Value of: Caufield vs 2OA

[TBF1972]

Caufield has 6 years of RFA status left. Debrincat had 2.

Team control is worth something.

debrincat had two 40 goal seasons. caufield's season best is 26 goals.

 

[The Great Weal]

Caufield isn't really better than debrincat who was worth a mid first. So no way that gets you fantilli who is better than most 2nd overalls.

He got traded for a top 7 pick, how was he worth a mid 1st? Not to mention that his QO was a major reason why he got traded. Anyways, Ducks easily decline this proposal.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Ditto

The dumbass Hawks proposal for Swayman must be typical of all Hawks fans eh?

 

[Vachon23]

As Elite as Byfield right?

Fantilli is a way better prospect then Byfield never was. He would have been drafted before Lafreniere in 2020

No one pumps up their prospects like Montreal Canadian fans tbh

I need to say that I agree and I'm an Habs fan...

 

[HanSolo]

The last time Anaheim picked a freshman Hobey Baker winner it worked out pretty well for them, so that's a no.

I will say there is a package Montreal can offer to make it work, but I'm not interested in the outrage it would cause so I won't identify it.

Just to contribute something unique to the thread.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Caufield is a fun little player, but if I'm running the Ducks, in absolutely no universe do I consider trading 2nd overall for Caufield and FLA 1st or MTL 2024 1st, as OP said it was a non 5th overall pick I'm assuming that's what they meant. Heck I'm not sure I'd do it for both.

as for Caufield and 5th both... ehhh if I'm being honest, I see this draft as a real Four Horsemen situation with Bedard, Fantilli, Carlsson and Michkov and then a fairly steep dropoff after that.

I think I'd much rather have Fantilli than Caufield+Smith/Leonard/Benson/Dvorsky/whoever.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Caufield is a fun little player, but if I'm running the Ducks, in absolutely no universe do I consider trading 2nd overall for Caufield and FLA 1st or MTL 2024 1st, as OP said it was a non 5th overall pick I'm assuming that's what they meant. Heck I'm not sure I'd do it for both.

as for Caufield and 5th both... ehhh if I'm being honest, I see this draft as a real Four Horsemen situation with Bedard, Fantilli, Carlsson and Michkov and then a fairly steep dropoff after that.

I think I'd much rather have Fantilli than Caufield+Smith/Leonard/Benson/Dvorsky/whoever.

I think you have to put Smith in the same tier - he is an offensive dynamo. The one to likely drop out is Michkov thanks to Putin.

 

[Nuckster]

Would Caufield + a non 5th overall pick be enough for Anaheim to move the 2OA this draft? Assumption is there is an 8x8 sign & trade in place.

FWIW I would have a hard time trading Caufield from Montreal's perspective only because he's the first guy who looks like he could pot 50 in multiple decades, but I also think Fantilli will be a better player long term.

BONUS: If you think this is a trade that could get done - do you think Chicago would ever entertain Bedard for 2+5? Why/why not?


(I don't endorse these trades, just curious what other people think)

I doubt it, and no slight on Caufield. I just think Anaheim adding Fantilli or Carlsson, then allowing Zegras to move to the wing, and having McTavish as their future 2c makes too much sense.

Anaheim is not a particularly big team up front and as good as Caufield is he makes them smaller, and that's already an issue.

In terms of the 'value' of a player, its in the range, its just a big center is more of a fit for Anaheim.

 

[Nuckster]

Would Caufield + a non 5th overall pick be enough for Anaheim to move the 2OA this draft? Assumption is there is an 8x8 sign & trade in place.

FWIW I would have a hard time trading Caufield from Montreal's perspective only because he's the first guy who looks like he could pot 50 in multiple decades, but I also think Fantilli will be a better player long term.

BONUS: If you think this is a trade that could get done - do you think Chicago would ever entertain Bedard for 2+5? Why/why not?


(I don't endorse these trades, just curious what other people think)

Bedard for 2+5 would have to Make Chicago think but its not possible unless Anaheim somehow gets #5 and that would mean probably parting with Zegras. So I don't see this as realistic.

Hypothetically if some team had #2 and #5 and I am Chicago, wow would that be hard to say no to. As good as Bedard should be, he's not Mcdavid. (at least I don't think so). He could be a Patrick Kane or Jack Hughes and those are great players. But if could get 2 number 1 centers or say Fantilli and Michkov, that would be one hell of a trade to pass up.

The way I'd look at it is, of those players in the top 5 are there any that you think will bust. If you assume none will, and they all have high enough floors to be top 3 and at worst top 6 players. Then on a points basis

Bedard - 140 pts max? More likely a career 95-120 pt player at best
The other two 80-100 pt players? So you're getting an extra 80 pts per season there which is alot.

Issue then becomes to Chicago fans who've been buying seasons tickets hand over fist because of Bedard, riot? LOL

Interesting idea

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I think you have to put Smith in the same tier - he is an offensive dynamo. The one to likely drop out is Michkov thanks to Putin.

Smith is a good prospect but I see him as a tier below the likes of Michkov. There are other considerations when looking at a Russian forward to be sure, but from an overall talent perspective I don't think it's close. Smith has some pretty gaping holes in his game.

 

[nhlfan9191]

I doubt it, and no slight on Caufield. I just think Anaheim adding Fantilli or Carlsson, then allowing Zegras to move to the wing, and having McTavish as their future 2c makes too much sense.

Anaheim is not a particularly big team up front and as good as Caufield is he makes them smaller, and that's already an issue.

In terms of the 'value' of a player, its in the range, its just a big center is more of a fit for Anaheim.

It takes a 22 year old 40-50 goal scorer on top of the prospect that’s available at 5 to move up 3 spots? Lol common man.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

It takes a 22 year old 40-50 goal scorer on top of the prospect that’s available at 5 to move up 3 spots? Lol common man.

Caufied certainly has the potential to be that, but right now, he's a 23 and 26 goal scorer - a very small one coming off of two shoulder dislocations, surgery, and half a season missed.

I don't understand how some Habs fans can be salivating over how good a prospect Fantilli is and yet fail to understand why it would cost a king's ransom to move up and why they'd have to pry him from Anaheim's cold dead hands. Caufield and FLA 1st/MTL 2024 1st/other bits are just not that interesting.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Caulfied certainly has the potential to be that, but right now, he's a 23 and 26 goal scorer - a very small one coming off of two shoulder dislocations, surgery, and half a season missed.

He turned 22 in January. He’s not 23. And I’m impressed more he didn’t slow down at all between seasons to show it wasn’t a fluke. The rest of your opinion means nothing

 

[ChaoticOrange]

He turned 22 in January. He’s not 23. And I’m impressed more he didn’t slow down at all between seasons to show it wasn’t a fluke. The rest of your opinion means nothing

You misread, he has seasons of 23 and 26 goals. He's not a 40/50 goal scorer until he scores 40 or 50 goals.

What opinion? He IS small. He DID dislocate his shoulder twice. He DID have surgery. He DID miss half the season. These aren't opinions, those are facts, my guy.

 

[monkforasia]

#5 and Caufield to me is a semi-fair deal for Anaheim. If Habs offered #5, Caufield, & Hutson, I think Anaheim would pull the trigger on that. You can pick Michkov or Smith at #5.

 

[ole ole]

Habs never do that deal because Anaheim never entertains it lol.

Because there’s a much better chance of Fantilli hitting that ceiling than Smith.

And Carlsson isn’t going to be available at 5.

Fantilli is the total package. Big, fast skilled. Everything you look for in a franchise C.

Caufield is an undersized and already injury prone winger. 40 goal scorer? Sure. (Although he hasn’t yet)

Not nearly as valuable as an elite 1C.

Habs don't consider it.


Hell Michkov if not for the politics would be sitting in the #2 spot.
Rather have Michkov and Caufield

#5 and Caufield to me is a semi-fair deal for Anaheim. If Habs offered #5, Caufield, & Hutson, I think Anaheim would pull the trigger on that. You can pick Michkov or Smith at #5.

Michkov Caufield and Hutson.
That's all it would take?
WOW . I'm not sure if your serious or just forgot to put the .
Lets hope you just forgot the....

 

[ole ole]

For the Ducks to even remotely consider this it would take something like Caufield + one of Suzuki or Dach + 5th overall. +maybe something else Then they may start to consider it. And i said "may"

But at that point the Habs are probably better off to just keep 5th and roll the dice with whoever of the big 5 drop there. Fantilli is a great prospect but gutting the roster for him may not be the best long term move to make

Say what? OMG

 

[V13]

Suzuki+Caufield+Smith/Michkov for Fantilli?

So basically a full first line of stars under 24 y old for frickin Fantilli?

LOL.

I wouldn't do it. But that's the kind of ask the Duck would want. Maybe a little less i dont know but i'm almost certain that CC + 5nd wouldn't cut it and then you go into ridiculous ask terriroty

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Smith is a good prospect but I see him as a tier below the likes of Michkov. There are other considerations when looking at a Russian forward to be sure, but from an overall talent perspective I don't think it's close. Smith has some pretty gaping holes in his game.

I see smith in that zegras tier of prospect…. There’s ton of potential in the player but there’s also a reason why they are not being drafted in top 3.

I wouldn’t put zegras anywhere near fantilli in terms of prospect.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I see smith in that zegras tier of prospect…. There’s ton of potential in the player but there’s also a reason why they are not being drafted in top 3.

I wouldn’t put zegras anywhere near fantilli in terms of prospect.

Yep, absolutely.

If Will Smith was in the 2022 draft, there's a very real chance he goes 1st over Slafkovsky. But the top end of the 2023 draft is just too good.

 

[Junohockeyfan]

Yep, absolutely.

If Will Smith was in the 2022 draft, there's a very real chance he goes 1st over Slafkovsky. But the top end of the 2023 draft is just too good.

To me the most interesting thing will be what San Jose does if Michkov is available. If its between Michkov and Smith, i am curious who they draft. I don't see Michkov falling to 5.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

To me the most interesting thing will be what San Jose does if Michkov is available. If its between Michkov and Smith, i am curious who they draft. I don't see Michkov falling to 5.

It'll be interesting, because there will be a wait either way. Smith is committed to Boston College next year and Michkov is committed to the KHL for three years. I personally would go Michkov for the reasons I stated above (and because I don't think San Jose should care about having to wait three years for him, they still have lots of tearing down left to do).

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

To me the most interesting thing will be what San Jose does if Michkov is available. If its between Michkov and Smith, i am curious who they draft. I don't see Michkov falling to 5.

That is a really tough one…. In my eyes michkov is the 2nd best player in the draft, and San Jose is just starting their rebuild so waiting on michkov isn’t that unattractive, as they will likely be top 5 the next 2 years.

Getting a player that could be #1 in most drafts if he wasn’t Russian is huge value for San Jose…. Ultimately I think they go michkov.

I thought maybe ducks or columbus would, but both teams biggest need is centers…. So sharks are in a good spot to get michkov

 

[Junohockeyfan]

It'll be interesting, because there will be a wait either way. Smith is committed to Boston College next year and Michkov is committed to the KHL for three years. I personally would go Michkov for the reasons I stated above (and because I don't think San Jose should care about having to wait three years for him, they still have lots of tearing down left to do).

I would take him at 2. He's a phenom. If he was Canadian, we would be debating Bedard vs Michkov. This draft is extraordinary in the talent in the top-5. If Habs get Michkov at 5, it would be a coup.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I would take him at 2. He's a phenom. If he was Canadian, we would be debating Bedard vs Michkov. This draft is extraordinary in the talent in the top-5. If Habs get Michkov at 5, it would be a coup.

Problem is the teams at 2/3 need centers and are further along in their rebuilds…. Michkov will end up in San Jose or Montreal.

I do wonder if a team offers a good package to San Jose or Montreal to get in for michkov, might be great asset management if you can stay top 12 and add a couple extra assets.

Like 9 + 17(maybe even more + ) for #4 or #5 based on michkov being there