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Confirmed Trade: [CAR/PIT] Jake Guentzel (25% retained), Ty Smith for Michael Bunting, Ville Koivunen, Vasili Ponomarev, Cruz Lucius, 2024 cond. 1st, 2024 cond. 5th

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Stickpucker said:
What Canadian team is going to win the cup?

The cup is the only reason Sid would leave.

Carolina is a heavy betting favorite. They were the money puck favorite before the Guentzel trade and they have cap space, Crosbys comrades, and a great culture and nice weather.
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I'll be gentle here. You're just a fan or another team feeling good cause you're buying up for a run. I hope the Canes do well but Sid has zero reason to go there.

He's won 3 cups and is a complete creature of habit. He isn't uprooting to go to Carolina, just because they have a good team makeup current state.

He grew up a Canadians fan so he'd do a farewell tour there or play with his best friend on a good team in Colorado...all that is so miniscule cause he is likely to stay one team and retire. He's a legacy guy. Not a hired mercenary
 
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Flying Dego said:
I'll be gentle here. You're just a fan or another team feeling good cause you're buying up for a run. I hope the Canes do well but Sid has zero reason to go there.

He's won 3 cups and is a complete creature of habit. He isn't uprooting to go to Carolina, just because they have a good team makeup current state.

He grew up a Canadians fan so he'd do a farewell tour there or play with his best friend on a good team in Colorado...all that is so miniscule cause he is likely to stay one team and retire. He's a legacy guy. Not a hired mercenary
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I'll be gentle here

How many stars play for one team their entire career unless ended early by injury?

Gretzky
Ronny Franchise
Patrick Roy
...
...
...
 
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Stickpucker said:
I'll be gentle here

How many stars play for one team their entire career unless ended early by injury?

Gretzky
Ronny Franchise
Patrick Roy
...
...
...
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You're acting like Kuzy after hitting some booger sugar ...

Sid won't play for the Canes. Please feel free to bookmark and revisit this year's down the road.

Good luck to the Canes
 
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Dipsy Doodle said:
No. I don't think think that would gave been worth it either.

If you're a team in the Pens' position, you either get back a Lekkerimaki calibre asset or keep Guentzel.
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Keeping Guentzel is stupid because this team is washed up and teams don't trade Lekkerimaki caliber assets for rentals.

Also, Koivunen himself is really highly regarded by some scouts. Like I just posted, Button has him as the #34 prospect in hockey from 2 weeks ago.
 
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Empoleon8771 said:
Keeping Guentzel is stupid because this team is washed up and teams don't trade Lekkerimaki caliber assets for rentals.

Also, Koivunen himself is really highly regarded by some scouts. Like I just posted, Button has him as the #34 prospect in hockey from 2 weeks ago.
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But I thought the Canucks were stupid for not trading Lekkerimaki and wasting Dubas' time.
 
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BenningHurtsMySoul said:
But I thought the Canucks were stupid for not trading Lekkerimaki and wasting Dubas' time.
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I was adamant all along that the Canucks were not and should not trade Lekkerimaki for Guentzel. I was abundantly clear with that.

Go take that up with Ryder if you want to see someone who was insistent on Lekkerimaki. I was adamant that those guys don't get moved for rentals.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
One scout's opinions don't mean law of course, but just to throw this out:

www.tsn.ca

Cutter Gauthier, Alexander Nikishin lead Craig Button’s top 50 NHL-affiliated prospects list | TSN

Cutter Gauthier was in the midst of some controversy this season, but there's nothing controversial about Craig Button ranking him at No. 1.
www.tsn.ca www.tsn.ca

Craig Button has Koivunen as the 34th best prospect in hockey, better than Yager, Lysell (a guy I said a few times I really wanted), Morrow or Cowan.
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Not trying to rain on your parade but if Button was good at analyzing prospects he’d still be employed by an NHL team and not in media.
 
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Any trade involving Sid going to the Canes will simply have to have Jordan Staal going the other way, if only for the look of disgust that Malkin and Letang give him when he comes in the dressing room.
 
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Dipsy Doodle said:
Results are what matter, but it can't be a bad deal even with the benefit of hindsight. Any team with Cup aspirations needs to move assets to bolster their team, and the Canes gave up very little for an exceptional playoff asset.

Necessary, calculated risks don't get better than that, win or not.
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Disagree, but not worth arguing about.
 
Dipsy Doodle said:
Sure can. That was Dubas' stated objective too.

Too bad he failed miserably. Adding seat fillers is not encouraging.
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LOL stop getting your prospect guidance from the Athletic, TSN, and The Hockey News, among the others who rank according to draft position and WJC stats. Scouts, player dev staff and GMs don't work like that, and there are posters on here 10 times more knowledgeable on prospects and their 12-month progression/regression than any of the paid click-baiters. People who matter go off of who takes the biggest leaps in development year after year and who is the closest to helping them at the NHL level. That's why Ryan Suzuki always ranked ahead of Jack Dury and Ponomaryov in public rankings, but guess who made the NHL and guess who probably won't?

Dubas did a great job and likely forced Carolina to give them up instead of the other way around. The Canes have owned an insane pool for years. Their 6-12 (on their internal board) would be 2-8 or in some cases 1-6 on other contenders' boards. There's simply no reason to think Carolina thinks this was some sort of thievery.

I have yet to rank Carolina's pool post-2023 draft, but before the draft, the top-5 in my final official draft report went:

1. Nikishin
2. Kotchetkov
3. Ponomaryov
4. Drury
5. Morrow

In 2022 it went:

1. Drury
2. Kotchetkov
3. Morrow
4. Ponomaryov
5. Koivunen

Nobody was getting Nikishin from them. There are at least 20 Scott Morrow's in the 2024 draft. Once you accept that, all you have is Nadeau and Blake -- neither of them proven above college. If you go by NHL readiness and scoring potential based on pro-league scoring, usage, and versatility, Ponomaryov and Koivuen are ahead of every other forward prospect's development.

FWIW, I hate the Penguins and I'm overjoyed they're in the suck. But I know a good trade when i see one.
 
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Ryder71 said:
Koivinun is having a breakout year in the finnish elite league. Wonder how that compares with swedish elite league. I know the league is pretty low scoring. Almost doubled his production from 19-20. Button has him higher than Blake. And I loved Blake. Who knows.
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I think not enough emphasis is placed on development and to many teams rely on the notion that the creame rises to the top vs wholistic development and support. Where does the pens stand in this ?
 
LMAO! Im still in shock about this trade. I was told Geuntzel is the best rental made availablein the last 50 years.

The return is soo trash, how is Dubas still allowed to run a franchise. I feel bad for how Crosby's sunset years are being absolutely wasted.

A player dump in Bunting, a 2nd round pick and some magic bean mid level prospects for one of the best wingers in NHL.

HAAHAHA Adam Henrique fetched more than Guentzel, let that sink in.
 
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oceanchild said:
I think not enough emphasis is placed on development and to many teams rely on the notion that the creame rises to the top vs wholistic development and support. Where does the pens stand in this ?
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I'm not sure but with Kyle Dubas insisting on prospects this deadline, it tells me he believes the previous regime didn't aptly develop their prospects and wanted to replenish our prospect pool to some measure or degree. Koivunen is arguably in our top three as of now..
 
UrbanImpact said:
LMAO! Im still in shock about this trade. I was told Geuntzel is the best rental made availablein the last 50 years.

The return is soo trash, how is Dubas still allowed to run a franchise. I feel bad for how Crosby's sunset years are being absolutely wasted.

A player dump in Bunting, a 2nd round pick and some magic bean mid level prospects for one of the best wingers in NHL.

HAAHAHA Adam Henrique fetched more than Guentzel, let that sink in.
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Lol your loser team lost out on both Guentzel and now Toffoli. Hope you like Jason Zucker!

Saying Henrique brought back more than Guentzel just shows your opinion isn't worth anything.
 
Empoleon8771 said:
One scout's opinions don't mean law of course, but just to throw this out:

www.tsn.ca

Cutter Gauthier, Alexander Nikishin lead Craig Button’s top 50 NHL-affiliated prospects list | TSN

Cutter Gauthier was in the midst of some controversy this season, but there's nothing controversial about Craig Button ranking him at No. 1.
www.tsn.ca www.tsn.ca

Craig Button has Koivunen as the 34th best prospect in hockey, better than Yager, Lysell (a guy I said a few times I really wanted), Morrow or Cowan.
Click to expand...
Yeah, Carolina's 2nd Round picks are usually pretty good.
 
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