been very removed from the Yotes situation for a while now. Can someone explain how there is still viability for them to remain where they are and not be sold and relocated to some place like Houston? I understand it's not as easy as just pick up and move somewhere. I had thought at one time the league's interest in AZ was to secure a SW TV market. Now that Vegas has really taken off and should secure the SW market, is this still the end game for AZ and the league?

So your initial idea of "the SW market" is an error. Your assumptions likely only get worse from there. Phoenix is ~3 times the size of Vegas and almost as far from Vegas as LA. But Vegas is growing rapidly, too, and will start overtaking some markets further east.

In Houston, you've got one guy to sell a team to, and it's established he doesn't wanna pay the going rate. So that's not happening.

The Coyotes are viable in Arizona as long as they have an owner that wants them there. And they do. Full stop.

 

[Crescent Street]

So your initial idea of "the SW market" is an error. Your assumptions likely only get worse from there. Phoenix is ~3 times the size of Vegas and almost as far from Vegas as LA. But Vegas is growing rapidly, too, and will start overtaking some markets further east.

In Houston, you've got one guy to sell a team to, and it's established he doesn't wanna pay the going rate. So that's not happening.

The Coyotes are viable in Arizona as long as they have an owner that wants them there. And they do. Full stop.

Could probably do without the subtle tone of attitude. I was genuinely asking a question, because I'm genuinely curious and don't know the latest. Appreciate the explanation, however. Though I remember the talk at the very beginning of the franchise- wasn't the entire point of having a team in AZ to grow the SW tv market to secure sizable national tv deals. That's completely wrong?

 

[MNNumbers]

Could probably do without the subtle tone of attitude. I was genuinely asking a question, because I'm genuinely curious and don't know the latest. Appreciate the explanation, however. Though I remember the talk at the very beginning of the franchise- wasn't the entire point of having a team in AZ to grow the SW tv market to secure sizable national tv deals. That's completely wrong?

I think the thought at the beginning was that the Winnipeg Jets had to land somewhere, and there first choice (Minneapolis) fell through for lack of $$ from the government. Considering how things have gone since, the amount they would have lost waiting for the Xcel Energy Center to be built (assuming it still would have been - full disclosure, it was not planned at the time), would have been small compared to the losses in the PHX area. So, lacking Minneapolis, the teama went to Phoenix as a renter from the Suns downtown.

I couldn't tell you how the league spun that move, but that is the reality of how it came to be. Since then, mostly bad moves in ownership and a very unfortunate recession have doomed the franchise to it financial losses, and that is the reason Meruelo wants to build a large development with the arena as part of it in Tempe.

 

[Crescent Street]

I think the thought at the beginning was that the Winnipeg Jets had to land somewhere, and there first choice (Minneapolis) fell through for lack of $$ from the government. Considering how things have gone since, the amount they would have lost waiting for the Xcel Energy Center to be built (assuming it still would have been - full disclosure, it was not planned at the time), would have been small compared to the losses in the PHX area. So, lacking Minneapolis, the teama went to Phoenix as a renter from the Suns downtown.

I couldn't tell you how the league spun that move, but that is the reality of how it came to be. Since then, mostly bad moves in ownership and a very unfortunate recession have doomed the franchise to it financial losses, and that is the reason Meruelo wants to build a large development with the arena as part of it in Tempe.

Thank you for this explanation. Had totally forgotten about the Minneapolis thing.

 

[TheLegend]

Could probably do without the subtle tone of attitude. I was genuinely asking a question, because I'm genuinely curious and don't know the latest. Appreciate the explanation, however. Though I remember the talk at the very beginning of the franchise- wasn't the entire point of having a team in AZ to grow the SW tv market to secure sizable national tv deals. That's completely wrong?

To somewhat add to what MNN said…. Minnesota was the original destination.

After the Minnesota plan fell apart the Jets had no place to go. Bettman needed to find a home in short order and he knew Phoenix Suns owner Jerry Colangelo from his days as an assistant commissioner in the NBA.

So it wasn’t a matter opportunity as it was to find a quick solution.