Value of: Chiarot to Calgary for Pelletier

[Hodge]

Canadiens have their 1st. They won't trade a 2023 1st.

I think Dvorak and Chiarot to Calgary for Monahan, Pelletier and a conditional draft pick could form the basis of an interesting trade. Conditions can be based on how far Calgary gets in the playoffs.

 

[HabsAddict]

A playoff warrior who may or may not help the Flames go on a deep run
vs
A Grade A prospect on a good development track who may or may not be a top 6F.

Pelletier is indeed a grade A prospect doing well as a 20 year old in the AHL. I know how some are going to flip out in defense of Pelletier but he is on the #1 ranked AHL team right now too. Non factor right?

Probability Pelletier is a top 6F in the NHL? No friggen idea. Just trying to gauge his potential and make no mistake, he is a Grade A prospect. However, Dube had good AHL numbers in his age 20 season as well. When Dube put up those numbers, he was on the 29th ranked team that year. Go figue eh.

There is a reason there is a vast difference between "Grade A" prospects and players who are actually in the NHL. The AHL is littered with players who had promise and did well in the AHL only to go nowhere fast and become AHL lifers...or European leagues.

I'm not going to waste my time on trading Chairot AND Dvorak. That is way too much and on top of that, we need Dvorak. Our center depth is thin and I doubt that Poehling or Evans are 2C material. In fact, we are in all kinds of hell if Suzuki gets hurt.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I think Dvorak and Chiarot to Calgary for Monahan, Pelletier and a conditional draft pick could form the basis of an interesting trade. Conditions can be based on how far Calgary gets in the playoffs.

To be honest, for as much as the Habs like Pelletier, I am not sure they are open to having less cap space next year after the Dvorak/Monahan swap. Very interesting idea though. It would depend on the Habs ability to move out Hoffman and Petry this summer.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

What if the Habs traded Dvorak and Chiarot to Calgary and took Monahan back as a cap dump? Would that be worth Pelletier? Pelletier+2nd? Even more?

How much better is Dvorak than Monahan though? Seems like more of a wash to me that gives Calgary a little bit of cap relief in exchange for Montreal getting out of a long term deal during their rebuild

 

[Hodge]

How much better is Dvorak than Monahan though? Seems like more of a wash to me that gives Calgary a little bit of cap relief in exchange for Montreal getting out of a long term deal during their rebuild

Monahan has fallen off a cliff, doesn't really fit in the Flames lineup and makes way too much money. Dvorak is more of a Sutter player and a legit 3C.

 

[Habs Halifax]

There is a reason there is a vast difference between "Grade A" prospects and players who are actually in the NHL. The AHL is littered with players who had promise and did well in the AHL only to go nowhere fast and become AHL lifers...or European leagues.

I'm not going to waste my time on trading Chairot AND Dvorak. That is way too much and on top of that, we need Dvorak. Our center depth is thin and I doubt that Poehling or Evans are 2C material. In fact, we are in all kinds of hell if Suzuki gets hurt.

With the Dvorak and Monahan swap, I'm more concerned about how our cap space is less next year to be honest. Comes down to what else they offer on top of Pelletier and the Habs ability to move out Hoffman and Petry to create the cap flexibility we are after. I have no doubt in my mind that Hughes does not want Weber on LTIR before the season starts again. So that's basically $8M less cap space we can use this offseason. Right now, I believe we are at 17 players signed with $80M in cap hits (including Weber). But that don't include Lehkonen, Romanov, and Pitlick.

I like Pelletier a lot but he's not a sure shot top 6F in the NHL. He's on a good development track but you just don't know that for sure and he is on the best AHL team right now. I would need an extra piece on top for me to really consider it. I know how that sounds to the Flames cause they really like Pelletier too but he's not a guaranteed hit. He has a good shot at it yes.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Monahan has fallen off a cliff, doesn't really fit in the Flames lineup and makes way too much money. Dvorak is more of a Sutter player and a legit 3C.

I literally linked both players compared this year. Monahan is no longer a 1C in Calgary, that's obvious but Dvorak is not worth nearly what Montreal paid for him this summer with how he's performed either. Maybe click the link and look at their head to head stats

 

[Habs Halifax]

How much better is Dvorak than Monahan though? Seems like more of a wash to me that gives Calgary a little bit of cap relief in exchange for Montreal getting out of a long term deal during their rebuild

I believe they are close. The difference is cap hit and team control with Dvorak.

 

[HabsAddict]

Pelletier+1st? Pelletier is not a franchise player but point per game in the AHL at 20 gives him a good chance to be a top six forward who's around the same age as Caufield and Suzuki.

We can't afford to trade Dvorak. I don't know much about Pelletier other then what I read from stats and a few opinions from posters so my comments are generic in their perceived values.

IF.....a big IF Pelletier is highly thought of by the Habs brain trust, I could see a trade for Chiarot and minor tweaks back or forth, but certainly not for someone we need and have very little depth of.

 

[Hodge]

I literally linked both players compared this year. Monahan is no longer a 1C in Calgary, that's obvious but Dvorak is not worth nearly what Montreal paid for him this summer with how he's performed either. Maybe click the link and look at their head to head stats

Maybe realize one is on the best possession team in the league while the other is on one of the worst before linking context free stats. Montreal is not getting back what they paid for Dvorak in my proposal.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

I believe they are close. The difference is cap hit and team control with Dvorak.

Yes but that add wouldn't justify Pelletier. Dvorak is injured anyways so him being moved this deadline in exchange for a healthy player on a contender is just not a realistic scenario

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Maybe realize one is on the best possession team in the league while the other is on one of the worst before linking context free stats. Montreal is not getting back what they paid for Dvorak in my proposal.

They are getting more, they get whatever Monahan can be flipped for at 50% at next deadline, + Pelletier who is worth more than Florida's 1st and a 3rd, + the 2023 1st

 

[Kimota]

The simple solution is you add some stuff with Chiatot and you get Pelletier.

 

[HabsAddict]

With the Dvorak and Monahan swap, I'm more concerned about how our cap space is less next year to be honest. Comes down to what else they offer on top of Pelletier and the Habs ability to move out Hoffman and Petry to create the cap flexibility we are after. I have no doubt in my mind that Hughes does not want Weber on LTIR before the season starts again. So that's basically $8M less cap space we can use this offseason. Right now, I believe we are at 17 players signed with $80M in cap hits (including Weber). But that don't include Lehkonen, Romanov, and Pitlick.

I like Pelletier a lot but he's not a sure shot top 6F in the NHL. He's on a good development track but you just don't know that for sure and he is on the best AHL team right now. I would need an extra piece on top for me to really consider it. I know how that sounds to the Flames cause they really like Pelletier too but he's not a guaranteed hit. He has a good shot at it yes.

I've lit the "BE GONE" candles on both Weber and Price. They are both anchors that we need off the books so we can move on.

Next year, I like to see Chairot back and Kadri, both on around 5 million decent contracts. And of course a 5-6 million upper level starting goalie. Then Brooks/Guhle and a few other youngsters vie for a permanent spot on the team. I don't think we have much future on a few AHLers who stuck around but are basically are AHLers on overdrive.

I'm not much into the tank-until-you-build-a-contender. Far too often it becomes a futile game of bottom dwelling and hope. Buffalo is a prime example and others too.

Clean up and build up.....

 

[Bond]

The simple solution is you add some stuff with Chiatot and you get Pelletier.

Chiarot isn't a base for Pelletier. Flames will need some forwards on ELCs.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I've lit the "BE GONE" candles on both Weber and Price. They are both anchors that we need off the books so we can move on.

Next year, I like to see Chairot back and Kadri, both on around 5 million decent contracts. And of course a 5-6 million upper level starting goalie. Then Brooks/Guhle and a few other youngsters vie for a permanent spot on the team. I don't think we have much future on a few AHLers who stuck around but are basically are AHLers on overdrive.

I'm not much into the tank-until-you-build-a-contender. Far too often it becomes a futile game of bottom dwelling and hope. Buffalo is a prime example and others too.

Clean up and build up.....

Weber is a LTIR contract that we may or may not be able to move to cap floor team. We will see.

Price is coming back. He's got gas left but the idea of trading him comes after he plays full time next year.

Kadri is not going to sign with the Habs. I'll make a $100 bet with you on that.

Chiarot may or may not sign with us. I don't think we will try to sign him. Where are we getting this magical cap space? There are other teams trying to unload contracts as well right? If you try to move either of Gallagher or Petry, you will have to take a contract back. Think Atkinson/Voraceck trade.

Clean up and build up is going to happen but it's not happening in one off season.

 

[crazyfisherman]

What if the Habs traded Dvorak and Chiarot to Calgary and took Monahan back as a cap dump? Would that be worth Pelletier? Pelletier+2nd? Even more?

No, not trading a blue chip prospect for a bunch of bottom pair D and bottom 6 fwd. If it was a Hertl caliber player, sure, definitely not any of the names mentioned here.

 

[DFF]

I hope we don't acquire Pelletier. Nice player but small winger. How much trade value does he have when can waiver claim a Pitlick or sign a Toffoli as UFA? Pelletier is better player but they good also without giving anything up

Lol….so all small wingers have no value?

 

[Habs Halifax]

No, not trading a blue chip prospect for a bunch of bottom pair D and bottom 6 fwd. If it was a Hertl caliber player, sure, definitely not any of the names mentioned here.

Blue Chip? If he was blue chip, he would be on your roster this season. He's a grade A on a very good development track. I support you protecting him but hold off from over pumping his value with the Blue Chip narrative. Makar was a Blue Chip.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Lol….so all small wingers have no value?

I don't think he said no value with his context so laugh at yourself all day long. I like Pelletier a lot and you should be high on him but lets stop shy of considering him a top 6F lock. If he was that good, he would be on your roster this season.

Look no further than Dube who also had a good age 20 AHL season. He even did that when the Heat was bottom 3 in the AHL and Pelletier is with the Heat this year where they are ranked 1st at the moment. Go figure eh?

The main point? You should be happy with what he is doing but he's not a sure shot top 6F. If he was, he would have made your roster this season. Undersized skilled forwards can struggle in the NHL. So far, he's holding his own in the AHL and that's a good sign yes

 

[DFF]

Blue Chip? If he was blue chip, he would be on your roster this season. He's a grade A on a very good development track. I support you protecting him but hold off from over pumping his value with the Blue Chip narrative. Makar was a Blue Chip.

Some are more blue than others lol

 

[DFF]

I don't think he said no value with his context so laugh at yourself all day long. I like Pelletier a lot and you should be high on him but lets stop shy of considering him a top 6F lock. If he was that good, he would be on your roster this season.

Look no further than Dube who also had a good age 20 AHL season. He even did that when the Heat was bottom 3 in the AHL and Pelletier is with the Heat this year where they are ranked 1st at the moment. Go figure eh?

The main point? You should be happy with what he is doing but he's not a sure shot top 6F. If he was, he would have made your roster this season.

He compared him to a waiver pickup
That is so f***ing wrong and you know it

 

[Habs Halifax]

Some are more blue than others lol

Blue chip is once they turn pro, the are in the NHL. Pelletier is a grade A, not a blue chip. Not according to my standards anyways. We can go back to what Flames fans said about Dube when he was age 20 as well. I keep bring this up cause it should click with Flames fans. Do you want me to throw out this garbage... "Flames fans overrate their prospects"? I rather not

Blue Chip: NHL player once they turn pro

Grade A: Drafted in the 1st round mostly with very good development. Strong chance at being a NHL player and possibly a top 4D or top 6F. You can separate those guys by A- and A+ if you wish. That's the range you are basically talking about. Pelletier to me would be a very solid A.

Grade B: This is where it varies by a lot. I personally use B and B+ with many guys. Habs are loaded with them right now. I even have a guy like Roy who is near 2 pts/game in the Q at age 18 as a B+ prospect (not grade A). These guys could bust, disappoint, or be a grade A if they produce well in the AHL after turning pro.

Grade C: Long shot to make the NHL.

 

[DFF]

Blue chip is once they turn pro, the are in the NHL. Pelletier is a grade A, not a blue chip. Not according to my standards anyways. We can go back to what Flames fans said about Dube when he was age 20 as well. I keep bring this up cause it should click with Flames fans. Do you want me to throw out this garbage... "Flames fans overrate their prospects"? I rather not

I don’t think he is neither…..just saying there are many shades of blue and just meaningless opinion.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I don’t think he is neither…..just saying there are many shades of blue and just meaningless opinion.

I don't agree. I think there are more ranges with Grade B's than there are with Grade A's and even less with Blue Chips. A blue chip prospect to me is a NHL player the min they turn pro. There are not many of them.

You might have overlap on what Blue Chip is vs what my Grade A's are. I have very high standards for Blue Chip prospects. That's Makar types. He turns pro and produces right away where the confidence he would do well is there before plays one NHL game.