Confirmed Signing with Link: [CGY] Calgary re-signs Sean Monahan (7 Years, $6.375M AAV)

[Whileee]

How so?

Scored at a 70 point pace last year... Monahan hasn't done that yet.

Scheifele had 2.50 points/60 5v5 last season, well above Monahan's best season.

Scheifele's shot metrics (Corsi) have been well above Monahan's, especially this past season.

Monahan might catch and surpass Scheifele, but given Scheifele's trajectory in development I don't think that's a given.

 

[Ashasx]

Scored at a 70 point pace last year... Monahan hasn't done that yet.

Scheifele had 2.50 points/60 5v5 last season, well above Monahan's best season.

Scheifele's shot metrics (Corsi) have been well above Monahan's, especially this past season.

Monahan might catch and surpass Scheifele, but given Scheifele's trajectory in development I don't think that's a given.

Scheifele is also notably older than Monahan (17 months), and his possession metrics weren't anything to write home about before this past season.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

well done Flames... perfect amount

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Monahan can hold his own without Gaudreau, stick to the Devils.

Am I not allowed to have an opinion because I'm not a Flames fan? Maybe I should change my user name to make you think I am a Flames fan, like you did to troll Oiler fans?

He's a fine player on his own, no doubt, but he's more of a 25g 50-55p center IMO. I just don't think he should be getting paid Barkov money, let alone $475k more than Barkov (even though they got 1 more UFA year).

He's not grossly overpaid at 6.4, but that is higher than I, and many other fans, would have thought.

 

[King In The North]

Scored at a 70 point pace last year... Monahan hasn't done that yet.

Scheifele had 2.50 points/60 5v5 last season, well above Monahan's best season.

Scheifele's shot metrics (Corsi) have been well above Monahan's, especially this past season.

Monahan might catch and surpass Scheifele, but given Scheifele's trajectory in development I don't think that's a given.

Monahan has either equaled or outproduced Scheifele in each of the past 3 seasons and is younger than Scheifele.

If Monahan is outproducing Scheif with worse advanced stats I look forward to when Calgary deploys a possession based system under Gulutzan.

It's not Monahan that "might catch and surpass" here.

 

[yourbestfriend]

Scored at a 70 point pace last year... Monahan hasn't done that yet.

Scheifele had 2.50 points/60 5v5 last season, well above Monahan's best season.

Scheifele's shot metrics (Corsi) have been well above Monahan's, especially this past season.

Monahan might catch and surpass Scheifele, but given Scheifele's trajectory in development I don't think that's a given.

Catch up? Scheifele is two years older than Monahan.
draft+3, Scheifele was 63GP 13 G 21A 34P
draft+3, Monahan, was 81GP 27G 36A 63P

Scheifele SHOULD be further along in his development curve than Monahan. Saying that Monahan has a lower trajectory when he's 2 years younger and has proven more at the same age doesn't make any logical sense

 

[The Alien]

Seems about what was expected.

 

[SmellOfVictory]

Am I not allowed to have an opinion because I'm not a Flames fan? Maybe I should change my user name to make you think I am a Flames fan, like you did to troll Oiler fans?

He's a fine player on his own, no doubt, but he's more of a 25g 50-55p center IMO. I just don't think he should be getting paid Barkov money, let alone $475k more than Barkov (even though they got 1 more UFA year).

He's not grossly overpaid at 6.4, but that is higher than I, and many other fans, would have thought.

The biggest factor in salary negotiation for forwards (and most skaters) is almost always point production, and specifically goal production. Monahan's cap hit may not seem ideal to everyone, but I can't see how it's possibly unexpected, given that he's the leading goal scorer of his draft class by a wide margin. If anything Barkov's contract was just a sweetheart deal from the outset.

 

[TheStroker]

Am I not allowed to have an opinion because I'm not a Flames fan? Maybe I should change my user name to make you think I am a Flames fan, like you did to troll Oiler fans?

He's a fine player on his own, no doubt, but he's more of a 25g 50-55p center IMO. I just don't think he should be getting paid Barkov money, let alone $475k more than Barkov (even though they got 1 more UFA year).

He's not grossly overpaid at 6.4, but that is higher than I, and many other fans, would have thought.

It's a fair contract for both sides. This whole argument about him riding Gaudreau's coattails gets really annoying. You do know that chemistry is an important part of hockey, right? You want your team to win games? You need chemistry. So what if Gaudreau gets Monahan more points? You WANT players to have chemistry together. And these 2 have clearly found it at a young age.

You make it seem like it's a knock on Monahan that he's found great chemistry with another great player. Who knows, maybe Gaudreau doesn't have as high point totals without Monahan finishing his setups. It works both ways and it clearly works well.

This is a great deal for the Flames. One of the best young C's in the game locked up for the majority of his prime at a great term and cap hit. Really there isn't much to not like.

 

[tfong]

Yay. About the amount I expected.

 

[King In The North]

Am I not allowed to have an opinion because I'm not a Flames fan? Maybe I should change my user name to make you think I am a Flames fan, like you did to troll Oiler fans?

He's a fine player on his own, no doubt, but he's more of a 25g 50-55p center IMO. I just don't think he should be getting paid Barkov money, let alone $475k more than Barkov (even though they got 1 more UFA year).

He's not grossly overpaid at 6.4, but that is higher than I, and many other fans, would have thought.

Not many other fans think this is higher than he should have been signed. But this is the risk you take.

If you want to sign him for less AAV you bet he's not going to agree at 7 years. So then what, after a bridge deal at 2-3 years and consistent or better production (which is the likely thing to happen, given his position on the team).

You think he'll settle for $6.4 m? Absolutely not. He would have more leverage with more years of production under his belt.

 

[OvermanKingGainer]

skeptical. paying for what ifs right now. hopefully it pays off

Huh?

Find me some contracts in the last decade for a 21YO (going on 22) centre with the following history:

245+ games (Monahan has 248)
80+ goals (Monahan has 83)
80+ assists (Monahan has 82)
2300+ faceoffs won (Monahan has won 2359 of 4821)

Now tell me who among those players signed for less than this sort of Year-1 cap hit (8.73% of the cap) without sacrificing a decent term (6+ seasons)

For brevity's sake I'll even run the math through a spreadsheet for you:

Season|Salary Cap|Player AAV
2006|39.0|3.406
2007|44.0|3.842
2008|50.3|4.393
2009|56.7|4.952
2010|56.8|4.960
2011|59.4|5.187
2012|64.3|5.615
2013|70.2|6.130*
2014|64.3|5.615
2015|69.0|6.026
2016|71.4|6.235
2017|73.0|6.375

EDIT: well I went and did the searching myself. Since Hockey reference only lets you search RS OR playoffs rather than both, I had to reduce the values to 235 RS GP, 75G, 75A for players 18 to 21 in their first, second, and third years. These were the results since 2006-07 (so last ten seasons):

1 Patrick Kane
2 Steven Stamkos
3 John Tavares
4 Sean Monahan
5 Anze Kopitar

These were cap hits after their first contracts were up:

1. 6,300,000 x 5 Years in 2011 (vs 5.187)
2. 7,500,000 x 5 Years in 2012 (vs 5.615)
3. 5,500,000 x 6 Years in 2013 (vs 6.130*)
4. 6,375,000 x 7 Years in 2017(vs 6.375)
5. 6,800,000 x 7 Years in 2010 (vs 4.960)
*lockout shortened season had a wonky cap total.

I'm not saying Monahan doesn't have flaws, but when you're doing a contract and making it off history, the only guy in this exclusive group who made a smaller proportion of the cap was Tavares, and that's somewhat misleading because his second contract started in the lockout season. The only other guy whose team locked him down for the same term was Kopitar, and that contract still seemed too short. I even forgot to do the faceoffs bit, or that would have removed Kane from the mix.

On a side note, if Kane is the comparable for Gaudreau, that would be a cap hit of $7,743,000 in today's dollars.

 

[King In The North]

Catch up? Scheifele is two years older than Monahan.
draft+3, Scheifele was 63GP 13 G 21A 34P
draft+3, Monahan, was 81GP 27G 36A 63P

Scheifele SHOULD be further along in his development curve than Monahan. Saying that Monahan has a lower trajectory when he's 2 years younger and has proven more at the same age doesn't make any logical sense

I love how point totals were ignored in the argument lol.

And just to point out, I'm a fan of Sheif and love his deal. But to say he's better than Monahan now? No, not yet at least.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

The biggest factor in salary negotiation for forwards (and most skaters) is almost always point production, and specifically goal production. Monahan's cap hit may not seem ideal to everyone, but I can't see how it's possibly unexpected, given that he's the leading goal scorer of his draft class by a wide margin. If anything Barkov's contract was just a sweetheart deal from the outset.

True, I just assumed that some WOWY analysis would have been used to support tougher negotiations from Calgary. He's also been a bit overrated in his two way play IMO, which I thought would have played a part as well.

It's a fair contract for both sides. This whole argument about him riding Gaudreau's coattails gets really annoying. You do know that chemistry is an important part of hockey, right? You want your team to win games? You need chemistry. So what if Gaudreau gets Monahan more points? You WANT players to have chemistry together. And these 2 have clearly found it at a young age.

You make it seem like it's a knock on Monahan that he's found great chemistry with another great player. Who knows, maybe Gaudreau doesn't have as high point totals without Monahan finishing his setups. It works both ways and it clearly works well.

This is a great deal for the Flames. One of the best young C's in the game locked up for the majority of his prime at a great term and cap hit. Really there isn't much to not like.

Its not a knock on Monahan, but there is little doubt that playing with Gaudreau has inflated his production and therefore his value. We've already seen Gaudreau perform and produce regardless of whether he's with Monahan or not. But we haven't seen the same from Monahan.

Not many other fans think this is higher than he should have been signed. But this is the risk you take.

If you want to sign him for less AAV you bet he's not going to agree at 7 years. So then what, after a bridge deal at 2-3 years and consistent or better production (which is the likely thing to happen, given his position on the team).

You think he'll settle for $6.4 m? Absolutely not. He would have more leverage with more years of production under his belt.

Like I said, its not awful value, Just a bit higher than I would have hoped for from a Flames perspective. He's still got a lot of upside beyond where he is at IMO, which makes the risk worth taking at the end of the day. But then you are paying a bit more for what he could/should become vs what he is today.

In the end of the day, they locked up a core player for a long time at a price that shouldn't break the bank, so its a good day for Flames fans.

 

[irunthepeg]

skeptical. paying for what ifs right now. hopefully it pays off

What ifs??? He's scored back to back 60 points... this is in no way a what if deal. Monahan is a stud player.

 

[King In The North]

Like I said, its not awful value, Just a bit higher than I would have hoped for from a Flames perspective. He's still got a lot of upside beyond where he is at IMO, which makes the risk worth taking at the end of the day. But then you are paying a bit more for what he could/should become vs what he is today.

In the end of the day, they locked up a core player for a long time at a price that shouldn't break the bank, so its a good day for Flames fans.

It's about what Flames fans were hoping for in terms of value, it looks good to us. I see your point, but generally speaking I (we all) feel pretty good about what he could/should become in years to come.

 

[Rubi]

Now if the Flames can get Gaudreau signed soon..

Would like to see him signed for 7-8 years but I suspect it will probably be for 6

 

[perronist]

Beefy. That is a totally okay contract, in my opinion. Monahan has work to do as far as his two-way play (ironic since that's what people seem to think he's best at) but it's a solid deal for a kid who has broken 30 goals, and approached it a second time, while on his ELC.

this is close to my thinking. not a huge steal by any means but seems alright. hope that his offseason work (plus a new system!) translates into improved skating and overall impact on the game.

 

[Legend123]

over payment methinks. Scheifelle is a lot better btw. Stop arguing over everything. He's bigger, more talented, better 2 way player and better on the offensive.
The next thing flames fans will say is that bennet is better than nathan mackinnon.

 

[888 98 twins]

That's a good deal

 

[Lunatik]

Yikes . . . 6.4M for 7 years is a lot for a guy who seems to be fairly dependent on his linemate to create offense.

Like clockwork, once again shooting down the accomplishments of Monahan to try and make Gaudreau look better.

 

[Legend123]

Like clockwork, once again shooting down the accomplishments of Monahan to try and make Gaudreau look better.

But its what everyone thinks. Everyone who watches monahan belives that except for the flames fans. He does rely heavily on linemates (Hudler/Guadreau) and PP.

How many points does he have that Gaudreau hasnt assisted on or not on the PP?

 

[Random Forest]

Took long enough for the bridge deal to die, but looks like managers have started catching on. Good deal for the Flames (and Monahan).

 

[WonderTwinsUnite]

These deals are great value. Scheifele, MacKinnon, Monahan... in two years, these players will be hitting 60+ constantly, probably 70. They're all what, 23 and under? And the value of such players will be higher, and they'll be locked up in their prime at rock-solid cap hits.

 

[haulinbass]

over payment methinks. Scheifelle is a lot better btw. Stop arguing over everything. He's bigger, more talented, better 2 way player and better on the offensive.
The next thing flames fans will say is that bennet is better than nathan mackinnon.

Bennet might end up being better.

Not a Flames fan either.

I personally would take Scheifele over Monahan. I think Scheif has more potential. What he did those last 25 games last year is hard to ignore as well. But ultimately there isn't much gap between them and I could understand anyone preferring one over the other.

Good contract for Monahan and the Flames.