Chloe Primarano becomes the first female to be selected in the WHL Bantam Draft

Cardiac Jerks

Asinine & immoral
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You're end up your post saying that "everyone should be there based on merit".

That's great, and why exactly would Primarano be exempt? Was her play not good enough to warrant a selection? I can only stats watch, but based on stats alone she doesn't stick out like a sore thumb compared to other draftees around her.




II don't completely disagree, part of me is wondering if these young athletes understand the risk associated with the sport - and even if the oarents signed a waiver, is it enough to out kids at such risks?

but another part of me wonder if she's not old enough now to make that decision, as do her men counterparts when they decide to play in leagues with players older than them. Can she decide for herself if the sport is too rough for her?

She's still competing with the guys and seems to be doing well. It could absolutely change in the WHL, but that's her decision to make no?

Women do have the idds stacked against them in terms of physicality, but tyese are averages, not absolutes. An outlier can exist in theory - extremely unlikely but possible, one needs to enable them the challenge of competing at the highest levels though.

I never said she shouldn’t be there. It’s a nothing draft pick in a round where many teams simply pass on their selections. It remains to be seen if she’ll become good enough to appear in any games but history isn’t on her side. We shall see I guess. I just find it funny that some posters think we’re close to seeing a woman in the nhl or dominating in any boys/mens league, to be honest.
 
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abo9

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I never said she shouldn’t be there. It’s a nothing draft pick in a round where many teams simply pass on their selections. It remains to be seen if she’ll become good enough to appear in any games but history isn’t on her side. We shall see I guess. I just find it funny that some posters think we’re close to seeing a woman in the nhl or dominating in any boys/mens league, to be honest.

Yeah on that note I think some are just more optimistic than others. But they might see the lack of participation as an obstacle bigger than biology.

Let's face it, a lot of female hockey players simply don't devote as much time, energy or money as their male counterparts because there's no real future in it for them - no "hope" so to speak.

But the fact that a woman has been drafted in the WHL might elicit other female hockey players to keep going playing with males as long as they can keep up. Another one gets drafted and makes the jump, more female puts more time and energy into hockey as they see a dream forming. Etc. etc.

After all, it's a number's game. If 0.0001% of female hockey players have the potential, it will probably take more than 200 000 participants in the sport to expect seeing one make it.
 
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YippieKaey

How you gonna do hockey like that?
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men have higher bone density. Regardless of her size I doubt the coach will put her in a game; way too dangerous.

This is not house league; these players are playing for their future and wont hold back.

Did you know that every human born has been preceded by the female pelvic bone literally bending outwards? Women have higher pain thresholds than men. Besides, it's not like hockey is known for it's lack of injuries..

And

I never said she shouldn’t be there. It’s a nothing draft pick in a round where many teams simply pass on their selections. It remains to be seen if she’ll become good enough to appear in any games but history isn’t on her side. We shall see I guess. I just find it funny that some posters think we’re close to seeing a woman in the nhl or dominating in any boys/mens league, to be honest.

If it's a nothing pick, why does it bother you so much?

And im pretty sure no one said the second bolded part. We're just happy more people will be able to enjoy the sport and frankly you should be to. It's a massie win-win if more women play, and thus enjoy the game of hockey.
 

YippieKaey

How you gonna do hockey like that?
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Am I the only one brave enough to say I DON'T LIKE IT? This was done for publicity, not because she is really good or comparable to her male counterparts. Tell me what guy in a physical hitting league is going to want to hit her? Men/Boys and Women/Girls have different body types and bone structures, and if she or any girl ever got hit hard by a guy, either on purpose or accident, they would very likely get hurt pretty bad. Women don't play with men in any other major pro sport, so why are hockey fans wanting hockey to be the one to break this norm? Hockey is the roughest sport other than football and rugby out there, and there is a reason men and women don't play in leagues together that have physicality.

I know, I will get labeled misogynist for this comment, but pretend that all you want, I don't care. Men aren't being excepted into the WNBA, and we here not a peep about it, nor should we, and basketball is one of the more ideal sports that men and women can play together. No women play in MLB, and there is no on purpose contact in the sport.

You are the true definition of a hero for speaking out on the internet.
 

Cardiac Jerks

Asinine & immoral
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Did you know that every human born has been preceded by the female pelvic bone literally bending outwards? Women have higher pain thresholds than men. Besides, it's not like hockey is known for it's lack of injuries..

And



If it's a nothing pick, why does it bother you so much?

And im pretty sure no one said the second bolded part. We're just happy more people will be able to enjoy the sport and frankly you should be to. It's a massie win-win if more women play, and thus enjoy the game of hockey.

It doesn’t bother me at all. Not sure what leads you to believe that.
 

tmlmatus

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Did you know that every human born has been preceded by the female pelvic bone literally bending outwards? Women have higher pain thresholds than men. Besides, it's not like hockey is known for it's lack of injuries..
you're absolutely right, women due have higher pain thresholds; not sure what that has to do with bone density tho.
 

Silky Johnson

I wish you all the bad things in life.
Mar 9, 2015
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Why?

What's wrong with women's natural choices? Why, exactly, are Hockey Canada, USA Hockey, the NHL, et al so obsessed with changing women? Why must women do the same things men do? Why is a woman who spends her fertile years playing hockey superior to a woman who gives birth and creates baby boys who can grow into far superior hockey players?

(If the answer is, "So the corporations can take money from women, too", that's incomplete, because it doesn't explain the moral preening and vicious attacks on those who disagree with such a marketing strategy.)

Sexual dimorphism and natural differences are good. Corporate-funded, politically-enforced sexual engineering is bad.
Sorry, being a part of organised sports should be available to everyone.
 

TimeZone

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Did you know that every human born has been preceded by the female pelvic bone literally bending outwards? Women have higher pain thresholds than men. Besides, it's not like hockey is known for it's lack of injuries..

And



If it's a nothing pick, why does it bother you so much?

And im pretty sure no one said the second bolded part. We're just happy more people will be able to enjoy the sport and frankly you should be to. It's a massie win-win if more women play, and thus enjoy the game of hockey.

This literally varies from study to study, with some showing the opposite to be true and a plethora of studies showing in particular, that women tend to experience more intense pain than men.

Nothing wrong with the pick, particularly given that most picks in this point in the Draft are essentially throw aways, but there really is no denying the biological advantages that men have over women.
 
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Oddbob

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You are the true definition of a hero for speaking out on the internet.

Never said I was a hero. Just tired of a lot of these threads being, "oh, this is so great!", "this is so wonderful!"

Also, people are afaid to speak their true feelings even on the internet, for fear of being made fun of, or being hated on!
 
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TimeZone

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Based on what? Marie Phillipe Poulin would 100% decimate the CHL, just like Matthew Savoie is doing.

Women are weaker and slower and less durable on average, sure. The good thing with averages is that its just that, theres variation all over the place.

And no, she wouldnt be, shes be living in a less misogynistic time, lmao.

On the same account asian males cant play in the NHL because theyre on average weaker, smaller and weigh less. Lets call Suzuki, hes off the team.

Oh and theres no more white people on NBA, they cant jump.

Whats next? Were going to mention POC are dumber than blue eyes blond haired individuals?

Based on what exactly? Professional female athletes routinely struggle and lose to 15 year old boys who have just entered High School and have yet to even finish puberty.

Thats quite the reach.
 

Mrb1p

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Based on what exactly? Professional female athletes routinely struggle and lose to 15 year old boys who have just entered High School and have yet to even finish puberty.

Thats quite the reach.
A TEAM of professional female which includes MPP but also very bad players that dont dedicate their lives to hockey. It is a false dillema youre creating.
 

BondraTime

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Based on what exactly? Professional female athletes routinely struggle and lose to 15 year old boys who have just entered High School and have yet to even finish puberty.

Thats quite the reach.
It’s based on nothing other than the need to be virtuous.

They are great, phenomenal athletes, but they don’t compare to the top percentile of males that play high level sports. It’s just a fact of life.
 

Oddbob

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Did you know that every human born has been preceded by the female pelvic bone literally bending outwards? Women have higher pain thresholds than men. Besides, it's not like hockey is known for it's lack of injuries..

And



If it's a nothing pick, why does it bother you so much?

And im pretty sure no one said the second bolded part. We're just happy more people will be able to enjoy the sport and frankly you should be to. It's a massie win-win if more women play, and thus enjoy the game of hockey.

How does a girl getting drafted only as publicity stunt help more people play or enjoy he game? Girls already know the sport exists, and isn't like they are saying, "wow, what is this hockey thing, I might give it a try!"

The only way men and women will EVER play in the same hockey league at the pro level, is if hitting gets banned, which no one wants to see happen anyhow. Even then accidental collisions between men and women on ice at full speed would be a massive injury risk to both parties, especially the women.
 

kabidjan18

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Let's face it, a lot of female hockey players simply don't devote as much time, energy or money as their male counterparts because there's no real future in it for them - no "hope" so to speak.
A TEAM of professional female which includes MPP but also very bad players that dont dedicate their lives to hockey. It is a false dillema youre creating.
These really bad semi-insults need to stop. They're absolutely 100 percent false. I don't know why people who pretend to be pro-women's hockey feel like the best move to do that is to bash female hockey players.

Female hockey players devote just as much time, and energy, and their lives, to hockey as males do. Period. They train just as hard, they go to just as many camps and practices and private coaching sessions.

The premise that females "don't try because there's no hope", as a supposed rebuttal to the fact that Canadian women have far more access to hockey resources than the men of most other countries is a terrible one. They are in fact spending more money. They are in fact spending more time. They are in fact dedicating their lives.

Particularly when we talk about junior players. All junior players, male and female, do school and hockey simultaneously. That doesn't mean they're not dedicated. That doesn't mean they're not devoted. And that definitely doesn't mean they're not spending the money.

Any of these arguments basically that women would do better if they tried harder or essentially cared more, I understand how they're supposed to be helping, but they're actually both wrong and insulting.
 

BondraTime

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How does a girl getting drafted only as publicity stunt help more people play or enjoy he game? Girls already know the sport exists, and isn't like they are saying, "wow, what is this hockey thing, I might give it a try!"

The only way men and women will EVER play in the same hockey league at the pro level, is if hitting gets banned, which no one wants to see happen anyhow. Even then accidental collisions between men and women on ice at full speed would be a massive injury risk to both parties, especially the women.
It absolutely helps female hockey, any exposure for the younger generation is good.

She was definitely good enough in Bantam to be drafted as well, she was a better player than many of her male counterparts who were drafted in the league. The problem lies in that it is going to be ~2 years until any of them begin to play in the WHL, and using any bit of developmental knowledge, she isn't going to have the development, anywhere close, to her counterparts.

The Giants understand this. The 13th pick may have been passed anyways, absolutely nothing wrong with picking her for exposure. Nobody picked in the 13th is going to ply regardless
 
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kilowatt

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Gaudreau was 5'8, 135 when drafted. Players come in all shapes, sizes, and genders. If she can play, she can play, don't treat her any differently. This is cool. I hope more girls play hockey and reach higher levels in the sport.
 

abo9

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These really bad semi-insults need to stop. They're absolutely 100 percent false. I don't know why people who pretend to be pro-women's hockey feel like the best move to do that is to bash female hockey players.

Female hockey players devote just as much time, and energy, and their lives, to hockey as males do. Period. They train just as hard, they go to just as many camps and practices and private coaching sessions.

The premise that females "don't try because there's no hope", as a supposed rebuttal to the fact that Canadian women have far more access to hockey resources than the men of most other countries is a terrible one. They are in fact spending more money. They are in fact spending more time. They are in fact dedicating their lives.

Particularly when we talk about junior players. All junior players, male and female, do school and hockey simultaneously. That doesn't mean they're not dedicated. That doesn't mean they're not devoted. And that definitely doesn't mean they're not spending the money.

Any of these arguments basically that women would do better if they tried harder or essentially cared more, I understand how they're supposed to be helping, but they're actually both wrong and insulting.

Oh come on. It's not insulting. There's definitely a portion of female players that quit because there's no future to be had in hockey. If they even cared to play competitively at all instead of focusing on other things. A lot of it might be driven by the parents and not the players though.

Same with guys, except there's a lot of guys who continue just because there's a hope of a future career to be had -whether in the NHL, AHL, or Europe.



And Mrb1p's point is even less contentious than mine. It's a number's game. The 1% of elite female players will definitely have more variation in terms of ethics and passion for the game, because there's simply less individuals to compete against...
 

Asinine

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Gaudreau was 5'8, 135 when drafted. Players come in all shapes, sizes, and genders. If she can play, she can play, don't treat her any differently. This is cool. I hope more girls play hockey and reach higher levels in the sport.
How many times are people going to walk blindly into this thread and repeat this same talking point thinking they are dropping some bombshell of information on everyone.
 

TimeZone

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A TEAM of professional female which includes MPP but also very bad players that dont dedicate their lives to hockey. It is a false dillema youre creating.

The "dillema" is not being creating by me, it's literally taken place countless times across a variety of different sports :

Matildas lose 7-0 to under-15s boys side

FC Dallas under-15 boys squad beat the U.S. Women's National Team in a scrimmage

Hockey Canada upped the ante for 2022. The women played five games against men's Junior A clubs in Alberta and B.C. Canada was swept and outscored 30-2, which stung.

Canada's national women's team loses to midget Flames in Olympic tune up

Bilbao kids team smashes their female professional team 6-0 in friendly

Canadian National Women's Team Bested by Junior B Mustangs in Exhibition

Also. I'm not particularly sure that labeling her peers/competition as "very bad players who don't care" was particularly helpful to your claim that MPP is capable of dominating the best Junior Hockey league on the planet.

There is absolutely no logical reason to assume she's capable of being even an average CHL caliber player, let alone "decimating" the league.

I just want to know how you managed to reach such an absurd conclusion, is all.
 

Mrb1p

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The "dillema" is not being creating by me, it's literally taken place countless times across a variety of different sports :

Matildas lose 7-0 to under-15s boys side

FC Dallas under-15 boys squad beat the U.S. Women's National Team in a scrimmage

Hockey Canada upped the ante for 2022. The women played five games against men's Junior A clubs in Alberta and B.C. Canada was swept and outscored 30-2, which stung.

Canada's national women's team loses to midget Flames in Olympic tune up

Bilbao kids team smashes their female professional team 6-0 in friendly

Canadian National Women's Team Bested by Junior B Mustangs in Exhibition

Also. I'm not particularly sure that labeling her peers/competition as "very bad players who don't care" was particularly helpful to your claim that MPP is capable of dominating the best Junior Hockey league on the planet.

There is absolutely no logical reason to assume she's capable of being even an average CHL caliber player, let alone "decimating" the league.

I just want to know how you managed to reach such an absurd conclusion, is all.
You just have poor mathematical knowledge if you dont understand the laws of average.
 

Cardiac Jerks

Asinine & immoral
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A TEAM of professional female which includes MPP but also very bad players that dont dedicate their lives to hockey. It is a false dillema youre creating.

What on earth are you talking about? The Canadian women's olympic team (the best women’s team in the world) routinely lose to teenage boys while prepping for major tournaments.

Who are these very bad players you make it sound like MPP is saddled with? The only person creating anything false here is you and this weird narrative.
 

TimeZone

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You just have poor mathematical knowledge if you dont understand the laws of average.

What the hell are you talking about? The current women's Canadian Olympic team was outscored 30-2 in 5 games against Junior A teams in one of the half dozen examples of Professional womens teams getting trounced by teenage boys I responded with and you respond back incoherently rambling about mathematics and law of averages?

Are you okay?
 

kabidjan18

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Oh come on. It's not insulting. There's definitely a portion of female players that quit because there's no future to be had in hockey. If they even cared to play competitively at all instead of focusing on other things. A lot of it might be driven by the parents and not the players though.

Same with guys, except there's a lot of guys who continue just because there's a hope of a future career to be had -whether in the NHL, AHL, or Europe.

And Mrb1p's point is even less contentious than mine. It's a number's game. The 1% of elite female players will definitely have more variation in terms of ethics and passion for the game, because there's simply less individuals to compete against...
I feel like you neither know the hockey players themselves nor know about the landscape of female hockey.

First of all, the elite players are passionate. Period. Secondly, there actually is quite a lot to play for. We have Title IX here in the states, practically speaking there is more funding per female student athlete in the same school than male athletes, and the obvious objective that canadian and american female players aim for through juniors is to play in college on a scholarship.

The entire premise is quite faulty. By the time someone is 20 years old, we pretty much know if they'll ever be good enough to play in the CHL. Certainly, by 25, when a player is leaving the NCAA, we should have a good idea of whether or not they could ever play in the CHL.

There are more registered Canadian junior female hockey players, probably than Germany, France, GB, Slovenia, Austria, Lithuania, Ukraine, Belarus, Latvia, Slovakia combined. There may be even more registered female juniors in Canada than male juniors in Russia. This is not even talking about women in the USA. And each of these women receive more resources, in terms of training opportunities. In terms of ice time. In terms of camps and private lessons. And then at 18-20, the best of the best female hockey players in Canada and the USA get scholarships to play in the NCAA, where we have Title IX, so the funding they receive there and the training is world class. Even better than male hockey players at the same university.

And yet, we have CHL players from Germany, France, GB, Slovenia, Austria, Lithuania, Ukraine, Belarus, Latvia, Slovakia, but no females. And despite the law of averages, and their smaller population sizes, the U20 teams of every single one of those teams would be able to beat the Canadian women's U20 team or the American one. If your only explanation for this is that these 20 year old girls, who have had better training opportunities at every single level, playing in well funded NCAA programs have given up in their souls. Well...

The law of averages also is not explanatory here, if we prorate it out to the end of college. If you took the national teams of Germany, France, GB, Slovenia, Austria, Lithuania, Belarus, Latvia, Slovakia. Even, in fact, if you curated it to just be college age players, U25 players. Every single player on each of their rosters would be able to play in the CHL despite having significantly fewer registered players to compete against than women's hockey in Canada or the USA. If this is also supposed to be attributed to despair, well...

If your allegation is that there are a bunch of women who are 25 and finishing college right now, who play the level of an average midget AAA player but would be able to be contributing CHL players if only there was a league? That's pretty implausible.
 
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kilowatt

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How many times are people going to walk blindly into this thread and repeat this same talking point thinking they are dropping some bombshell of information on everyone.
i'll f***in do it again
 

SNESChamp

Registered User
Jul 19, 2022
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Sorry, being a part of organised sports should be available to everyone.
Sports are not "available to everyone". They never will be, and they should not be. Some people are too old. Some people are too weak. Some people are too dumb. Some people don't have the time. Some people don't have the money. Some people don't have the coordination. Some people don't have the strength, speed, or competitive spirit. Ad infinitum.

This is called "reality". People are different. Some people are inferior and some people are superior. Men are superior at sports. This is why you there is segregation: because these organiztions (NCAA, Hockey Canada, et al) know full well that women are inferior to men, and so they segregate women so they can still be competitive amongst their own.

Men are also far more likely to have the intellectual talents which match their body's talents. So men are also superior at understanding plays, schemes, momentum, timing, rhythm, etc.

Let's take your logic to its conclusion: If everyone has the "right" to play hockey....then logically they must also have the "right" to play professional hockey, as well, right? Should 80 year olds be on the Tampa Bay Lighting? Should the Dallas Cowboys running back be an autistic teen? Should the New York Yankees roster have a quadriplegic women?

Your answer is obviously, "No." But you can't explain how that's different than saying that women should be given hockey leagues and it should all be subsidized by men's hockey. (Protip: It is.)

All of this absurdity stem from this psychotic obsession with trying to change women. To trying to force women to do things men already do. This obviously goes well beyond hockey. It goes into colleges and corporations, where women are given extreme preferential treatment if only they'll go into things like engineering or geological exploration.

I think only a civilization which hates women could want to force something so absurdly unnatural on them. No wonder there are so many Viagra ads in sports: all the male feminists watching them are so disgusted by women they need chemicals to love them.
 

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