CHL/NCAA

[coolhandluc44]

I think that is short sighted thinking on their part. The CHL churns out a tremendous amount of high quality players that don’t profile well as Professionals. However, they are all highly refined 21 year olds. They could end up signing a player like Jack Beck or Deni Goure who would both provide a significantly higher impact from day one than Malhotra. They’d be able to offer scholarships to players on the spot and suit them up inside 3 months.

The organizations that would more likely suffer are the CIS schools. The quality players that choose to go CIS will have NCAA opportunities.

It is but I think that’s why the big powerhouse schools don’t want the CHL players because they hold the competitive advantage over smaller schools. But if they smaller schools can start loading up on CHL players it would create more of a balance that powerhouse programs would not want that.

 

[OMG67]

It is but I think that’s why the big powerhouse schools don’t want the CHL players because they hold the competitive advantage over smaller schools. But if they smaller schools can start loading up on CHL players it would create more of a balance that powerhouse programs would not want that.

Maybe but the 21 year old CHL graduate is more likely to play the full 4 years. The studs we are mostly talking about are 1-2 year NCAA players. Those bigger schools will leverage the top 21 year old CHL players before they leverage a player like Fantilli who they know is likely only playing 1-2 years.

 

[swoopster]

The top NCAA programs don't care any longer if a player is there for 1 or 2 years. It has become a marketing strategy that continues to attract more top players for 1 or 2 years. The top echelon of NCAA hockey is now akin to the top powerhouse football conferences.

Barring a freak year, small market/ small programs are being squeezed out of relevance. The days of seeing a Lake Superior State win a NCAA Championship will be few and far between.

 

[bigsportsfan]

NCAA basketball is full of 18 year olds who play one season and then play in the NBA. Duke has a number of them every season. They call it one and done. I could see NCAA hockey doing the same with the elite players.

Many of you keep saying NCAA hockey teams only have a few elite 18 and 19 year olds. But the reason why they don't have more is that a lot of elite 18 and 19 year olds are playing in the CHL. The new rule opens the door for the NCAA to grab more elite 18 and 19 year olds.

 

[coolhandluc44]

NCAA basketball is full of 18 year olds who play one season and then play in the NBA. Duke has a number of them every season. They call it one and done. I could see NCAA hockey doing the same with the elite players.

Many of you keep saying NCAA hockey teams only have a few elite 18 and 19 year olds. But the reason why they don't have more is that a lot of elite 18 and 19 year olds are playing in the CHL. The new rule opens the door for the NCAA to grab more elite 18 and 19 year olds.

I don’t think you can compare hockey to basketball and football because there is no alternative development option like the CHL in those sports. Baseball is its own uniqueness as players are drafted out of high school or college. Also the CBA and when players are signed has a big impact too. More and more first round draft picks are signing entry level contracts upon being drafted. I counted 13 CHL players drafted in the first round this past draft, 11 of those are already signed. So unless the CBA or NCAA allows players signed to pro contracts to play, these players won’t be going to NCAA

Someone can correct me, but I don’t believe NCAA allows drafted and signed MLB prospects to play baseball. So I think that would be a good indication that they won’t allow signed entry level NHL players in.

 

[OMG67]

NCAA basketball is full of 18 year olds who play one season and then play in the NBA. Duke has a number of them every season. They call it one and done. I could see NCAA hockey doing the same with the elite players.

Many of you keep saying NCAA hockey teams only have a few elite 18 and 19 year olds. But the reason why they don't have more is that a lot of elite 18 and 19 year olds are playing in the CHL. The new rule opens the door for the NCAA to grab more elite 18 and 19 year olds.

The players that play CHL WANT to play CHL. They aren’t going to play as a 16 and 17 year old and then bolt to the NCAA. The only ones that would do that are the ones that want to play NCAA and are choosing now to play CHL instead of BCHL or the Jr loop.

The bonus is the ones who want to play NCAA can play a full 4-5 years of CHL and then go NCAA at 20-21. It allows for more options when they graduate from the CHL.

This is a situation where players can and will be more likely to play in a higher profile NCAA program at an older age rather than go the CIS route. I can see a lot of players choose NCAA over ECHL for 18 months and then CIS which we do see a lot of.

Having the NCAA for four years after CHL is a really good opportunity for players. It allows them to extend their competitive careers and potentially get them more opportunities than they would had they played ECHL or CIS.

Additionally, I can see situations where the players get partial scholarships that are partially funded by their CHL Scholarships. If a player has one year tuition, they can apply that to the NCAA school fees and the NCAA school would cover the rest.

I think there are a lot of great opportunities here for the players. I don’t think we’d see a mass exodus from CHL to NCAA. IF a CHL player is struggling to get ice time in the CHL as an 18 year old, it is more likely that player would not get a full ride scholarship, especially as a Canadian.

 

[RB76]

I can see the NCAA, CHL and the NHL working together to develop a structured and controlled optimal development path:

CHL / USHL (16-19yrs)
NCAA / CIS (20-23yrs)
AHL / NHL

In theory it would require certain guarantees such as a standard four year agreement for CHL / USHL, exceptions for super elite individuals, NIL changes to allow Canadian athletes to earn, etc., but the result could offer greater opportunities and possibilities for more players.

NIL money is changing the landscape rather quickly. Not saying NCAA Hockey will fully participate but Check out the following from the Athletic:

“We should start by going back to the recruitment of five-star quarterback Nico Iamaleava, who agreed to an unprecedented $8 million NIL deal in 2022 after committing to the Vols. It’s still a big number, but even just two years ago, it made waves. The largest NIL deal anyone had heard of was going to a QB who’d spurned steadier powers for oft-turbulent Tennessee.”

 

[OMG67]

I can see the NCAA, CHL and the NHL working together to develop a structured and controlled optimal development path:

CHL / USHL (16-19yrs)
NCAA / CIS (20-23yrs)
AHL / NHL

In theory it would require certain guarantees such as a standard four year agreement for CHL / USHL, exceptions for super elite individuals, NIL changes to allow Canadian athletes to earn, etc., but the result could offer greater opportunities and possibilities for more players.

NIL money is changing the landscape rather quickly. Not saying NCAA Hockey will fully participate but Check out the following from the Athletic:

“We should start by going back to the recruitment of five-star quarterback Nico Iamaleava, who agreed to an unprecedented $8 million NIL deal in 2022 after committing to the Vols. It’s still a big number, but even just two years ago, it made waves. The largest NIL deal anyone had heard of was going to a QB who’d spurned steadier powers for oft-turbulent Tennessee.”

The rules surrounding NIL for NCAA athletes makes it difficult for Canadians to collect it while at NCAA institutions. The amount of time they need to be in Canada to be on the right side of eligibility is the issue. So I’m not sure they could work around the NIL issues for Canadians.

 

[RB76]

All it is required is a change to government policy, granting student athletes the ability to secure a work permit while at school. It's more of an administrative move, but agree it might require someone challenging the rules before they decide to change it.

 

[Kingpin794]

All it is required is a change to government policy, granting student athletes the ability to secure a work permit while at school. It's more of an administrative move, but agree it might require someone challenging the rules before they decide to change it.

There are not enough people that give a damn about hockey and there aren't enough international athletes in football/basketball for the government (federal or states individually) to want to make that change.

 

[donjohnson]

There are not enough people that give a damn about hockey and there aren't enough international athletes in football/basketball for the government (federal or states individually) to want to make that change.

Correct...you had Zach Edey winning player of the year as a Canadian and not able to cash in and with a high-profile player like that it was crickets. Will probably take a 5-star FOOTBALL recruit from Canada to move the needle and even that might not get it done.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

The rules surrounding NIL for NCAA athletes makes it difficult for Canadians to collect it while at NCAA institutions. The amount of time they need to be in Canada to be on the right side of eligibility is the issue. So I’m not sure they could work around the NIL issues for Canadians.

It isn't that hard imo. Zach Edey from Toronto. Purdue had their team come to Toronto to play Alabama in a basketball. It wasn't a coincidence they played there. Even going to regionals in Detroit you see a lot ballers that have very little interest in the result of games. They habe other interests. Getting a leased luxury vehicle isn't hard to do either. It's opened up a lot more in the last 8-10 months. Not to mention these athletes aren't paying for these meals at a top steakhouse.

 

[OMG67]

It isn't that hard imo. Zach Edey from Toronto. Purdue had their team come to Toronto to play Alabama in a basketball. It wasn't a coincidence they played there. Even going to regionals in Detroit you see a lot ballers that have very little interest in the result of games. They habe other interests. Getting a leased luxury vehicle isn't hard to do either. It's opened up a lot more in the last 8-10 months. Not to mention these athletes aren't paying for these meals at a top steakhouse.

I think there are work arounds. It would require more frequent trips back to Canada. So, some concessions during the offseason and at certain periods throughout the year. Maybe some remote classes etc. If I remember correctly, it is total time in the USA with shorter intervals would make it possible. Where it doesn’t make sense is when it is a nominal amount for NIL. Someone getting $150k+ per year would be able to make it happen. It is the ones getting more like $10k where the travel back and forth isn't Worth it.

 

[bigsportsfan]

The players that play CHL WANT to play CHL. They aren’t going to play as a 16 and 17 year old and then bolt to the NCAA. The only ones that would do that are the ones that want to play NCAA and are choosing now to play CHL instead of BCHL or the Jr loop.

I think this is where you are wrong. Some players want to go the NCAA route but instead play in the CHL because it allows them to play at a higher level of hockey at the age of 16 rather than waiting until they are 18 to play in the NCAA. Now those players who come to the CHL for that reason will be able to move to the NCAA when they finish high school.

 

[OMG67]

I think this is where you are wrong. Some players want to go the NCAA route but instead play in the CHL because it allows them to play at a higher level of hockey at the age of 16 rather than waiting until they are 18 to play in the NCAA. Now those players who come to the CHL for that reason will be able to move to the NCAA when they finish high school.

It needs to be a two way street. The American kids are now gobbling up the lions share of scholarships. The days of any decent Canadian kid with some skill going NCAA on scholarship are over. Any player picked outside the 3rd round is typically not playing NCAA at 18. They simply aren’t good enough to get a full ride. Maybe they get a partial scholarship or a non-guarantee scholarship or a scholarship to a Div II or III school? Maybe.

This whole thought of 18 year old Canadian kids in the CHL with some sort of guaranteed pipeline to full ride scholarships is non-existent.

 

[digicamo]

I think this is where you are wrong. Some players want to go the NCAA route but instead play in the CHL because it allows them to play at a higher level of hockey at the age of 16 rather than waiting until they are 18 to play in the NCAA. Now those players who come to the CHL for that reason will be able to move to the NCAA when they finish high school.

I think you will see this on weaker teams which honestly might be good for the CHL to put some downward pressure on owners that consistently run a poor program. Take the Rangers as an example the Reid, Romano, Lam cohort are all in grade 12 right now. Why would they bolt to the NCAA next year knowing that the Rangers are building around them and looking to push for a mem cup?

However, if you're Ryan Roobroeck and Niagara continues to make head-scratching moves you may consider moving on if you don't see a path forward or a trade to a contender possible. You also have to factor in loyalty and the fear of how a move like that would be perceived in an 18-year-old kid's mind. I think a lot of kids will be hesitant to make a move like that unless they are really unhappy with their situation or they always wanted to head to the NCAA.

 

[MJ5]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1842316481477931162

 

[Dhockey16]

It'll be good for player development and is probably the right thing to do but there's a number of ways this could hurt the CHL. Hopefully the CHL finds a way to hang on to the D+1, D+2 19 year olds - those are the guys who really make the league. High draft picks who come back for an extra year or two of junior. If the league loses those players the quality of the on ice play will drop. What could be interesting is guys who are good enough to get NCAA scholarships but opt for CHL instead of BCHL or USHL or whatever. Presumably that would free up the money CHL would typically spend on education agreements..might allow the players to make some money, though I'm sure it'll have to be kept hush hush and ambiguous to some degree. "We know you have a scholarship coming to play at Penn State...so how does 75k cash sound to play two years with us?" Or something along those lines. Stuff that already goes on, just might be more frequent.

 

[Kingpin794]

And this is the important part. As long as the NCAA doesn’t allow guys to play once they sign their ELC, they are no true threat to the CHL. Bring the wall down.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1843678062040514627

 

[Otto]

And this is the important part. As long as the NCAA doesn’t allow guys to play once they sign their ELC, they are no true threat to the CHL. Bring the wall down.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1843678062040514627

Which pretty much means it's doubtful you see many if any 19 and under players leave the CHL for NCAA and will most likely only affect overagers. Pretty much what most of us have been saying.

 

[JoeSchmo]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1843711475963269244

 

[RayzorIsDull]

It needs to be a two way street. The American kids are now gobbling up the lions share of scholarships. The days of any decent Canadian kid with some skill going NCAA on scholarship are over. Any player picked outside the 3rd round is typically not playing NCAA at 18. They simply aren’t good enough to get a full ride. Maybe they get a partial scholarship or a non-guarantee scholarship or a scholarship to a Div II or III school? Maybe.

This whole thought of 18 year old Canadian kids in the CHL with some sort of guaranteed pipeline to full ride scholarships is non-existent.

NCAA increased scholarship limits for hockey to 26.

 

[coolhandluc44]

Which pretty much means it's doubtful you see many if any 19 and under players leave the CHL for NCAA and will most likely only affect overagers. Pretty much what most of us have been saying.

Which for the CHL you take that trade off. In theory you will get the players that where not coming to keep their NCAA eligibility. Worst case scenario maybe you loose some high profile OA's that you would have kept but you can only play 3 OA's anyway. So as a Bulldogs fan maybe we don't have a Lavoie this year but we get a Maholtra instead. Of course there will be outliers.

And I cant see NHL teams sending a player like a Cowan or Musty to college for one year and this includes if they made changes to players with signed NHL contracts being allowed to go to NCAA. These guys have to go to school and one of the drawbacks that no one mentions is that college plays half as many games as major junior. I

What is the compensation for USHL players? Are their players getting education packages like the CHL players. That is the only way I can see the USHL staying at a high level. The one thing that drives me crazy with the news articles is that they only mention CHL players get a stipend without mentioning the education package. When you say a player only gets a maximum of $600 a month and no education while there playing and when they are done you would think its crazy these guys would not go the NCAA route.
.

 

[OMG67]

NCAA increased scholarship limits for hockey to 26.

Is that for full ride or partial + Full ride?

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Is that for full ride or partial + Full ride?

Full ride. Basketball went up to 15, football will be 100-105. This is all part the 3 billion dollar revenue package being shared.