Confirmed with Link: Craig Berube named the 32nd Coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs

[CincoHolio]

No way Mitch gets even 12 mil on his next contract. Just because he was erroneously tied to Auston's salary in the past, doesn't mean it is meant to or will continue.

 

[Drytoast]

Mitch can get 12 somewhere else. Not interested in paying him 12. Would rather pay two solid players each 6.

 

[Confucius]

And then when the playoffs start and the pressure rises, he starts to fade away. For someone like you who doesn't care about the playoffs that might be acceptable, but for 99.99+% of fans, it is not.

Maybe they ask him to play a different style? Hyman, Kadri and others seem to do well once they have a different coach. As I’ve said numerous times everybody disappears on this coached team not just Marner.

Keefe got beat, team went away from their strengths to play some defensive playoff style. Should have just kept on with what got them there.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Maybe they ask him to play a different style? Hyman, Kadri and others seem to do well once they have a different coach. As I’ve said numerous times everybody disappears on this coached team not just Marner.

I don't think Marner is capable of playing a different style.

As for everybody disappearing, that's just not true. And LOL at blaming Marner's disappearing act on coaching.

 

[Confucius]

I don't think Marner is capable of playing a different style.

As for everybody disappearing, that's just not true. And LOL at blaming Marner's disappearing act on coaching.

I see

 

[Nineteen67]

If they acquire a couple of quality D that can skate and pass the puck it’ll go a long way in making the coach look good. Get some excellent goaltending and the coach will look great.

I don't think Marner is capable of playing a different style.

As for everybody disappearing, that's just not true. And LOL at blaming Marner's disappearing act on coaching.

The media is to blame.

 

[Gary Nylund]

If they acquire a couple of quality D that can skate and pass the puck it’ll go a long way in making the coach look good. Get some excellent goaltending and the coach will look great.


The media is to blame.

Phew, that's a relief - so many have said that the fans are to blame that I was starting to feel like I should have done more.

 

[Niagara Bill]

Maybe they ask him to play a different style? Hyman, Kadri and others seem to do well once they have a different coach. As I’ve said numerous times everybody disappears on this coached team not just Marner.

Keefe got beat, team went away from their strengths to play some defensive playoff style. Should have just kept on with what got them there.

I can see that. But what started out to be a more run and gun style was not supported by GM. JT nit capable, 3rd and 4th lines not capable. Keefe certainly was confused by what he wanted, tried and failed.
I got the sense management was never on same page. They never saw that Reilly was not Coffey, they wanted Sandin to be Bourque, never was.
Or you could be 100% right, this coach couldn't coach them. We shall see.

 

[Evilhomer]

If they acquire a couple of quality D that can skate and pass the puck it’ll go a long way in making the coach look good. Get some excellent goaltending and the coach will look great.

This is exactly right.

 

[The Shrike]

Why did the rebuild need to be sped up?

Seems to me it was a pretty bad idea that led to poor asset management for most of Dubas' tenure as he kept doubling down and adding past their prime vets.. But the rookie GM needed to feed his ego right off the bat.

It was sped up because a star centre was available, and strength is built from the middle.

The initial decision to sign him was sound, the poor asset management came later when it was obvious that Covid was going to flat line the cap for years. At that point, with the wingers in the core four not yet signed with NMC's, they should have bit down and traded one of them to create the cap flexibility needed to firm up the defense.

 

[Nineteen67]

It was sped up because a star centre was available, and strength is built from the middle.

The initial decision to sign him was sound, the poor asset management came later when it was obvious that Covid was going to flat line the cap for years. At that point, with the wingers in the core four not yet signed with NMC's, they should have bit down and traded one of them to create the cap flexibility needed to firm up the defense.

When they signed JT they were yrs away from competing for championships. At the time, many predicted they’d be exactly where they are.

 

[The Shrike]

When they signed JT they were yrs away from competing for championships. At the time, many predicted they’d be exactly where they are.

They were closer than you think. Managements subsequent inability to adjust to the flat cap is what led them to where they are.

 

[Da Mash]

Before the Cup run, Blues was a lot like Leafs, they seemed like they can do well but just fell short.
The year after the Cup run was COVID/lockdown and they were pretty good before the lockdown and some might say they can repeat. Also they lost Jay to heart attack before the lockdown that year.
Post COViD year, they lost Pietra to Vegas. In a way, they lost their top pairing Dmen and never recovered from it. Then Vince Dunn to Seattle later that year.
Now I am not saying Berube is some sort of genius but there are circumstances that needed to be consider after their Cup run.

Yeah … It was kinda my point. He took a hot goalie and nice roster to the cup and the roster changed and the goalie didn’t stand on his head and the losses piled up in playoffs.

Did he fail to make his players accountable after the cup run?

Even hard nosed coaches need talent and a goalie and some luck

 

[Nineteen67]

They were closer than you think. Managements subsequent inability to adjust to the flat cap is what led them to where they are.

I’ve never been surprised at the results. This is the only year I missed my playoff prediction, I thought they would beat Boston. Yes, I had them losing to that team out east and the play in series.

 

[arso40]

It was sped up because a star centre was available, and strength is built from the middle.

The initial decision to sign him was sound, the poor asset management came later when it was obvious that Covid was going to flat line the cap for years. At that point, with the wingers in the core four not yet signed with NMC's, they should have bit down and traded one of them to create the cap flexibility needed to firm up the defense.

The only problem is if they were sharp Willie woulda got traded for an okay return and we'd be stucc paying marner whatever he wants on the next deal and be a lesser team for it

 

[notDatsyuk]

do i have to recap the entire season for you ?

- Willie got off to a blistering hot pace and CARRIED JT to a good start ,
- Willie cooled off and Johnny production went into the tank
- Johnny was moved to the 3rd line to get easier matchups but tanked the line and whoever he played with
- Johnny was moved back up into the top 6 and the first pp unit to pad his starts because he started to whine and cry
- playoffs came and post season Johnny showed up which means he was mediocre to bad as usual

but this being said , for the 15th season in a row it's not JT's fault , it's his teammates/coach/fans/media/injuries/new father/owners/weather/cra's fault Johnny failed yet again

That's an interesting version of the season, but none of it supports the idea that Mitch carried JT.

Yes, JT was mediocre in the playoffs (which I said), but better than Mitch in the playoffs.

I'm not blaming anyone else for JT's play, but I'm not crediting anyone else for his play either.

I'm one of the people who has been saying all along that JT isn't as good as some people think, and I've been adamant that his signing was a huge mistake, but he's still a decent, if fading, player.

What I would absolutely love is a player with JT's shot and drive and physicality, and Mitch's skating.

 

[notDatsyuk]

who their right mind would believe Mitch will come in at 7/8m ? if he was a ufa now he'd easily have a lineup of teams offering him min 10 plus

i can get ''appropriate pieces'' easily , what hard to get is elite pieces and there's a fine line between making the playoffs consistently like the Leafs have been doing and looking at teams like the Wings/Sabres/Sens who all have talent and wondering what's keeping them on the outside looking in

what doesn't work is having to consistently make excuses for a player your paying an 8 digit salary too , if your players level of play matches there salaries it's very doable to carry high salaried players

Glad you're finally agreeing.

We have to stop making excuses for Mitch - unless he starts earning his 8 digit salary or takes a big cut (which as you say, is unbelievable), we should try to trade him for what we can get.

We have to suffer with JT's salary one more year, then it will either disappear (my preference) or become appropriate.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Gonna be an interesting few months with Tre's new Berube's lumberjack team .. we are gonna get a big nasty fast hard *ss defense core .. Mitch is gone .. likely Rielly too .. CAP will finally move to D men and we won't score like we used to in regular season but with Matty, Willy and Cowan we will score enough to make playoffs which is all that is required .. we are building a playoff team with big fast nasty D and W's .. who knows if Tre can pull off da trades but da mission is on da right track

 

[notDatsyuk]

Mitch can get 12 somewhere else. Not interested in paying him 12. Would rather pay two solid players each 6.

I'm not sure he gets 12 somewhere else, but I don't want him getting it here.

 

[TS Quint]

And then when the playoffs start and the pressure rises, he starts to fade away. For someone like you who doesn't care about the playoffs that might be acceptable, but for 99.99+% of fans, it is not.

Why is Marner the only one getting the blame for their playoffs. Matthews is just as bad if not worse but he doesn't seem to get any heat for it, just a lot of excuses. When it comes down to it he's the league's highest paid player shouldn't the expectation be near McDavid level?

 

[nuck]

It was sped up because a star centre was available, and strength is built from the middle.

The initial decision to sign him was sound, the poor asset management came later when it was obvious that Covid was going to flat line the cap for years. At that point, with the wingers in the core four not yet signed with NMC's, they should have bit down and traded one of them to create the cap flexibility needed to firm up the defense.

The initial decision to talk to him may have been sound but paying $11M when his opposite number Stamkos signed for $8.5M was completely unnecessary. Just because you can find a way to make the money work doesn't mean you pay whatever it takes, especially when you already have two 30g centers but you have a defense anchored by Rielly and Gardiner. Having AM and NK already was strength down the middle.

JT was a 35g scorer and Kadri was a 32g scorer whose production plummeted (inevitably) when he was pushed down. Even if they actually needed two #1 centers the logical next step would have been to deal Nazim immediately for D when his value was at its peak. If you have JT you don't need Naz right? If Tavares had that year 1 success every year you have still made Kadri into a 15 goal scorer by taking away his opportunities.

KD bought somebody he didn't really need, and he overpaid, and he kept the center he had just made surplus rather than look at other areas of need. Just wanting to add JT didn't mean he had to ignore all the ripples it would make.

And then as you say he got raw dogged by the big three on their contracts. Willie should have been dealt before he missed game 1 because there is no way pre breakout Mitch is asking for $10M+. Bad decisions tied to more bad decisions and some bad luck and the next 5 years are spent trying to mitigate those mistakes.

Kyle had the fantasy of an overwhelming 80s Oilers blitzkreig attack where the D were just guys who would help the Big 4 reload to storm the net. How else to explain the lack of attention to D upgrades for years? And he desperately kept his Big 4 together and rode that ship down which was his final and greatest error, (even more than his loyalty to Sheldon).

 

[Sypher04]

Why is Marner the only one getting the blame for their playoffs. Matthews is just as bad if not worse but he doesn't seem to get any heat for it, just a lot of excuses. When it comes down to it he's the league's highest paid player shouldn't the expectation be near McDavid level?

Marner in no way is the only one getting blame. That’s a complete fallacy. Deserved or not, he gets it the worst for a multitude of reasons that have hurt his likability the last several years, including the belief that he is the most egregiously overpaid between the big 3

 

[TS Quint]

No way Mitch gets even 12 mil on his next contract. Just because he was erroneously tied to Auston's salary in the past, doesn't mean it is meant to or will continue.

Is there any reason he should get less than Nylander? Even this year, Nylander's best year, Marner had a better PPG.

 

[Trapper]

Why is Marner the only one getting the blame for their playoffs. Matthews is just as bad if not worse but he doesn't seem to get any heat for it, just a lot of excuses. When it comes down to it he's the league's highest paid player shouldn't the expectation be near McDavid level?

Go back over the threads for the last 8 years. They all get it.
How many times was Nylander traded in the past.
Matthews deserve his share of the blame but as of right now, he’s not going anywhere.
Nylander just signed for 8 years. If you think you can get a blow the doors off return for him, fine.
Tavares is gone in a year.
That leaves Marner now and there are many things (listed here) that aren’t great about his playoff game either. Add to that he probably wants to be paid more the Nylander, he should be out now.
Retool around the 2 forwards. Matthews and Nylander. Build from the net out and build a harder playoff style.
These 4 together have shown they can’t get it done postseason. Plenty of sample size. As a group, they aren’t built for the playoffs.

 

[TS Quint]

Marner in no way is the only one getting blame. That’s a completely fallacy. He gets it the worst for a multitude of reasons that have hurt his likability the last several years, starting with the belief that he is the most egregiously overpaid between the big 3

Ok, im just not seeing it in many posts I guess.

Marner consistently out produces Nylander. How is he worse than Nylander? Matthews is just as bad in the Playoffs and if you want to talk salary he is the highest paid player in the league. But it seems like people are acting like Marner is far behind the other two even though he has more playoff points than Matthews or Nylander in their careers.

Between the 3 they all kinda do the same thing but the vast majority of posts single out Marner And overall people seem pretty ok with Nylander and Matthews. I'm just interested in why he's getting singled out. Is there something specific that applies to him that doesn't apply to Mathews or Nylander?