Confirmed Signing with Link: [CAR/MTL] Habs accept Kotkaniemi offer sheet (1 year, $6.1M), 2022 1st, 2022 3rd [Part II]

[Heffyhoof]

You clearly don't know how contracts work. It's perfectly legal for Europeans to go to the AHL right after they are drafted. These obligations you are speaking of are in your imagination.

No one's "dunking" on him. Kotkaniemi threatened to pout back in Europe if he didn't make the NHL and the Habs took the wrong decision when they conceded. Everyone involved, especially Kotkaniemi's advisers, deserve blame.

Young players usually think they are hot shit and always think they know everything and are ready for the next step. They want to rush things, this is a natural process. It's up to people who know better to slow the process down. The reality is, very few players can make the jump to the NHL at 18 yo without sacrificing on their long term potential. The NHL is not a development league and never will be.

It's also a huge jump for a very young person to suddenly be a high profile millionaire. It's a test of character for anyone. Even more so when you're 18 years old and did not deserve it. People underestimate the effect this has, and how sometimes it leads to screwed up opportunities and bad habits years later.

Yes I noticed it was a european assignment clause, I was wrong. That said, you still are desperately trying to dunk on him and your post was a lie. Almost every single player drafted from europe comes with one of those clauses, particularly those considered 'projects' with long-shots to make the NHL, which Kotkaniemi most certainly was. You're inventing a whole storyline where KK strong-armed Montreal with his 'pouts, pleas, and rotten attitude'. If only the management was somehow able to resist the evil temptations from Kotkaniemi none of this would've happened. I remember those articles about how Montreal had no choice but to let him play.

None of that happened. Montreal management screwed up rushing a prospect, as they often do, and now people rush to their defense and smear the player. It's okay to admit Montreal's management has been a league joke for a while now; we might actually get someone fired if everyone stopped pretending.

 

[Kimota]

Yes I noticed it was a european assignment clause, I was wrong. That said, you still are desperately trying to dunk on him and your post was a lie. Almost every single player drafted from europe comes with one of those clauses, particularly those considered 'projects' with long-shots to make the NHL, which Kotkaniemi most certainly was. You're inventing a whole storyline where KK strong-armed Montreal with his 'pouts, pleas, and rotten attitude'. If only the management was somehow able to resist the evil temptations from Kotkaniemi none of this would've happened. I remember those articles about how Montreal had no choice but to let him play.

None of that happened. Montreal management screwed up rushing a prospect, as they often do, and now people rush to their defense and smear the player. It's okay to admit Montreal's management has been a league joke for a while now; we might actually get someone fired if everyone stopped pretending.

They did the same with Galchenyuk, though. In both cases it was because of the long-standing starvation from wanting quality centers.

 

[Kimota]

You clearly don't know how contracts work. It's perfectly legal for Europeans to go to the AHL right after they are drafted. These obligations you are speaking of are in your imagination.

No one's "dunking" on him. Kotkaniemi threatened to pout back in Europe if he didn't make the NHL and the Habs took the wrong decision when they conceded. Everyone involved, especially Kotkaniemi's advisers, deserve blame.

Young players usually think they are hot shit and always think they know everything and are ready for the next step. They want to rush things, this is a natural process. It's up to people who know better to slow the process down. The reality is, very few players can make the jump to the NHL at 18 yo without sacrificing on their long term potential. The NHL is not a development league and never will be.

It's also a huge jump for a very young person to suddenly be a high profile millionaire. It's a test of character for anyone. Even more so when you're 18 years old and did not deserve it. People underestimate the effect this has, and how sometimes it leads to screwed up opportunities and bad habits years later.

More and more it becomes clear that KK has had horrible advisers from the start.

 

[samsagat]

No one's "dunking" on him. Kotkaniemi threatened to pout back in Europe if he didn't make the NHL and the Habs took the wrong decision when they conceded. Everyone involved, especially Kotkaniemi's advisers, deserve blame.

Never heard of it.

We've heard he asked for a trade after being scratched in the SCF, but threatening going back to Europe at 18 yo? Never.

Source?

 

[samsagat]

They did the same with Galchenyuk, though. In both cases it was because of the long-standing starvation from wanting quality centers.

IMHO, Galchenyuk was more talented and closer to being an impact player when he made the NHL, right after being drafted.

Galchenyuk's problems never been his talent but his off ice issues.

Him beeing chosen 3rd overall's never been seen as a reach, he was chosen right on the spot it was supposed to be.

Problem with Galchenyuk wasn't about how high he was drafted, it was more about how Habs mismanaged his development.

Problem with the Habs is that they are as mediocre at drafting than they are at developing...

 

[Goldenhands]

IMHO, Galchenyuk was more talented and closer to being an impact player when he made the NHL, right after being drafted.

Galchenyuk's problems never been his talent but his off ice issues.

Him beeing chosen 3rd overall's never been seen as a reach, he was chosen right on the spot it was supposed to be.

Problem with Galchenyuk wasn't about how high he was drafted, it was more about how Habs mismanaged his development.

Problem with the Habs is that they are as mediocre at drafting than they are at developing...

That year draft was one of the worst in NHL history, so its not like the Habs had ton of options... Also, we were looking for a center for years, any teams in our situation would have drafted Galchenyuk at our spot, it was a no brainer.

Problems with Galchenyuk on the ice was his below average skating and lack of hockey IQ, playing center in junior and playing center at the NHL level is 2 different things. Then, if you combine the off ice issue and a dad that takes too much space in his carreer, it gives you a player very hard to develop, so I wouldnt really put the blame on the Habs on this one, they tried to develop him, but his father and he had their own way to do things.

KK was rushed no doubt, Bergevin can only blame himself on this one. On another side, we still could have developped him in a very good player, we wont know because of that offer sheet...

 

[ottawa]

If he thinks the Canes are going to chase a sunk cost, he’s welcome to try.

The 1st+ resolved a hole in our lineup for a season. Moving forward, it’s not about trying to get a return on that investment. It’s about what is Kotkaniemi’s performance level and what is an appropriate amount of money to pay him. Canes management isn’t trying to “win” a trade thread on HFBoards.

you think he'll let KK walk even if he has a bad season? He's going to give him a long leash so he can prove himself, even if that extends passed this year.

My guess is if KK has a bad season, he gets signed to a bridge deal...if he has a good season then a 5+ year contract

 

[Tryamw]

you think he'll let KK walk even if he has a bad season? He's going to give him a long leash so he can prove himself, even if that extends passed this year.

My guess is if KK has a bad season, he gets signed to a bridge deal...if he has a good season then a 5+ year contract

This doesn't sound like the Tom Dundon that's the owner of the Carolina Hurricanes.. (that I know of) but sure it's possible.

 

[tarheelhockey]

you think he'll let KK walk even if he has a bad season? He's going to give him a long leash so he can prove himself, even if that extends passed this year.

My guess is if KK has a bad season, he gets signed to a bridge deal...if he has a good season then a 5+ year contract

Tom Dundon has walked away from elite players (Hamilton), career-long broadcasters (Forslund, Kaiton), and half the internal staff the second they stopped meeting an internal value assessment.

If Kotkaniemi stinks it up this year, and shows no particular sign of turning it around, he’ll be gone. If he breaks out they’ll look to sign him to a deal that meets their value assessment. It’s as simple as that. Nobody’s being held hostage in this situation

 

[SergeConstantin74]

 

[Runner77]

They did the same with Galchenyuk, though. In both cases it was because of the long-standing starvation from wanting quality centers.

That starvation is mostly self-induced. Bergevin kept claiming that good centres are not available whereas what he meant was that he was never willing to pay the price it took, so it kept getting pushed to the back burner.

 

[Runner77]

More and more it becomes clear that KK has had horrible advisers from the start.

I’d argue that he was subjected to horrible management that chose to rush him.

 

[Not The One]

I’d argue that he was subjected to horrible management that chose to rush him.

Don't try to pretend that the fanbase was against it either. The easy consensus was that he earned his spot on the team and had a pretty good rookie season all thing being considered.

 

[Runner77]

Tom Dundon has walked away from elite players (Hamilton), career-long broadcasters (Forslund, Kaiton), and half the internal staff the second they stopped meeting an internal value assessment.

Internal value assessment? A longtime fan favorite broadcaster like Forslund had value, just not value that Dundon was willing to pay for:

A pattern has emerged in his time in Raleigh that points to a simple philosophy —prioritize spending on players and the product on the ice, and find value in other areas. Allowing Chuck Kation to move on is a good example.

Editorial: Letting John Forslund walk would be a mistake

Dundon refuses to pay fair market value for certain personnel and as owner, that’s his prerogative. I’m not sure what an « internal value assessment » means.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Lolz. Is he holding up how many NHLers he played against tonight?

 

[Runner77]

Don't try to pretend that the fanbase was against it either. The easy consensus was that he earned his spot on the team and had a pretty good rookie season all thing being considered.

I’m not pretending anything. And who cares what the fan base thinks — they are are not the decision makers. These kinds of decisions rest upon management’s expertise and I’m merely stating that they erred in their assessment.

 

[Colezuki]

Lolz. Is he holding up how many NHLers he played against tonight?

That would be 11 lol

 

[Canes]

Can't wait til Kotkaniemi is on the ice for his first goal against for the Hurricanes. Even if it's just preseason. I imagine there will be a lot of very happy Hab fans acting like it's summer 1993.

It's too bad the Canes started this offer sheet shenanigans themselves.

 

[D4ngleSZN]

6.1 mill for a 3c lol

 

[tarheelhockey]

Internal value assessment? A longtime fan favorite broadcaster like Forslund had value, just not value that Dundon was willing to pay for:

A pattern has emerged in his time in Raleigh that points to a simple philosophy —prioritize spending on players and the product on the ice, and find value in other areas. Allowing Chuck Kation to move on is a good example.

Editorial: Letting John Forslund walk would be a mistake

Dundon refuses to pay fair market value for certain personnel and as owner, that’s his prerogative. I’m not sure what an « internal value assessment » means.

It’s not a complicated idea. The Hurricanes have a fairly specific set of internal criteria for determining value (which you just posted evidence of) and they will stick to those criteria as long as Dundon’s in charge. According to those criteria, it’s easily worth millions to take a chance on young talent, and not worth even 10% of that to retain one announcer over another.

“Fair market value” is irrelevant. Dundon’s not trying to go along with the market. He’s specifically doing the opposite, taking advantage of market inefficiencies.

 

[Souker]

Can't wait til Kotkaniemi is on the ice for his first goal against for the Hurricanes. Even if it's just preseason. I imagine there will be a lot of very happy Hab fans acting like it's summer 1993.

It's too bad the Canes started this offer sheet shenanigans themselves.

90% of the Habs fan base don’t give a sh*t about this story anymore. It’s water under the bridge. Move on.
Only ones that still care is remaining 5-10% of Habs fans and some Canes fans fuelling off each other. Can’t believe this thread is still on top of the forum.

 

[Canes]

6.1 mill for a 3c lol

Yeah honestly I can't believe they signed him to a max contract and gave up 4 first rounders for him. Thankfully we have astute HFboard commenters to show us how stupid we are. Never had that experience on HFboards before.

 

[Canes]

90% of the Habs fan base don’t give a sh*t about this story anymore. It’s water under the bridge. Move on.
Only ones that still care is remaining 5% of Habs fans and some Canes fans fuelling off each other. Can’t believe this thread is still on top of the forum.

I have no doubt the vast majority of the Hab fanbase has moved on but your fanbase is so large this is going to be an ongoing shitshow regardless of what either side thinks.

 

[JianYang]

Title is confusing.

 

[Runner77]

It’s not a complicated idea. The Hurricanes have a fairly specific set of internal criteria for determining value (which you just posted evidence of) and they will stick to those criteria as long as Dundon’s in charge. According to those criteria, it’s easily worth millions to take a chance on young talent, and not worth even 10% of that to retain one announcer over another.

“Fair market value” is irrelevant. Dundon’s not trying to go along with the market. He’s specifically doing the opposite, taking advantage of market inefficiencies.

Fair market value is relevant when you want to retain talent at certain positions. It evidently isn’t when an owner has determined that broadcasters are not worth paying for. That’s not a market inefficiency, it’s merely a preference by the ultimate decision maker. More power to him.