snag
Registered User
- Feb 22, 2014
- 10,047
- 11,344
Connor McDavid will go down as the 2nd best player of all-time
- Thread starter HFpapi
- Start date
-
Work is still on-going to rebuild the site styling and features. Please report any issues you may experience so we can look into it. Click Here for Updates
kingsfan28
Its A Kingspiracy !
Macheteops
Registered User
- Apr 13, 2005
- 980
- 1,033
He may break 1600+
Really conservative estimate I do say. He'll have 1600 likely around age 32. He'll eclipse 2000 points
People can roll their eyes all they want. 1 cup changes every thing, even a cup final loss with a great performance.
Ray Bourque took his team to the finals twice against a legendary power house and was robbed of an MVP.
He didn’t need the cup but it was a nice story.
The other 4 are all winners, fair or not. Dionne suffers the same fate.
He could very well put up 2000 points and make a debate out of it but he has more work to do to challenge the greats.
Ray Bourque took his team to the finals twice against a legendary power house and was robbed of an MVP.
He didn’t need the cup but it was a nice story.
The other 4 are all winners, fair or not. Dionne suffers the same fate.
He could very well put up 2000 points and make a debate out of it but he has more work to do to challenge the greats.
He needs at least 2 CS to compete with Mario as the best 2nd best forward post-expansion.
Even then, I'm not sure anyone will actually think he was "better" just able to stay healthier and have a better career (that's if he does win multiple cups and CS trophies.
He could easily be the 3rd best forward post-expansion though, even with just 1 cup and CS
Even then, I'm not sure anyone will actually think he was "better" just able to stay healthier and have a better career (that's if he does win multiple cups and CS trophies.
He could easily be the 3rd best forward post-expansion though, even with just 1 cup and CS
HFpapi
Registered User
Have it exactly as you do.
Wayne indisputably #1. Mario and Orr interchangeable for 2 & 3. Personally I like 66 more in that spot since he's the only player in history who could do what Wayne could, just couldn't stay healthy. No issues at all with people putting Orr #2 however.
People who have Howe over Mario confuse me. Howe to me is easily #4 in that big 4 but nonetheless an absolute legend and def worthy of making it a "big 4."
That said, I think Howe is for sure the most likely for McDavid to pass and in fact I am on record in this thread as saying it's basically inevitable McDavid passes him. 5 Rosses in 8 seasons in the modern era >>> 6 Rosses in a 30 year career in a mostly 6 team league where the entire talent pool came from Canada with 17 million people.
Crosby I think is the consensus 5th best player at this point. Undecided if I think McDavid has already passed him for that spot but it's literally just a matter of time before he does (and I'm a huge Crosby guy).
Jagr has no argument for 5th much less 2. Def in the convo for top 10 though.
Nobody has ever made a serious argument for Jagr at #2, come off it.
The Grim Reaper
Registered User
Nobody is/was saying Ray Bourque is the 2nd best player of all-time though?Yeah Ray Bourque sucked ass too.
Bank Shot
Registered User
- Jan 18, 2006
- 11,815
- 7,706
McDavid is competing against 31 other teams first liners. The more players you have, the more chance someone has a fluke year and puts up crazy points. Like Gaudreau and Huberdeau for example.
Its more impressive to consistently win the Art Ross against a bigger pool of talent IMO.
I like Connor McDavid a lot, and watch the Oilers on TV when I can. Having said that, I found this on fb this morning. Very interesting.
McDavid is in very elite company.
McDavid is in very elite company.
He needs way more postseason accolades to be #2.
There’s also this other part of hockey called defense.
There’s also this other part of hockey called defense.
BraveCanadian
Registered User
- Jun 30, 2010
- 15,729
- 5,242
Unlikely unless you have a strong preference for recent players. Oh wait, this is hfboards where players from before 1990 were cavemen.. then I guess it’s possible.
Sasha Orlov
Lord of the Manor
- Jun 22, 2018
- 9,544
- 22,643
Goose
Registered User
- Apr 18, 2006
- 3,351
- 3,297
When he loses that explosive speed due to age we will see how it affects him.
He could surpass Crosby, and that’s saying something, but it’s not guaranteed.
Putting him 2nd is too subjective to really evaluate, how do you compare him to Orr really?
Also, even if he keeps up his pace I would still take prime healthy Lemieux over prime healthy McDavid if I was building an imaginary team.
Regardless he’s the best player of this current generation, the torch has clearly been handed from Crosby, it will be fun to see how long he can continue to stay at the top. Amazing player who’s been fun to watch, hopefully he gets at least one cup.
He could surpass Crosby, and that’s saying something, but it’s not guaranteed.
Putting him 2nd is too subjective to really evaluate, how do you compare him to Orr really?
Also, even if he keeps up his pace I would still take prime healthy Lemieux over prime healthy McDavid if I was building an imaginary team.
Regardless he’s the best player of this current generation, the torch has clearly been handed from Crosby, it will be fun to see how long he can continue to stay at the top. Amazing player who’s been fun to watch, hopefully he gets at least one cup.
Why do you keep saying post-expansion? He's already better than every corpse that played pre-expansion. Irrelevant verbiage.
Fishy McScales
Registered User
Well obviously. The greats' careers are done, McDavid still has a lot left of his.
The OP is a prediction, not a summary.
HFpapi
Registered User
Or Americans even.
Literally only Canadians (when Canada had 17 million people).
The NHL's entire talent pool came from something the size of present day Netherlands when Howe was winning his scoring titles.
BraveCanadian
Registered User
- Jun 30, 2010
- 15,729
- 5,242
Estimating the size of the NHL's talent pool (1950-2023)
There have been hundreds (and probably thousands) of posts on HOH that discuss the size of the NHL's talent pool. The data that's needed to determine the talent pool (youths actively involved in organized hockey) has never been maintained with any rigour or consistency, across countries and...
And all hockey historians can't stop polishing his knob!
Embarrassing to say the least, papi.
norrisnick
The best...
- Apr 14, 2005
- 31,929
- 17,415
If you took all Europeans out of the modern NHL would that make McDavid a worse player?
Sasha Orlov
Lord of the Manor
- Jun 22, 2018
- 9,544
- 22,643
HFpapi
Registered User
It would certainly boost his % of scoring victory over other players. Remove Draisaitl from last season for example and how much does McDavid win the scoring title by?
The notion is explicitly in response to someone posting Howe's margins of victory over 2nd place scorer.
When someone posts Howe's "amazing" margins of victories, it's fair to point out he never had to compete against a single American, Russian, Swede, Czech, Finn. German, etc is it not?
It would make him look better than he actually is.
No Kucherov, Panarin, Pastrnak and Rantanen in the scoring race.
No Vasilevskys or Sorokins making crazy saves and stopping the Oil.
Euro dmen kinda suck now, so that won't affect much.
- Feb 10, 2010
- 14,639
- 11,732
I'll make it nice and simple then:
Gordie Howe is a 6 time MVP. Mario Lemieux is a 3 time MVP.
Howe was a Hart finalist 12 times. Lemieux did it 7 times.
Howe is 2nd all time in adjusted points. Lemieux is 13th.
Howe is 2nd all time in adjusted goals. Lemieux is 19th.
Howe led the NHL in goals 5 times. Lemieux did it 3 times.
They both led the NHL in points 6 times.
Howe was a very good defensive player. Mario Lemieux was generationally bad at defense.
