Speculation: Coyotes 2021 Offseason Roster Discussion Thread #2

[rt]

So does Sean Monahan. What do we add for a swap besides taking on Lucic?

Man, that's tough to figure. I don't rate Monahan much about Schmaltz, honestly. What kind of trade value does Monahan have? About a late 1st, maybe? I imagine Lucic has negative trade value of about a 1st or early 2nd? I feel like Monahan+Lucic is about a net-zero kind of package. I feel like OEL+Fischer is about a net-zero, also. So if the Flames lose Giordano to Seattle, and want a replacement, and are looking to move on from Monahan, I guess maybe this makes sense? That's a helluva lotta "ifs", though.

 

[Dead Coyote]

Why is it time to give Hayton a spot? He didn’t even perform in the AHL.

Because it's his draft +3 year and he's never had a chance playing with high end talent for a significant amount of time and I don't want another Strome situation on our hands. If he does suck and won't amount to anything, we need to improve his value. If he doesn't suck and we want to keep him, he should be on the NHL roster anyways. If he can't perform with high end talent than by all means either trade him or develop him in the AHL/Euro leagues but we haven't given him that chance to perform. His value is sinking like a rock though and I'd rather get something out of him than nothing.

 

[rt]

I wonder if having a colorful and heavily criticized new ownership group, with a new GM, and a brand new, largely unknown head coach will make it more difficult to sign UFAs. I'm trying to imagine players making the choice to sign here for anything other than weather, ice-time, and overpayment. Might be one good reason to keep Kessel and Kuemper until the trade-deadline. Could be hard to fill this roster out with decent players.

 

[rt]

Because it's his draft +3 year and he's never had a chance playing with high end talent for a significant amount of time and I don't want another Strome situation on our hands. If he does suck and won't amount to anything, we need to improve his value. If he doesn't suck and we want to keep him, he should be on the NHL roster anyways. If he can't perform with high end talent than by all means either trade him or develop him in the AHL/Euro leagues but we haven't given him that chance to perform. His value is sinking like a rock though and I'd rather get something out of him than nothing.

Everything you're saying should happen in the NHL should actually happen in the AHL instead.

 

[Jagged Ice]

Man, that's tough to figure. I don't rate Monahan much about Schmaltz, honestly. What kind of trade value does Monahan have? About a late 1st, maybe? I imagine Lucic has negative trade value of about a 1st or early 2nd? I feel like Monahan+Lucic is about a net-zero kind of package. I feel like OEL+Fischer is about a net-zero, also. So if the Flames lose Giordano to Seattle, and want a replacement, and are looking to move on from Monahan, I guess maybe this makes sense? That's a helluva lotta "ifs", though.

I was thinking Fischer too. Not sure Calgary is interested. That still looks like a win for AZ. At least to me.

 

[Dead Coyote]

Everything you're saying should happen in the NHL should actually happen in the AHL instead.

There's no high end talent in the AHL. Our team sucks. If it didn't, I'd be all for it.

 

[rt]

There's no high end talent in the AHL. Our team sucks. If it didn't, I'd be all for it.

If Hayton, Jenik, Maccelli, Soderstrom, and Prosvetov is no-talent, then we've got major issues.

 

[Jakey53]

So does Sean Monahan. What do we add for a swap besides taking on Lucic?

I read somewhere that Cody Glass might be available from Vegas. Both Glass and Hayton might welcome a new start.

 

[Jakey53]

Because it's his draft +3 year and he's never had a chance playing with high end talent for a significant amount of time and I don't want another Strome situation on our hands. If he does suck and won't amount to anything, we need to improve his value. If he doesn't suck and we want to keep him, he should be on the NHL roster anyways. If he can't perform with high end talent than by all means either trade him or develop him in the AHL/Euro leagues but we haven't given him that chance to perform. His value is sinking like a rock though and I'd rather get something out of him than nothing.

Training camp will dictate where Hayton plays next year.

 

[Mangosteen]

If Hayton, Jenik, Maccelli, Soderstrom, and Prosvetov is no-talent, then we've got major issues.

I believe it will be tough to sign UFAs right now. I also believe OEL, Kessel and Fisher are negative to the culture. Our year really will depend on how well our kids do in the NHL. Kessel may have trade value and I would target a project LW. Everyone is after centers but we may be able to steal a great LWer

 

[Jakey53]

I wonder if having a colorful and heavily criticized new ownership group, with a new GM, and a brand new, largely unknown head coach will make it more difficult to sign UFAs. I'm trying to imagine players making the choice to sign here for anything other than weather, ice-time, and overpayment. Might be one good reason to keep Kessel and Kuemper until the trade-deadline. Could be hard to fill this roster out with decent players.

Exactly. Also, we trade our better players for next to nothing like you have suggested many times may leave a sour taste in the mouth of Chychrun etc. These young talented kids will want to see big progress or they may start to follow the lead of Eichel. It will be interesting to see what Garland's contract will be.

 

[Dead Coyote]

If Hayton, Jenik, Maccelli, Soderstrom, and Prosvetov is no-talent, then we've got major issues.

Jenik is probably going to the NHL, and I'm a big fan of Macelli but there's a large difference between Jenik and Macelli and Keller and Schmaltz. Soderstrom is top end, sure, but he's probably not going to be the difference between Hayton having high end talent or not, he's a d-man and his primary job isn't to play 5 ft away from Hayton at all time. I want Hayton to be played with good linemates who can capitalize on his chances or set him up. Those things are obviously possible in the AHL, and I wouldn't mind a full year in the AHL, but I think he needs to see competition versus higher quality opponents in the NHL.

 

[rt]

Jenik is probably going to the NHL, and I'm a big fan of Macelli but there's a large difference between Jenik and Macelli and Keller and Schmaltz. Soderstrom is top end, sure, but he's probably not going to be the difference between Hayton having high end talent or not, he's a d-man and his primary job isn't to play 5 ft away from Hayton at all time. I want Hayton to be played with good linemates who can capitalize on his chances or set him up. Those things are obviously possible in the AHL, and I wouldn't mind a full year in the AHL, but I think he needs to see competition versus higher quality opponents in the NHL.

I want all of those guys in the AHL until they show they're too good for the AHL. I'd rather just sign cheap UFAs to fill the Arizona roster, and let those kids grow together. Making an AHL coaching decision is going to be very important for us. Hopefully Varady is willing to go back.

 

[Mangosteen]

Kessel, Fisher for Foegele and a 2nd.

 

[GhostofYotesFan47]

I wonder if having a colorful and heavily criticized new ownership group, with a new GM, and a brand new, largely unknown head coach will make it more difficult to sign UFAs. I'm trying to imagine players making the choice to sign here for anything other than weather, ice-time, and overpayment. Might be one good reason to keep Kessel and Kuemper until the trade-deadline. Could be hard to fill this roster out with decent players.

I think it depends on the way the summer trades shake out. Some of our best years were under Maloney who came in and turned the roster over a good bit. We've seen successful retools from other orgs in the past too. If we go out and move a handful of players, give a new identity on paper that is appealing to some UFAs than we could attract higher end guys. Maybe we see guys want to be take on leadership roles that they previously hadn't received the opportunity to take. Maybe it completely flops and we just have to believe in the suck.

We have a some positives in our court too. Our coach seems wildly respected in Hockey Canada, our GM comes from a winning org where he spent a decade being an intragyral part of that build and we have an owner who's finances may be down (like a huge portion of the country) but has shown to be a very successful businessman. There's a lot of green in there but there's also a long track record of success. There are a lot of teams that are viewed more stable but their front office has a lower track record of success.

The Coyotes feel kind of like a startup that went bad, got purchased by someone with a different plan for success and people could get on board with that.

OEL is a huge element as well, he needs to go to complete the transformation. I don't like it, and I will probably hate the value coming back but I think it needs to happen for this team to become what we all dream about, a Stanley Cup Champion.

 

[Jagged Ice]

I read somewhere that Cody Glass might be available from Vegas. Both Glass and Hayton might welcome a new start.

Philly said the same about Morgan Frost in recent days.
I can't find any numbers on Frost for 2020-2021 other than two games with the Flyers. What the hell has he been doing for the last year?
Edit- Found he suffered a season ending injury back in January.

 

[JasonDemersWasOkay]

I just want to get the finals over with so we can get on with the OEL trade. I don’t even care what we get for him anymore I just want to see it happen after waiting two years

 

[hbk]

Hayton is fine. Im all for acquiring Frost and or Glass.

 

[rt]

Kessel, Fisher for Foegele and a 2nd.

I mean, of course. Hell yeah. Not sure Carolina would though.

 

[Mangosteen]

They might, lets see if it passes the main board test

 

[XX]

Seravalli saying EJ is a buyout candidate in Colorado. AT has experience with EJ and that contract is likely insured. Bruins insider who has gotten things right before said Minny and Colorado appeal to OEL.

Might be an OEL angle there, even though Colorado really doesn't need him.

 

[Baby Doaner]

Seravalli saying EJ is a buyout candidate in Colorado. AT has experience with EJ and that contract is likely insured. Bruins insider who has gotten things right before said Minny and Colorado appeal to OEL.

Might be an OEL angle there, even though Colorado really doesn't need him.

Same division. Idk how that would work out.

 

[rt]

Seravalli saying EJ is a buyout candidate in Colorado. AT has experience with EJ and that contract is likely insured. Bruins insider who has gotten things right before said Minny and Colorado appeal to OEL.

Might be an OEL angle there, even though Colorado really doesn't need him.

I was reading through the Avalanche off-season thread recently. Ryan Graves is the #1 scapegoat there now. Most of the Avs fans on HF seem to be hoping Seattle will claim him, as they are really disappointed in his playoff performance. I also read that Erik Johnson is not planning on being an LTIR cast-off and wants to play. Also, he's planning on waiving his trade protections for the Seattle expansion. Sounds like he wouldn't mind getting picked up. I think he just wants to be wanted and to be able to get minutes.

OEL for Graves and EJ saves us 1.5 million in salary next season, and saves Colorado 1 million in aav next season.

Could be expanded to include Keumper (with retention) for Francouz (who we can expose to Seattle) and a quality asset coming back for Kuemper (picks/prospects). Depending on how Francouz recovers from injury, he's a goalie I actually like and wouldn't mind pairing with Hill next season (potentially with a 3rd option like Brossoit or the like).

 

[zerekstar]

This is a bit off the present discussion but regarding the Coyotes this coming season, does Pederson have enough game for the NHL?

 

[Coyotedroppings]

This is a bit off the present discussion but regarding the Coyotes this coming season, does Pederson have enough game for the NHL?

Not really, a team with him Jenik and the like, with little vet presence could sorta survive in the NHL….. for a while… maybe.