Player Discussion Charlie McAvoy IV

[KillerMillerTime]

He has to be <100%. I've never seen him play this consistently poor. If it's mental, we're in trouble.

Don't see his skating or puck handling compromised.

 

[Ladyfan]

Mac looks defeated. Something is not right.

 

[Mad-Marcus]

Don't see his skating or puck handling compromised.

As I said in the 2nd sentence, if it's mental, we're in trouble.

Did someone script a weird they switch bodies movie, with McAvoy and Lindholm. Cuz Lindholm's playing better at the same time McAvoy is playing poorly!

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Did you see it last night?

I say that mostly in jest, because as I've said elsewhere I give the players mostly a free pass for that game on account of fatigue, and that has to include McAvoy. But at the same time, some of the sloppy play that's been evident from him for a little while was very much on display here.

As someone who's offered some mild criticism of Charlie of late, I think in the first instance you can immediately discount the extreme - on the whole I don't think he's been bad even though he's made some bad plays. I'd say he's been mostly good alongside stretches of great mixed with some pretty poor patches and very occasional errors that a player of his calibre shouldn't be making. And people have really started to notice those, which draws more attention and more collective heat whenever another even half a gaffe happens. It's a vicious and admittedly unfair circle.

Beyond that, it's a question of what do you expect out of the guy? A solid, pretty consistent 1D who can play lots of minutes and in multiple roles? Tick. Shouldn't be much reasonable argument about that. But if you think he could or should be capable of more, especially in the playoffs when it matters most, in terms of being outright elite either through being a dominant shutdown defender, transitional playmaker, or offensive whiz, or some combination of them, all topped by a razor sharp hockey IQ and clear thinking under pressure at all times, it's not happening. If there's an extra gear he hasn't found it yet.

Is that asking too much? Answer that and you'll have your perspective on whether the criticism is valid, overblown or completely out to lunch.

First year he is playing w\o one of #33 or #37.

 

[Thomas 11]

Needs to have his minutes reduced. 22 a game and he will make better decisions.

 

[Bruinfanatic]

Mac looks defeated. Something is not right.

This is getting to be a regular occurrence for him in the playoffs,which is pretty concerning if it’s a injury is one thing,if it’s a mental issue it’s another thing.

 

[Hookslide]

Charlie is an excellent defenseman, even the number one the Bruins projected him to be.

More than a stay at home, shut down D who can be physical (though not consistently enough to strike automatic fear into opponents), at his best he does many things well.

Again, I don't see him as a natural power play quarterback. He's a pass first guy, which is fine, but that trait is predictable, possible to neutralize, and therefore of limited value.

None of this means McAvoy isn't a top D in the NHL.

What it means, at least to me, is that his floor is solid and well established, but perhaps his ceiling is as well.

I'm not certain that's worth 9 million a year.

I am starting to see what you are saying more and more, not sure why, he seems like something is missing. good player but.........

 

[Hookslide]

Interesting stat about McAvoy: he's skated the most miles out of anyone so far in the playoffs and by an incredible margin.

( these are skating miles tracked by NHL Edge )

• Charlie McAvoy 31.13
• Miro Heiskanen 27.81
• Thomas Harley 26.01
• Morgan Rielly 25.92
• Noah Hanifin 25.64
• Jack Eichel 25.09
• David Pastrnak 25.05
• Brad Marchand 24.59
• Shea Theodore 24.56
• Jake DeBrusk 24.19

Not always big on some of the stats that they throw out there today in all sports, but I think you have a interesting one there and it might point to the problem with Macs game lately .

 

[DarrenBanks56]

whatever the issue. at his cap hit he is letting the team down right now.
its not a skill issue. i just think hes not smart out there.
i mean take tge 2nd goal. he was 5 feet from his stick. why not pick it up?? stupid.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

First year he is playing w\o one of #33 or #37.

I think missing Bergeron is a big factor. They played a lot together 5 on 5. Clearly Patrice was the "defensive coordinator" on the ice. McAvoy's offensive numbers didn't suffer this season. Had a career high 12 goals. But after being +140 over 6 seasons, this year he was +4. His numbers in the playoffs are not really that much different so far this season as in the past.

 

[Yeti34]

He seems to be falling over a lot. Which is not something you typically see from him.

I do expect a bounce back for him. If he’s injured he needs to make some adjustments as does Monty.

 

[Comedy of Errors]

Did you see it last night?

I say that mostly in jest, because as I've said elsewhere I give the players mostly a free pass for that game on account of fatigue, and that has to include McAvoy. But at the same time, some of the sloppy play that's been evident from him for a little while was very much on display here.

As someone who's offered some mild criticism of Charlie of late, I think in the first instance you can immediately discount the extreme - on the whole I don't think he's been bad even though he's made some bad plays. I'd say he's been mostly good alongside stretches of great mixed with some pretty poor patches and very occasional errors that a player of his calibre shouldn't be making. And people have really started to notice those, which draws more attention and more collective heat whenever another even half a gaffe happens. It's a vicious and admittedly unfair circle.

Beyond that, it's a question of what do you expect out of the guy? A solid, pretty consistent 1D who can play lots of minutes and in multiple roles? Tick. Shouldn't be much reasonable argument about that. But if you think he could or should be capable of more, especially in the playoffs when it matters most, in terms of being outright elite either through being a dominant shutdown defender, transitional playmaker, or offensive whiz, or some combination of them, all topped by a razor sharp hockey IQ and clear thinking under pressure at all times, it's not happening. If there's an extra gear he hasn't found it yet.

Is that asking too much? Answer that and you'll have your perspective on whether the criticism is valid, overblown or completely out to lunch.

I can't entirely agree with your point that we should be, on balance, satisfied with McAvoy contribution; waiting for him to find another gear. He's paid like an elite dominant defenceman to be an elite dominant defenceman. He's starting to look like a Joe Thorntonesque player. Someone who shows sparks of dominant talent only to see they are not dominant players.

Maybe the criticisms from fans and the press will start an inner self-evaluation and he will find that next level; hopefully right quick, or this series will not only cost the Bruins a Stanley Cup but solidify his reputation as an overpaid 2nd or 3rd D'man.

 

[GordonHowe]

I am starting to see what you are saying more and more, not sure why, he seems like something is missing. good player but.........

There's room to grow, but I'm not certain that will happen.

I think next year is going to be a big year for him, one way or another.

 

[TD Charlie]

All of the things he did well, he's doing poorly right now.

Skating, passing, stick handling, positioning, hitting. etc etc etc.

He looks like an entirely different player

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

There's room to grow, but I'm not certain that will happen.

I think next year is going to be a big year for him, one way or another.

Think we've said that for a couple of years now.

 

[Midship]

All of the things he did well, he's doing poorly right now.

Skating, passing, stick handling, positioning, hitting. etc etc etc.

He looks like an entirely different player

He looked considerably better as an 18yo rookie. Truly puzzling.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

First year he is playing w\o one of #33 or #37.

I think missing Bergeron is a big factor. They played a lot together 5 on 5. Clearly Patrice was the "defensive coordinator" on the ice. McAvoy's offensive numbers didn't suffer this season. Had a career high 12 goals. But after being +140 over 6 seasons, this year he was +4. His numbers in the playoffs are not really that much different so far this season as in the past.

I think that's definitely a factor. One thing I will say in partial defense of Charlie is that the entire team's defensive numbers and stats around shot and chance attempts etc. took a nose dive this year, not just compared to the abnormal 2022-23 season, but a few before that as well. The loss of Bergeron and Krejci, and arguably even a Foligno, was definitely felt in that regard. In that sense McAvoy's declining advanced stats and plus/minus were broadly consistent with the whole team.

But at the same time guys like Carlo (+23) and even Lindholm (+18, despite some pretty rough stretches) largely bucked that trend, and while you can probably put McAvoy's comparatively low +4 at least partly down to him consistently facing the best opposing forwards, and some sheer luck, I think it's hard to avoid the conclusion that he found the going that bit harder this year.

Now that he's had a full season to get used to life post-Bergy perhaps he'll adjust and be better for it. Feels like in some ways he's still learning, which for a defender isn't so strange even at 26, so we'll see where he goes from here.

 

[ODAAT]

many of those hating on McAvoy would be crying tears had he never returned from that hit yesterday

Kid plays 25-30 mins nightly, ain`t all gonna be winners

 

[Aussie Bruin]

I can't entirely agree with your point that we should be, on balance, satisfied with McAvoy contribution; waiting for him to find another gear. He's paid like an elite dominant defenceman to be an elite dominant defenceman. He's starting to look like a Joe Thorntonesque player. Someone who shows sparks of dominant talent only to see they are not dominant players.

Maybe the criticisms from fans and the press will start an inner self-evaluation and he will find that next level; hopefully right quick, or this series will not only cost the Bruins a Stanley Cup but solidify his reputation as an overpaid 2nd or 3rd D'man.

I didn't say we should be satisfied, I said whether or not you will be depends on how much you expect from him. Personally I expect a little more, so while I'm certainly not hating his play I do think he's a bit below where he should be.

Is he earning his keep? I don't think he's far of it. To me he's still a 1D, even if he's not excelling. But is he a really dominant, top end 1D? Not at the moment.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I think that's definitely a factor. One thing I will say in partial defense of Charlie is that the entire team's defensive numbers and stats around shot and chance attempts etc. took a nose dive this year, not just compared to the abnormal 2022-23 season, but a few before that as well. The loss of Bergeron and Krejci, and arguably even a Foligno, was definitely felt in that regard. In that sense McAvoy's declining advanced stats and plus/minus were broadly consistent with the whole team.

But at the same time guys like Carlo (+23) and even Lindholm (+18, despite some pretty rough stretches) largely bucked that trend, and while you can probably put McAvoy's comparatively low +4 at least partly down to him consistently facing the best opposing forwards, and some sheer luck, I think it's hard to avoid the conclusion that he found the going that bit harder this year.

Now that he's had a full season to get used to life post-Bergy perhaps he'll adjust and be better for it. Feels like in some ways he's still learning, which for a defender isn't so strange even at 26, so we'll see where he goes from here.

The only regular defenseman with a worse plus/minus than Charlie this season was Shattenkirk. Even Grzelcyk was +13.

Then there's the case of Bergy's riding partner, Marchand. Career +290 over 14 seasons, was +2 this year.

But as you said, 26 and still time to learn.

 

[Ladyfan]

many of those hating on McAvoy would be crying tears had he never returned from that hit yesterday

Kid plays 25-30 mins nightly, ain`t all gonna be winners

I would hope no Bs fan would hate Mac. Kid plays hard.

I just hope he is OK. He seems a bit off of late.

 

[Comedy of Errors]

I didn't say we should be satisfied, I said whether or not you will be depends on how much you expect from him. Personally I expect a little more, so while I'm certainly not hating his play I do think he's a bit below where he should be.

Is he earning his keep? I don't think he's far of it. To me he's still a 1D, even if he's not excelling. But is he a really dominant, top end 1D? Not at the moment.

McAvoy is being paid far more than Ray Bourque in his last year as a Bruin, even counting inflation.

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This is Charlies 5th year. Lets just say he has a lot to prove.

 

[BMC]

I don't know if he's hurt, inside his own head or both. All I know is he is not playing like an elite #1 defenseman should play.

 

[Bradely]

He looked considerably better as an 18yo rookie. Truly puzzling.

Tough assignment was not his. Expectation was different.

 

[LSCII]

This place is hilarious. After game one so many of you were ready to plan the parade and build statues of all the players. Fast forward to the next game, and everyone sucks, our best players aren't really good, and Charlie is the reason. Dude had a bad night, but so did everyone on the roster. Shit happens. They were due for a letdown after a long hard fought series vs Toronto and them coasting in game one to an easy win. They came out last night and didn't match FLA's intensity and focus. But you know what? All they had to do was steal one down in FLA and they did. Now they can come home and rebound. FLA has all the pressure on them. They're supposed to win, and Boston embarrassed them in game one. So they came back and showed some pride. Now it's Boston's turn.

Stop being so f***ing bipolar guys, there's a lot of hockey yet to be played in this series, FFS...