Speculation: Caps Roster General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines etc) - 2022-23 Season Part 1: Free Agent Edition

[DatDude44]

What's the deal with Anthony Mantha? Do u guys think he's a bounce back candidate? Is he fitting into your top6? Or is he just withering away in injuries etc..??

 

[um]

What's the deal with Anthony Mantha? Do u guys think he's a bounce back candidate? Is he fitting into your top6? Or is he just withering away in injuries etc..??

He is what he is, inconsistent and often hurt.

He has a tendency to take long and low chance shots that broadcasters insist is an amazing shot but it's always an easy save for the goalie... I wish he'd play more like a power forward/playmaker than a wanna be Semin.

He should have the 2LW spot locked up though.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Remember last year when people were talking about a Kuznetsov-for-Monahan change of scenery trade? Glad that never happened.

I wanted Tarasenko, but I’m glad we kept Kuzy instead, after Backstrom’s potentially career ending surgery.

 

[DWGie26]

He is what he is, inconsistent and often hurt.

He has a tendency to take long and low chance shots that broadcasters insist is an amazing shot but it's always an easy save for the goalie... I wish he'd play more like a power forward/playmaker than a wanna be Semin.

He should have the 2LW spot locked up though.

Most people seem to like Brown as 1RW but I would like to see Mantha as 1RW and Brown as 2RW (oshie 3RW) to start the season. I think Brown would complement Strome well. We’ll have options though so that is good.

Its gonna be an interesting offseason next summer.

Of course the Caps won't give their youngsters any chances to prove themselves so we probably just end up resigning all of our vets.

I’d like to see us move on from Hathaway an Sheary next year in favor of Leason (4RW) and Shively/AFJ) as the Sheary replacement. Both are good value pieces but those are places we can put youth… if they earn the spots this season.

 

[hockeykicker]

Letting Hathway walk doesn't make sense imo. He is literally the perfect 4th liner

 

[HTFN]

Letting Hathway walk doesn't make sense imo. He is literally the perfect 4th liner

more talent than you should expect at the position, tough, and really irritating. keep that

 

[Ridley Simon]

Didn't really expect Pronman to grade Miro as an NHL average skater given how much of a stickler he is about that area. (I didn't recall he also had that assessment prior to the draft.) Against his peer group it's fine but against men there's work to do. It's primarily why I liked Yurov over him, though admittedly it's hard to know what his Miro's health status was last season. I mean, there's no way his skating is better than Lapierre's for starters. And no way Lapierre's compete is stronger than his skating...

Good to see the system rising but it still seems like they're missing some elements, mostly up front in more diverse, cerebral and well-rounded skill sets. Hanelt & Magnusson showed some levels of promise at the recent WJC but not overly so. AJF was better in his day and he's struggled to make the jump fully. It's an area that should be more fruitful outside of the first two rounds. Part of it is retaining picks but they also don't have an amazing track record drafting and developing that type of forward. Protas may be their best bet to develop into that sort of complete top three line player but it's going to take a lot of guided development.

Ok I will bite. What does the bolded even mean? I’ve got a sense for words and a terrific SAT vocab, but that’s got me going in circles. LOL

 

[Ridley Simon]

Just depends on cost. Hathaway could take Hags 2.75m/yr 4th liner slot for us.

I mean, someone has to. Why not him?

 

[um]

Just depends on cost. Hathaway could take Hags 2.75m/yr 4th liner slot for us.

I mean, someone has to. Why not him?

Why do we have to pay any 4th liner 2.75 million a year?

I'm all far keeping Hathaway but I don't think he's worth more than 2 million, and that's generous. For reference Dowd only makes 1.3.

 

[DWGie26]

Why do we have to pay any 4th liner 2.75 million a year?

I'm all far keeping Hathaway but I don't think he's worth more than 2 million, and that's generous. For reference Dowd only makes 1.3.

This was my point. Like Beagle, I think he will price out for the Caps. He is super valuable, can play up in the lineup, brings the physical. We have a bargain which i would keep him at. Maybe upto $2 but someone will pay him a lot more. Same for Sheary. Gotta be value in some spots. Not going to be in the top 6.

 

[Langway]

Ok I will bite. What does the bolded even mean? I’ve got a sense for words and a terrific SAT vocab, but that’s got me going in circles. LOL

Energy, pursuit and fluidity can always be better. I'm not sure they shook up the skaters quite to the extent needed. They make up for their limitations with being opportunistic and skilled but you never know when age starts to fundamentally add up against them. A lot hinges on Eller & Oshie making them a very deep team and it's hard to say how much they've still got to that extent.

Brown can help in the effort dept. and so many guys in contract years should be a big motivator. I'm rooting for Brown since they really need pursuit in a guy bigger than Sheary (and smarter/more skilled than Hathaway to play up the lineup). I'd put Mantha, Brown & Strome together to insulate Strome's limitations. I'm not sure how productive that trio will be but fundamentally it's their best bet. Hockey sense, structure and discipline has to be consistently on point. They have their style and it's mostly predicated on effort and emotion rather than deadly execution and details. Outside of the forwards, they also need a more dominant all-around Carlson to be truly bullish.

They're a playoff team but probably at least one pretty decent piece away up front from being stacked and having supreme confidence. In terms of potential vs. output it's also why it's hard to have unlimited patience for Mantha given how high the stakes are. They need him to carry the second line and be a leader. He's got all of the tools but they need him to take that next step in his maturity. The biggest positive by far overall being that there's no favorite in the East at this stage. It's a transition period and up for grabs. Tampa will start to struggle defensively and likely have to lean more and more on Vasi. If someone steps up in net you'd think it should be Toronto's time already...but it's Toronto. Getting Wilson back will be huge when it happens but there's likely still some more roster surgery required. Plenty of time for that but the overarching vision needs to be a little more bold under the circumstances.

 

[Caps8112]

What's the deal with Anthony Mantha? Do u guys think he's a bounce back candidate? Is he fitting into your top6? Or is he just withering away in injuries etc..??

think he is the high potential disappointing player the wings fans told us he would be. haha. always looks like he is about to take the next step but then he looks disinterested, unwilling to use his body and just flat out useless at times.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Ok I will bite. What does the bolded even mean? I’ve got a sense for words and a terrific SAT vocab, but that’s got me going in circles. LOL

I call that a Langwayism…..….ever eloquent, sometimes confusing.

 

[Ridley Simon]

I call that a Langwayism…..….ever eloquent, sometimes confusing.

Ha. Which is pretty opposite of the player. His game was power, brute force, and perfect hockey sense ….and never confusing. You knew what he’d do almost all the time, like clockwork.

(My favorite Langway move was taking the breakout forward who had the puck, engage them w the body, then ride them into the boards and paste them down to the ground.

Patented.

Energy, pursuit and fluidity can always be better. I'm not sure they shook up the skaters quite to the extent needed. They make up for their limitations with being opportunistic and skilled but you never know when age starts to fundamentally add up against them. A lot hinges on Eller & Oshie making them a very deep team and it's hard to say how much they've still got to that extent.

Brown can help in the effort dept. and so many guys in contract years should be a big motivator. I'm rooting for Brown since they really need pursuit in a guy bigger than Sheary (and smarter/more skilled than Hathaway to play up the lineup). I'd put Mantha, Brown & Strome together to insulate Strome's limitations. I'm not sure how productive that trio will be but fundamentally it's their best bet. Hockey sense, structure and discipline has to be consistently on point. They have their style and it's mostly predicated on effort and emotion rather than deadly execution and details. Outside of the forwards, they also need a more dominant all-around Carlson to be truly bullish.

They're a playoff team but probably at least one pretty decent piece away up front from being stacked and having supreme confidence. In terms of potential vs. output it's also why it's hard to have unlimited patience for Mantha given how high the stakes are. They need him to carry the second line and be a leader. He's got all of the tools but they need him to take that next step in his maturity. The biggest positive by far overall being that there's no favorite in the East at this stage. It's a transition period and up for grabs. Tampa will start to struggle defensively and likely have to lean more and more on Vasi. If someone steps up in net you'd think it should be Toronto's time already...but it's Toronto. Getting Wilson back will be huge when it happens but there's likely still some more roster surgery required. Plenty of time for that but the overarching vision needs to be a little more bold under the circumstances.

I believe with Backstrom LTIR and everyone else “here”, they have like 3m left in LTIR space. Don’t they? Hagelin’s 2.75 is in that. And we can’t keep him (or anyone else, really) as an extra forward, so something will end to
“Give” there.

So could have at least 5.75-6m with which to play with. That could the difference maker, especially if on D

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

@Ridley Simon

Throwback memory that @txpd would recall fondly……

they used to show a regular highlight clip at US Air Arena/Cap Center that would show Rod Langway pinning (I forget exactly, was trying to find the clip) like 2 or 3 Islanders in deep in our zone, to the boards all by himself…..what a horse that guy was…

One of my favorite adult moments at a game was about 2008-10 (guesstimating), my buddies and I met Rod during the game, at a bar on the main concourse (just him and us there for a good 5 mins)…..he was so nice (possibly already enjoying himself lol)…

 

[Langway]

Increasingly incoherent? Yeah, probably.

My last post wasn't about their prospects so I get it. It's more of a common thread issue in priorities and development. Teams need complete, hard-working players to play a high grade 200 ft. checking game and they still struggle to draft and develop them. It requires a combination of a special hockey IQ, consistent work ethic and the ability to mesh well with skilled players. It forces a need to rely on the likes of stopgaps like Sheary, who's fine but ultimately limited. Particularly under a coach like Lavi it's going to be difficult drafting they way they do for more limited prospects to fully earn trust in key roles.

It makes it hard to be big believers in their ability to make drastic offsetting strides in the coming years as vets age. Lapierre, CMM & Miro are all more offensive-minded yet even in that realm they're limited forecheckers. Lapierre holds the most upside since he's the best skater but he's also got the weakest compete. They're limitations that come with drafting later but further development will be crucial. They need to prioritize players whose toolbox and compete primarily drives their effectiveness. They're going to need more dirty work types as their vets age out and are increasingly unable to engage as effectively.

 

[HTFN]

Ok I will bite. What does the bolded even mean? I’ve got a sense for words and a terrific SAT vocab, but that’s got me going in circles. LOL

I thought it meant, like... "hockey IQ" players. So like, Vrana has a lot of talents but when you define them he sounds like one kind of guy. Crosby has a lot of talents that, when defined, give him titles like "elite grinder" because they're applied so evenly across the game and allow him to take what is given.

Right now the Capitals have players with talent but you'd have to take two of them and mash them together before there's a player you can say doesn't easily fit into an archetype, the exception being Protas. Guys that just match up well because they're cerebral and well-rounded enough to consistently outplay their depth chart equivalents because they don't have a "matchup" in that rock-paper-scissors sort of way.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

Met Langway at the season opener last year, good dude.

 

[YippieKaey]

I thought it meant, like... "hockey IQ" players. So like, Vrana has a lot of talents but when you define them he sounds like one kind of guy. Crosby has a lot of talents that, when defined, give him titles like "elite grinder" because they're applied so evenly across the game and allow him to take what is given.

Right now the Capitals have players with talent but you'd have to take two of them and mash them together before there's a player you can say doesn't easily fit into an archetype, the exception being Protas. Guys that just match up well because they're cerebral and well-rounded enough to consistently outplay their depth chart equivalents because they don't have a "matchup" in that rock-paper-scissors sort of way.

I'd say Oshie, Kuzy, Dowd, Mantha and (physicality) Ovi don't really fit an archetype.

 

[hockeykicker]

 

[Calicaps]

@Ridley Simon

Throwback memory that @txpd would recall fondly……

they used to show a regular highlight clip at US Air Arena/Cap Center that would show Rod Langway pinning (I forget exactly, was trying to find the clip) like 2 or 3 Islanders in deep in our zone, to the boards all by himself…..what a horse that guy was…

One of my favorite adult moments at a game was about 2008-10 (guesstimating), my buddies and I met Rod during the game, at a bar on the main concourse (just him and us there for a good 5 mins)…..he was so nice (possibly already enjoying himself lol)…

A few (several now?) years back, I was in DC for my cousin's wedding. We were staying at an AirBnb in DuPont and were walking back from somewhere. It was late on like a Tuesday, most places were closed. So we went to get a drink at one of the bars just off Connecticut Ave, south of the circle. It was just us and the bartender/owner, and he starts telling us how, long after his playing days when Uncle Ted tapped him as a marketing tool, Langway (my fave player as a kid, btw) would always come to that bar for some liquid courage before doing PR events for the Caps. Dude could single-handedly hold a forward line in check but put him in a tux in front of a crowd and he'd get panicky! LOL

 

[Hivemind]

Letting Hathway walk doesn't make sense imo. He is literally the perfect 4th liner

4th liners come, and 4th liners go. If Hath is willing to pass up his last chance to sign a well paying (for a 4th liner) contract to stay short and cheap, then they can explore that. But they shouldn't invest heavily when that cap space can be spent elsewhere. The Capitals have let plenty of high quality, high character, sometimes skilled, fan favorite 4th liners walk over the years when their contracts expired. Jay Beagle, Boyd Gordon, Matt Hendricks, Matt Bradley, etc. You could even bend the definition to include faceoff king Dave Steckel (although he was traded) if you want. Looking at the results they achieved after they left DC, with the power of hindsight, how many of them are you really upset the Capitals let walk? Maaaybe Boyd Gordon or Jay Beagle, but the contracts they signed after leaving DC were never going to be worth it for the Capitals to beat. Plus Nic Dowd has done fine in filling in for Beagle, and keeping Gordon would have blocked Beagle in the first place.

The Caps have no shortage of internal options for that 4RW spot. Leason, Malenstyn, and Protas will be surefire contenders for it (assuming the first two survive waivers this year), with Trineyev and Rybinski as outside dark horse options. None of them would cost more than $900K against the cap. And even if every kid should falter, filling 4th line spots with camp invites is usually doable. Matt Hendricks secured his spot off of a PTO invite. DSP was on a two-way contract when he won his spot on the Capitals.

Eventually the Caps need to stop filling all their grinder spots with costly veterans and let cheaper options shine. Heck, even looking back at team history, doing so is what let players like Beagle and DSP crack the line-up in the first place.

 

[RandyHolt]

Must be a kick in the crotch for our younger players to see meh overpriced vets that could go to a kid that has been being groomed for many years. The swede LD being added must have pissed off someone (besides me who wants to see the prospects I have been seeing at kettler for years. Still don't like the Hagelin signing.

 

[Langway]

I thought it meant, like... "hockey IQ" players. So like, Vrana has a lot of talents but when you define them he sounds like one kind of guy. Crosby has a lot of talents that, when defined, give him titles like "elite grinder" because they're applied so evenly across the game and allow him to take what is given.

Right now the Capitals have players with talent but you'd have to take two of them and mash them together before there's a player you can say doesn't easily fit into an archetype, the exception being Protas. Guys that just match up well because they're cerebral and well-rounded enough to consistently outplay their depth chart equivalents because they don't have a "matchup" in that rock-paper-scissors sort of way.

It's the marriage of skill, IQ and engagement...not just on puck skill but off puck anticipation and the ability to win battles. The prototypical complete player is hard to come by to be sure. But some organizations are better at spotting, supporting and developing it and it doesn't necessarily have to include amazing offensive skill. Too often they just sign or trade for those elements instead of developing it and that's problematic for a lot of reasons. It ends up being sort of a frankenroster with somewhat limited generic grinders that compete and then the more finesse types with none of it overly cohesive. It's hard to win with a disjointed approach.

Now that Backstrom's status is at least up in the air they need more players that make those around them better. Those types lead with their hockey IQ, discipline and detail. I'm not sure they prioritize those qualities enough. Their process seems much more isolated and superficial and I don't know how viable that is ultimately. There's still something of a post-Orpik/Niskanen leadership void as well from the back-end. Schultz out, Gustafsson in is just more of the same (or worse) just much cheaper. Better if they're not going to get a rock solid depth piece than to be ambitious with a younger talent and try to really work with them. Too often it just seems like they're in survival mode not fully focused enough on maximizing what they already have to work with. Instead they just get through the regular season in sort of a blur and then it's the same issues cropping up again and again. I still like their chances in a wide open East. Why the hell not? But organizationally they've still got work to do.

Goaltending is probably going to have to carry them to some extent. Fundamentally speaking it may need to and hopefully if that is the case the dummies in front of them don't lazily come to take that for granted if they indeed have secured it again.

 

[hockeykicker]

Must be a kick in the crotch for our younger players to see meh overpriced vets that could go to a kid that has been being groomed for many years. The swede LD being added must have pissed off someone (besides me who wants to see the prospects I have been seeing at kettler for years. Still don't like the Hagelin signing.

Our prospects are gonna be upset that they signed Erik Gustafson? Besides Alexeyev is hurt, who knows what Lucas Johansen is doing, and that leaves Tobias Geisser (unless you want Dylan Mcilrath).

Point is, what defense prospect is ready to compete vs Gustafson? It's not like he can't be sent to AHL if someone beats him out. If they can't beat out Gustafson then they aren't ready