TSN: Cody Ceci + Hapur + Luchuk and pick for Nikita Zeitsev + Brown + Carcone

[Ice-Tray]

What? Have you been paying attention at all?

To you?

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Absolutely! I love watching hockey, not pie charts and bar graphs.

I’m going by what I have read in the leaf board, and what a bunch of fans have told us, who took the time to come over to our board and tell us about the players we were getting.

Mostly I have suggested waiting to see how they do on our team, it’s what I’ll be doing, and I’m suggesting it as an option to others.

I know it’s a minority type of post as of yesterday and today, but that’s ok, it’s nice to have a little variety, no?

Maybe you'll enjoy reading this Leafs fan's take on Zaitsev

Nikita Zaitsev has the worst stats of the Leafs top four

Good stuff in here:

The main culprit here is 50 minutes with Ron Hainsey. Their CA/60 is 89 and their CF/60 is only 48, giving them a CF% of 35. That’s enough minutes to add up to three games together, and that’s just flat out terrible. It’s that chunk of time that moves the needle on Zaitsev and makes him look worse than his usual partner does overall.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

At what point do people get to say I told you so. 2 years? 5 years? 10 years?

We're still waiting to see if that Burrows trade will pan out.

 

[JD1]

We traded a 3rd rounder so they would pay the bonuses for us. Where do you think that mandate came from ?

Actually where did the 3rd rounder for the bonus come from?

 

[Ice-Tray]

Maybe you'll enjoy reading this Leafs fan's take on Zaitsev

Nikita Zaitsev has the worst stats of the Leafs top four

Good stuff in here:

Naw, I already have a nice cross section of opinions, no I’m going to sit back and see what we have using my own eyes.

Outside opinions are valuable, especially when they vary, but only to a point.

If he sucks FQL, I’ll be fine to say it. You had an extremely hard time dealing with being so far off the mark in regards to Brady, will you be quicker to see it if you miss the mark on Z as well!”?

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

We're still waiting to see if that Burrows trade will pan out.

I even argued with you about that one at the time. I was wrong and I was able to admit it, not sure why some just continue to double down with excuses after each bad move.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Actually where did the 3rd rounder for the bonus come from?

It’s why some people think we included a pick in the deal.

We were supposed to get the players for free. While also giving up Ceci and Harpur.

 

[Ice-Tray]

We're still waiting to see if that Burrows trade will pan out.

True, I guess we’re still waiting for that star prospect to make the NHL with his third team...

 

[harrisb]

To you?

There are numerous instances where PD said one thing then Euge another (stone trade, EK, “the interview”, etc). Guess which direction the team took? Was it PD making decisions or following a mandate, you tell us as the other 99% feel he was following orders

 

[BondraTime]

The budget? Sure, but I doubt EM is in the room telling PD to trade pick for bonuses. PD knows what he’s allowed to spend, and he has to ice a team within those constraints.

In fairness to PD I think most teams wait until bonuses are paid before trading... we also got dinged with this with Heater way back when...

I don’t think that’s just an Ottawa thing...

Heatley was traded on June 30th (the day prior to his bonus being paid, not a coincidence), prior to his Bonus, but he nixed the deal. Sens tried to get rid of him before his bonus was paid, but it fell apart because he wouldn't accept it.

He then got traded 2.5 months later in September, because that' s when the next deal made. Had nothing to do with bonuses. In fact, we sued Heatley for his signing bonus

The Sens have had 2 deals arranged days/weeks prior to them being announced, as they paid draft picks to have the other teams wait until they had paid their bonuses prior to the trade. This is an Ottawa thing, it doesn't happen anywhere else.

I understand why it's happening, doesn't take it any less ridiculous, but it's part of being a Melnyk owned team, but it's not something that happens in the league outside of Ottawa

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

You had an extremely hard time dealing with being so far off the mark in regards to Brady,

That's some pretty interesting fiction you've made here. I was signing Brady's praise a lot the past year. Didn't take me long either. Would you like to tell me now how great Pierre's move to acquire Matt Duchene was?

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

True, I guess we’re still waiting for that star prospect to make the NHL with his third team...

Hey, congrats! Today is the day we're finally not paying Burrows to not play hockey!

Someone told me long ago that we need to wait and see how things will pan out. Guess you disagree on that one though.

 

[2CHAINZ]

The budget? Sure, but I doubt EM is in the room telling PD to trade pick for bonuses. PD knows what he’s allowed to spend, and he has to ice a team within those constraints.

In fairness to PD I think most teams wait until bonuses are paid before trading... we also got dinged with this with Heater way back when...

I don’t think that’s just an Ottawa thing...

Yes trading for people after bonuses are paid is the norm. However giving up picks seems to only be the Ottawa norm. Toronto had no leverage here and if they actually wanted Ceci it seems Ottawa had 100% of the leverage. How does PD find himself in this spot and come out with this ?

 

[Ice-Tray]

I even argued with you about that one at the time. I was wrong and I was able to admit it, not sure why some just continue to double down with excuses after each bad move.

Lol, here goes...

Burrows was good for us down the stretch and played an important role in getting us into the playoffs that year.

His two year didn’t prevent us from doing anything, and he definitely wasn’t to blame for the broken dressing room, or the sub par play by virtually the entire roster.

The prospect we traded has not shown to be an NHL player yet, and had already been traded again.

In actually retrospect, we haven’t been shown to have given up anything of substance for AB helping us make the playoffs that year. Remember, he was scoring at a 0.5ppg pace down the stretch and was first star in three games alone.

Another example of Sens mythmaking.... turns out it isn’t actually an example of a terrible trade....

 

[Fandlauer]

How much does Zaitsev have to hate babs in order to actually waive a ntc to come here lol

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Lol, here goes...

Burrows was good for us down the stretch and played an important role in getting us into the playoffs that year.

His two year didn’t prevent us from doing anything, and he definitely wasn’t to blame for the broken dressing room, or the sub par play by virtually the entire roster.

The prospect we traded has not shown to be an NHL player yet, and had already been traded again.

In actually retrospect, we haven’t been shown to have given up anything of substance for AB helping us make the playoffs that year. Remember, he was scoring at a 0.5ppg pace down the stretch and was first star in three games alone.

Another example of Sens mythmaking.... turns out it isn’t actually an example of a terrible trade....

 

[BondraTime]

Actually where did the 3rd rounder for the bonus come from?

 

[Ice-Tray]

There are numerous instances where PD said one thing then Euge another (stone trade, EK, “the interview”, etc). Guess which direction the team took? Was it PD making decisions or following a mandate, you tell us as the other 99% feel he was following orders

Dude, that’s not why I meant at all. EM is not telling PD how to do his job, he’s delivering the budget within which PD has to work. It is also possible that EM wanted PD to initiate an immediate rebuild. That all would make sense.

It makes much more Sean for EM to be relaying what PD describes as the course of action given the financial directives, rather than EM devising the roster specifics.

I could be wrong, but it seems unlikely.

 

[harrisb]

Lol, here goes...

Burrows was good for us down the stretch and played an important role in getting us into the playoffs that year.

His two year didn’t prevent us from doing anything, and he definitely wasn’t to blame for the broken dressing room, or the sub par play by virtually the entire roster.

The prospect we traded has not shown to be an NHL player yet, and had already been traded again.

In actually retrospect, we haven’t been shown to have given up anything of substance for AB helping us make the playoffs that year. Remember, he was scoring at a 0.5ppg pace down the stretch and was first star in three games alone.

Another example of Sens mythmaking.... turns out it isn’t actually an example of a terrible trade....

Given our budget constraints you don’t feel not having burrows on the books wouldn’t have helped replace both Mac and Methot that we instead went with oduya and nobody? Interesting take for sure

 

[Ice-Tray]

Hey, congrats! Today is the day we're finally not paying Burrows to not play hockey!

Someone told me long ago that we need to wait and see how things will pan out. Guess you disagree on that one though.

What’s Dahlen up to these days?

Heatley was traded on June 30th (the day prior to his bonus being paid, not a coincidence), prior to his Bonus, but he nixed the deal. Sens tried to get rid of him before his bonus was paid, but it fell apart because he wouldn't accept it.

He then got traded 2.5 months later in September, because that' s when the next deal made. Had nothing to do with bonuses. In fact, we sued Heatley for his signing bonus

The Sens have had 2 deals arranged days/weeks prior to them being announced, as they paid draft picks to have the other teams wait until they had paid their bonuses prior to the trade. This is an Ottawa thing, it doesn't happen anywhere else.

I understand why it's happening, doesn't take it any less ridiculous, but it's part of being a Melnyk owned team, but it's not something that happens in the league outside of Ottawa

Of course it does. It’s just not necessarily an imperative of the team. We have to live within our shitty budget.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Love this TEAM!

 

[GrantLemons]

All I want to see is a clear trade win from Pierre Dorion when trading with the intent of improving the NHL team.

Every single trade of that nature he makes leaves you scratching your head a little, wondering how you should feel about the trade.

The reality is we'll never win deals like this while being concerned about every dollar in/out. Everytime it seems we're in a position to win a trade, we have to make the real dollars work, and we end up surrendering our leverage.

It's f***ing tiring man. We're trying to play moneyball but we have an owner and GM who dont have the first clue how to do it.

 

[BondraTime]

What’s Dahlen up to these days?


Of course it does.

What other teams have made deals in advance (2 days for Zaitsev, prior to the draft for Zibanejad) but held up in an agreement to give a draft pick in order for other teams to pay signing bonuses? None that I can think of, though I'd love to be proven wrong

There are lots of examples of teams giving up picks to dump contracts (Marleau, Datsyuk, Hossa, etc.) but there are no deals I can remember, outside of the 2 we have made in the past couple of years, where a team paid more assets in an agreed upon deal in order to have the other team delay the trade in order to pay a signing bonus. That just doesn't happen. Any examples and I would concede I'm wrong very easily.

 

[2CHAINZ]

Lol, here goes...

Burrows was good for us down the stretch and played an important role in getting us into the playoffs that year.

His two year didn’t prevent us from doing anything, and he definitely wasn’t to blame for the broken dressing room, or the sub par play by virtually the entire roster.

The prospect we traded has not shown to be an NHL player yet, and had already been traded again.

In actually retrospect, we haven’t been shown to have given up anything of substance for AB helping us make the playoffs that year. Remember, he was scoring at a 0.5ppg pace down the stretch and was first star in three games alone.

Another example of Sens mythmaking.... turns out it isn’t actually an example of a terrible trade....

I think it was the contract that was handed out to a guy who was clearly losing it that was the problem. I think people upset about the trade were upset that we traded a prospect who was on a serious rise for a 4th liner who was on empty.

If Ottawa traded a late pick to take a gamble on Burrows then after the season gave him that contract and he still ends up being bought out it would be a different story.

 

[topshelf15]

All I want to see is a clear trade win from Pierre Dorion when trading with the intent of improving the NHL team.

Every single trade of that nature he makes leaves you scratching your head a little, wondering how you should feel about the trade.

The reality is we'll never win deals like this while being concerned about every dollar in/out. Everytime it seems we're in a position to win a trade, we have to make the real dollars work, and we end up surrendering our leverage.

It's ****ing tiring man. We're trying to play moneyball but we have an owner and GM who dont have the first clue how to do it.

Hamsters on a wheel .......Running around and around going nowhere