OT: Capitals Cinema Club: TV and Movies

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
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I have pretty much all the old Sandman comics and graphic novels from the 80s and 90s. Haven't read them in probably 20-25 years? So watching the new series on Netflix is part recognition and part fresh experience.

The recognition aspect tells me they've done an amazing job technically and artistically on this series. Nearly perfect casting, acting, production, etc....masterfully done.

Sandman fans will love it. Those unfamiliar should also enjoy the spectacle, if they're the least bit into the mystical or occult or have a feel for the counterculture vibe that ran through such things in the 80s and 90s.
 
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usiel

Where wolf’s ears are, wolf’s teeth are near.
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I have pretty much all the old Sandman comics and graphic novels from the 80s and 90s. Haven't read them in probably 20-25 years? So watching the new series on Netflix is part recognition and part fresh experience.

The recognition aspect tells me they've done an amazing job technically and artistically on this series. Nearly perfect casting, acting, production, etc....masterfully done.

Sandman fans will love it. Those unfamiliar should also enjoy the spectacle, if they're the least bit into the mystical or occult or have a feel for the counterculture vibe that ran through such things in the 80s and 90s.

I'm on episode 6. Was familiar with the title back when I was collecting a bazillion years ago but never read it but decently familiar with the character.

The first two episodes just felt perfect with full immersion nothing that jarred me. The fx and also the soundtrack really stood out. The audio was especially good.

Other thoughts later but this might be about best genre series that Netflix has made.
 
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CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
Feb 27, 2002
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Prey on Hulu was really good. Other than the original, the best of the Predator movies. Arguably the best.

Watching Carter on Netflix….Korean Action…..digging it.
 

usiel

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Finally picked up the latest Dr. Strange movie on 4k bluray. Thought it was pretty entertaining a little more than I expected. 4k PQ was pretty awesome.

Picked up the the first Thor movie on 4k (the completionist 4k collector in me). Despite it being from 2011 one can tell some of the FX shots were not looking as good mainly the Asgard flyover in the beginning of the film.

Got back to going through S3 of the 4k Westworld. Was watching the first three episodes on the first disc and I was saying to myself this isn't looking as good as I remember and when I finished and took it out realized I had grabbed the bluray version, heh. Moving to disc two in glorious 4k dolby vision was like eyegasm.
 

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
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Finally picked up the latest Dr. Strange movie on 4k bluray. Thought it was pretty entertaining a little more than I expected. 4k PQ was pretty awesome.

Picked up the the first Thor movie on 4k (the completionist 4k collector in me). Despite it being from 2011 one can tell some of the FX shots were not looking as good mainly the Asgard flyover in the beginning of the film.

Got back to going through S3 of the 4k Westworld. Was watching the first three episodes on the first disc and I was saying to myself this isn't looking as good as I remember and when I finished and took it out realized I had grabbed the bluray version, heh. Moving to disc two in glorious 4k dolby vision was like eyegasm.

I thought the new Dr. Strange movie was really good. Went in with low expectations just because so many Marvel movies have been done so far and was pleasantly surprised it wasn't just a cash-in of some kind. Great effects, story, everything.
 
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CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
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I enjoyed the new Dr Strange, but upon rewatch, I was a little bored….

Replay value is one of the major factors in measuring a movie’s “greatness” for me…..
 

usiel

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I enjoyed the new Dr Strange, but upon rewatch, I was a little bored….

Replay value is one of the major factors in measuring a movie’s “greatness” for me…..
Rewatching is definitely a factor that I measure as well. Guess I'll have to see if I start zoning the next time I watch it. Movie runtime wasn't too long and didn't feel too many dead spots. Also the Scarlet Witch was a good villain and not one that was like HEY I'M EVIL OVER HERE!
 
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g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
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I don't put rewatch value high up in the ranking metrics because that removes a lot of the weight for things like surprise value and emotional investment. Those are never the same the 2nd time around, or afterward.

If a movie does a good job of creating suspense or doubt about some outcome then later viewings will lack that power for sure.

Rewatch tends to stem from things like visual spectacle, memorable lines or characters, and then pacing which may have been a part of that suspense and doubt from before.

I've seen Happy Gilmore dozens of times but I wouldn't say it's a "great" movie. It has rewatch potential because it's iconic for the genre and slapnuts funny or memorable. It's got that formula for watercooler or putting green lines and scenes you remember and repeat. So you watch it again to re-experience them.

Caddyshack, on the other hand, is a "great" movie.
 

AlexModvechkin8

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I don't put rewatch value high up in the ranking metrics because that removes a lot of the weight for things like surprise value and emotional investment. Those are never the same the 2nd time around, or afterward.

If a movie does a good job of creating suspense or doubt about some outcome then later viewings will lack that power for sure.

Rewatch tends to stem from things like visual spectacle, memorable lines or characters, and then pacing which may have been a part of that suspense and doubt from before.

I've seen Happy Gilmore dozens of times but I wouldn't say it's a "great" movie. It has rewatch potential because it's iconic for the genre and slapnuts funny or memorable. It's got that formula for watercooler or putting green lines and scenes you remember and repeat. So you watch it again to re-experience them.

Caddyshack, on the other hand, is a "great" movie.
You watch your tongue speaking ill about Happy Gilmore. I shan’t accept an opinion that doesn’t acknowledge it’s greatness.
 

usiel

Where wolf’s ears are, wolf’s teeth are near.
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I don't put rewatch value high up in the ranking metrics because that removes a lot of the weight for things like surprise value and emotional investment. Those are never the same the 2nd time around, or afterward.

If a movie does a good job of creating suspense or doubt about some outcome then later viewings will lack that power for sure.

Rewatch tends to stem from things like visual spectacle, memorable lines or characters, and then pacing which may have been a part of that suspense and doubt from before.

I've seen Happy Gilmore dozens of times but I wouldn't say it's a "great" movie. It has rewatch potential because it's iconic for the genre and slapnuts funny or memorable. It's got that formula for watercooler or putting green lines and scenes you remember and repeat. So you watch it again to re-experience them.

Caddyshack, on the other hand, is a "great" movie.
I see where you are coming but quible with the 'surprise value' as those are single bullet story shots that in this day and age will likely get spoiled. Imagine if The Sixth Sense came out today. I tend to hold off on watching season finales and even with my reduced social media stuff its hard to not miss the headlines. When there is a book I like I will re-read it multiple times. Sure the first time is the first time but chasing the first time like its many more times of value over the second time feels....

There are some fantastic movies that stick with me that are very difficult to rewatch. When I come to hard media buying it does factor in somewhat. Sure some I will buy even though I have never rewatched it after the purchase but the content was important enough to me that that is ok.
 

HTFN

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Feb 8, 2009
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I don't put rewatch value high up in the ranking metrics because that removes a lot of the weight for things like surprise value and emotional investment. Those are never the same the 2nd time around, or afterward.

If a movie does a good job of creating suspense or doubt about some outcome then later viewings will lack that power for sure.

Rewatch tends to stem from things like visual spectacle, memorable lines or characters, and then pacing which may have been a part of that suspense and doubt from before.

I've seen Happy Gilmore dozens of times but I wouldn't say it's a "great" movie. It has rewatch potential because it's iconic for the genre and slapnuts funny or memorable. It's got that formula for watercooler or putting green lines and scenes you remember and repeat. So you watch it again to re-experience them.

Caddyshack, on the other hand, is a "great" movie.
They can be the same, sometimes even improved, depending on craftsmanship. Rewatching helps distill some of those things for me because it lets you go back with the full picture and determine whether the story was well told or if you were distracted by cheap misdirects like jangling keys for a baby.

Like, some of the new Star Wars movies were fun enough rides, but the shine wears off really quickly once you know what comes next because there's nothing to chew on and a lot of it doesn't make much sense, or characters basically have to lie to themselves/you to create tension. You can go watch Shutter Island or Fight Club right now and still get a ton out of it because every scene has a second layer. They trick you but they don't lie to you so even if you're not so fully in suspense you're adding to the experience with your new "omniscience" and building the narrative from new perspectives.

Sometimes you won't know if something holds up or if you were just tricked into a decent time without trying to re-experience it
 

CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
Feb 27, 2002
66,289
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I don't put rewatch value high up in the ranking metrics because that removes a lot of the weight for things like surprise value and emotional investment. Those are never the same the 2nd time around, or afterward.

If a movie does a good job of creating suspense or doubt about some outcome then later viewings will lack that power for sure.

Rewatch tends to stem from things like visual spectacle, memorable lines or characters, and then pacing which may have been a part of that suspense and doubt from before.

I've seen Happy Gilmore dozens of times but I wouldn't say it's a "great" movie. It has rewatch potential because it's iconic for the genre and slapnuts funny or memorable. It's got that formula for watercooler or putting green lines and scenes you remember and repeat. So you watch it again to re-experience them.

Caddyshack, on the other hand, is a "great" movie.
This is why I try to analyze movies deeper than the standard major categories….

Happy Gilmour might not rank among the best comedic films of all time, but it certainly ranks among the best sports comedies IMO.

Does that mean I give it 5/5 stars? Nope, probably a 3.5, but it’s “greatness“ is built on that replay value IMO. It’s a movie you can pick up almost anywhere and enjoy it (if you‘re a fan), recite lines from, etc….and yeah….Sandler‘s dummy comedy schtick doesn‘t do it for me either typically.
 

CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
Feb 27, 2002
66,289
21,268
They can be the same, sometimes even improved, depending on craftsmanship. Rewatching helps distill some of those things for me because it lets you go back with the full picture and determine whether the story was well told or if you were distracted by cheap misdirects like jangling keys for a baby.

Like, some of the new Star Wars movies were fun enough rides, but the shine wears off really quickly once you know what comes next because there's nothing to chew on and a lot of it doesn't make much sense, or characters basically have to lie to themselves/you to create tension. You can go watch Shutter Island or Fight Club right now and still get a ton out of it because every scene has a second layer. They trick you but they don't lie to you so even if you're not so fully in suspense you're adding to the experience with your new "omniscience" and building the narrative from new perspectives.

Sometimes you won't know if something holds up or if you were just tricked into a decent time without trying to re-experience it
I find the rewatch really can validate or invalidate a film. Great films stand the test of time. As you point out, you’re less blinded than the first time seeing a flashy CGI scene, or big action event….you can really look deeper at what’s happening. I pick up soooooooo many things I miss in rewatches……stuff I probably subconsciously recognized first time around, but can now pay greater attention to and analyze further.

I guess I should also say that while ”replay value” for me, is certainly among my most important movie metrics, a movie also doesn’t HAVE to give me replay value for it to also be considered “great”. Some movies are just better built for that first watch, because IMO, they employ emotion to get that first reaction or surprise that makes the movie. (6th sense, etc)

The Green Mile for me….prime example. I saw that movie and I have never had an emotional reaction in a movie like that. It was embarrassing! Lol….

On the rewatch, I could barely make it through it, because the Director shot his wad the first time, and you just can’t recreate that raw emotion again (usually). I consider it great, for that one unrepeatable experience.
 
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Jags

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May 5, 2016
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I think we get too hung up on terminology. If you enjoy watching a movie over and over, that's a great movie in my book. It's 100% about a movie's ambitions and whether it actually meets them. Kinda like Olympic diving. The difficulty of the dive matters, but a great dive is a great dive regardless.

Even formulaic movies (and comedies in general) can be great. That there are a bunch of shitty "fish out of water" comedies doesn't make My Cousin Vinny any less great. The litany of underdog sports comedies that suck -- even their own sequels -- don't hurt the greatness of the original Bad News Bears or Major League.

Another factor is the whole idea of a "guilty pleasure," which I've always thought is silly. Like what you like. Why be embarrassed about it? So we can love watching Happy Gilmore, but we can't say it's a great movie? Screw that. It's trying to be a funny movie and succeeds. The ambition may not be very high, but it clears the bar with ease regardless. It's a great comedy.

"But it's no Citizen Kane!"

Why is that the metric? What's the point in comparing a great sports comedy to a great film from another genre? Compare it to great movies of its ilk. Does it hold up? Yes? Then it's great. What's a comedy masterpiece for you? It's subjective, but pick one that sets a high bar and compare Happy Gilmore to that. For me, Young Frankenstein is an all-time great comedy. It has layers of satire and parody that add deeper value, but it's a comedy nonetheless. The best thing I can say about any comedy is that I laughed throughout, and that's pretty equally true with both movies. Both are great. Equally great? Who gives a damn? ;)

As for Doctor Strange, it was fine. My problem with the MCU now is the time travel and alternate universes. If you use those ideas very sparingly and only ever in clever ways, they can be great, powerful tools for telling interesting stories. But that almost never happens with either concept. Eventually they're allowed to run away with themselves until the universe you've created is now completely devoid of consequence.

And that's where the MCU is now. The original Doctor Strange's ending is a perfect example. The whole story builds to this impossibly huge climax, and it just gets undone over and over until he figures out how to win. The only saving graces are that A) he puts the Time Stone away, never to be used again (wink wink). And B) the self-awareness of that moment -- i.e. "It's time travel, stupid. I can keep doing this over and over and over until you just plain get sick of it." It's easy to enjoy that particular ending done that way because it's understood that it's something of a one-off. But then Ant-Man 2 and Endgame and Loki and No Way Home and another Doc Strange...

Now we're at the point that they're doing it over and over until we're just plain sick of it.

Consequence is important. Nothing means anything if everything can be undone. (Say THAT five times fast.)

"Oh no! (SPOILER) is dead!"

Yeah, but they're not. We just saw 14 alternate versions of them, any of whom can come for a visit whenever we need them. And if you're really stuck on that particular one, then just go back in time and save them. Easy peasy.

So I wouldn't be upset if we never saw that multiverse girl again, but given that they've just introduced younger versions of damn near every Avenger (Hawkeye, Black Widow, Captain America, Ant-Man, Ms. Marvel) with apparently more on the way (Hulk, Iron Man maybe twice, Black Panther, etc.), I'm not holding my breath.
 

twabby

Registered User
Mar 9, 2010
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Here’s the metric one should use for judging how great a movie is: is it Jurassic Park? If not, how close is it to Jurassic Park?
 

Neil Racki

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May 2, 2018
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Ex Machina - surprised I havent seen it until now. Good and def worth a watch, albeit you kinda knew how it would end 30 mis in. trying to check off my A24 list.

Spiderhead - plot a lot like Ex Machina. Hemsworth in a non thor/action role, Miles Teller .. also def worth a watch

---------------

I have certain movies Ive seen many many times, usually late night like 1 am and Im drunk or really stoned.

Big Lebowski
Sin City
Beerfest
Kung Fu Hustle
Black Dynamite
tarantino anything

Watched jackie Brown last night, such a good forgotten flick ..
 

AlexModvechkin8

At least there was 2018.
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Ex Machina - surprised I havent seen it until now. Good and def worth a watch, albeit you kinda knew how it would end 30 mis in. trying to check off my A24 list.

Spiderhead - plot a lot like Ex Machina. Hemsworth in a non thor/action role, Miles Teller .. also def worth a watch

---------------

I have certain movies Ive seen many many times, usually late night like 1 am and Im drunk or really stoned.

Big Lebowski
Sin City
Beerfest
Kung Fu Hustle
Black Dynamite
tarantino anything

Watched jackie Brown last night, such a good forgotten flick ..
Ex Machina, if it isn’t number one it’s definitely in my top five, of movies I detest that everyone else liked. I hated every minute of it and if there’s a word for stronger than hate, that’s how I feel about the last half hour. Just an awful experience from beginning to end.

Got a little stoned earlier this week and started watching Boogie Nights. Don’t think I’ve seen that movie in close to 20 years but I like it better than I remember.
 

CapitalsCupReality

It’s Go Time!!
Feb 27, 2002
66,289
21,268
Ex Machina - surprised I havent seen it until now. Good and def worth a watch, albeit you kinda knew how it would end 30 mis in. trying to check off my A24 list.

Spiderhead - plot a lot like Ex Machina. Hemsworth in a non thor/action role, Miles Teller .. also def worth a watch

---------------

I have certain movies Ive seen many many times, usually late night like 1 am and Im drunk or really stoned.

Big Lebowski
Sin City
Beerfest
Kung Fu Hustle
Black Dynamite
tarantino anything

Watched jackie Brown last night, such a good forgotten flick ..
Ex Machina was good. Enjoyed Spiderhead waaaay more than I expected to. Love the Sin City movies…
 

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