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[Peter Griffin]

"If I told you what I was offered for Brock Boeser, I think I would have to run out of here."
That definitely doesn't mean a first-round pick. It clearly means a first-round pick wasn't offered. I wouldn't have traded Boeser for a second and a middling prospect. That reeks of doing something just to do something.

I'm surprised nobody pushed him on this more and inquired if a 1st was offered considering virtually every other player available went for more than what was predicted. Why was it that only the offers for Vancouver's players were poor? Or were they just less than what they wanted to move them for, ie: "can't take a step back, need a replacement to be offered!".

For all the talk of what a great year Boeser had last year, Nyqvist had more points. I don't think he's far worse, and I don't think Bill Guerin has ever liked Boeser much. If they do like him, they can just sign him in the summer.

He's 35 and has 9 goals despite getting PP time and playing a lot with Forsberg/O'Reilly 5-on-5. He's cooked.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

The Allvin presser gave me the impression that the league knows how much pressure we are under as an organization and no one is handing out life vests.

 

[supercanuck]

Looking (too far?) ahead...with 14M in projected capspace, who should we be going after in free agency? Ehlers + Bennett?

 

[bossram]

i don't think it's just morale, it's mentality.

we should not ever communicate to the players that we are throwing in the towel. Even the idea of trading Brock is for the purpose of upgrading and not giving up.

Sure. But the tone of Allvin's presser sounded pretty despondent. Did he give up?

 

[Isi]

once again, teams willing to throw away their 2nd rounders on wingers does not mean they are willing to throw away their 1st rounders for wingers.

the draft is seen as crap so teams see less value in the non 1st rounders, that also means that they see the 1st rounder as having much higher value compared to previous TDL because those picks are the only ones with real value this draft.

if teams truly were not prepared to trade a first for Brock...that just means they need to take the next best deal. If they could have got a deal built about a couple of 2nd round draft picks, then we should have done that, if we couldn't get a first.

I have my doubts about how truthful the GM is being, but let's play at it face value. We've set a price on the player that the market has not met.....so we've taken our ball and gone home. It's an insane argument. We've had months and months to agree to a new contract with Brock, and the club is clearly not willing to go where Brock and his management group thinks the market will go. So we don't want to re-sign Brock to what the market will probably set, we want to re-sign him to a contract that matches what we think his value is, but we will only trade Brock for what we think his value is, not what the market sets. And ultimately....we'll just let Brock walk away for nothing? (or sign a contract that we have refused to sign for months because we think it'll be a bad contract!). It's an insane argument. We are not in the position where we can do this sort of stuff.

and of course this isn't the first time this management group has botched a deadline, or the run-up to the deadline. Re-signing Kuzmenko in 2023 was absolutely stupid, we should have traded him at the deadline for whatever picks we could have got. But we signed him, which then led to us having to buy out OEL because of our salary cap situation, and then we had to salary dump Beauvillier for a 5th round pick so that we could then trade for Zadorov to replace OEL, and then we ended up cap dumping Kuzmenko anyway. I highlight this to show that one simple thing (holding onto a player we should have traded) can have flow on effects. If Brock simply walks away for free, well we're down assets to use to replace him. And if we sign him, well the team has made it pretty clear they don't like the contract Brock wants. So how does that end up for us?

I guess the good thing is that Rutherford has shown, not that we had really any doubt about it, that he doesn't have total control, so we can forget about that fiction now.

 

[arttk]

Sure. But the tone of Allvin's presser sounded pretty despondent. Did he give up?

haven’t listened, I guess I’ll listen to it tonight

 

[Rick Rocket]

Tbf it isn't managements fault that Miller and EP threw in the towel this season. Also Marchand only got a 2nd so maybe teams didn't want to give much for Boeser?

Given the tire fire of injuries, personal issues (cancer for one), and locker room issues... we are still 1 point out of the playoffs with 21 games left.

I dunno. It isn't the end of the world.

Suter and Forbort are worth more to our PK and team than we would have got back likely and maybe they will both re-sign.

I think management is very much to blame with icing such a horrendous D for an extended period of time because they were so set on Marcus Pettersson. They literally could have done anything better than what they did.

There has to be some consideration of team losses affecting the locker room with at least babies like Miller and Petey.

Regardless, if Miller had to go maybe with the D addressed before the start of the season, return piece(s) could have been focused on improving other areas of the team.

Maybe some injuries wouldn't have occurred with Hughes having to carry the team every game, including others.

 

[Michael Dal Swolle]

Huh, a lot of people on here are furious we didn't sell while i'm sitting here mildly disappointed that we didn't ship out our first rounder to add to the roster

 

[December5th]

Huh, a lot of people on here are furious we didn't sell while i'm sitting here mildly disappointed that we didn't ship out our first rounder to add to the roster

i would be down if they did both. sell and then use it addition to the first rounder to get an even better player. trade brock and gain value from him and still improve the team for this year and into next year

 

[Isi]

Huh, a lot of people on here are furious we didn't sell while i'm sitting here mildly disappointed that we didn't ship out our first rounder to add to the roster

good news! we can still do that at the draft!

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

The Allvin presser gave me the impression that the league knows how much pressure we are under as an organization and no one is handing out life vests.

It’s very obvious and every knows that.

But mgmt has put themselves it that position with how they handled the Miller/Ep situation and pissing around with Brock on extension/no extension/trade/no trade.

They smelled blood in the water.

 

[arttk]

if teams truly were not prepared to trade a first for Brock...that just means they need to take the next best deal. If they could have got a deal built about a couple of 2nd round draft picks, then we should have done that, if we couldn't get a first.

I have my doubts about how truthful the GM is being, but let's play at it face value. We've set a price on the player that the market has not met.....so we've taken our ball and gone home. It's an insane argument. We've had months and months to agree to a new contract with Brock, and the club is clearly not willing to go where Brock and his management group thinks the market will go. So we don't want to re-sign Brock to what the market will probably set, we want to re-sign him to a contract that matches what we think his value is, but we will only trade Brock for what we think his value is, not what the market sets. And ultimately....we'll just let Brock walk away for nothing? (or sign a contract that we have refused to sign for months because we think it'll be a bad contract!). It's an insane argument. We are not in the position where we can do this sort of stuff.

and of course this isn't the first time this management group has botched a deadline, or the run-up to the deadline. Re-signing Kuzmenko in 2023 was absolutely stupid, we should have traded him at the deadline for whatever picks we could have got. But we signed him, which then led to us having to buy out OEL because of our salary cap situation, and then we had to salary dump Beauvillier for a 5th round pick so that we could then trade for Zadorov to replace OEL, and then we ended up cap dumping Kuzmenko anyway. I highlight this to show that one simple thing (holding onto a player we should have traded) can have flow on effects. If Brock simply walks away for free, well we're down assets to use to replace him. And if we sign him, well the team has made it pretty clear they don't like the contract Borck wants. So how does that end up for us?

I guess the good thing is that Rutherford has shown, not that we had really any doubt about it, that he doesn't have total control, so we can forget about that fiction now.

Taking the next best deal that doesn’t include a 1st doesn’t do shit for us. The whole point is to get a 1st ++ and combine that with our 1st and maybe more to get a player signed to term.

So if nobody is willing to give us a 1st for Brock and he walks, it’s not like we gave up a 1st rounder for nothing, like he never had that value in the 1st place. We lose a good player, yes but we did not lose the value he never had.

OEL had to go regardless of us extending Kuz or not. There is no way to justify a 8M 2nd pairing LD, we can’t build a f***ing D around that type of cap allotment. The outcome for OEL was always going to be a buyout or eat like 50% to trade him away.

 

[Peter Griffin]

i would be down if they did both. sell and then use it addition to the first rounder to get an even better player

Fabian Zetterlund would've been a nice guy to "replace" Brock with. Younger, faster and provides some physicality this team could use more of.

 

[604]

Just re-sign Brock to hopefully a decent deal.

 

[BluesyShoes]

Meh, I get tweener vibes from him.

Good on the forecheck though.

He's a high motor power forward in my eyes. 5'11, 220 lbs. Maybe he's on the 3rd line, but that's exactly what you want there. He's also been scoring at a 2nd liner pace the past two seasons on a poor San Jose team. Could go either way though, since he might get less opportunity offensively here. I think he'd do well in Tocchet's system and could move up and down the lineup.

 

[Isi]

Taking the next best deal that doesn’t include a 1st doesn’t do shit for us. The whole point is to get a 1st ++ and combine that with our 1st and maybe more to get a player signed to term.

So if nobody is willing to give us a 1st for Brock and he walks, it’s not like we gave up a 1st rounder for nothing, like he never had that value in the 1st place. We lose a good player, yes but we did not lose the value he never had.

OEL had to go regardless of us extending Kuz or not. There is no way to justify a 8M 2nd pairing LD, we can’t build a f***ing D around that type of cap allotment. The outcome for OEL was always going to be a buyout or eat like 50% to trade him away.

actually it gives us assets to use to trade for players.

or we can die on our sword instead. idk.

 

[wonton15]

Sounds like they think Boeser is too slow and they are going to let him walk. Either way, disaster class.

 

[arttk]

actually it gives us assets to use to trade for players.

or we can die on our sword instead. idk.

That’s the point, it’s not enough assets to get is what we want.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Taking the next best deal that doesn’t include a 1st doesn’t do shit for us. The whole point is to get a 1st ++ and combine that with our 1st and maybe more to get a player signed to term.

So if nobody is willing to give us a 1st for Brock and he walks, it’s not like we gave up a 1st rounder for nothing, like he never had that value in the 1st place. We lose a good player, yes but we did not lose the value he never had.

The whole point was to get some assets for an asset they clearly don't have real interest in keeping. Maybe there wasn't an offer of a 1st but there was for 2 2nds? Those can be utilized to acquire someone they actually want to keep long term. Instead we have a player that really isn't contributing since his center was moved, and a less than 50% shot at making the playoffs and almost certainly getting shit kicked. If the goal is to build a contender and not just try to squeak into the playoffs, then they failed today.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

It’s very obvious and every knows that.

But mgmt has put themselves it that position with how they handled the Miller/Ep situation and pissing around with Brock on extension/no extension/trade/no trade.

They smelled blood in the water.

I mean no one wanted to trade for Miller at value before his extension. And you can’t just make a blunderous trade as a rookie GM.

 

[December5th]

i dont get why people are mad at Alvin. i never had a problem with him, to me hes beautiful, bennningesque

 

[credulous]

Aren’t you happy? They did exactly what you wanted them to do, moved Soucy and nothing else.

i didn't want them to move soucy. i wanted them to add. it's a weak draft year so tanking is pointless

if they'd sold i would have been surprised but not really unhappy pending seeing what they do at the draft and over the summer. if they turned those assets into a couple good forwards then it would have been worth it

what's intolerable is them continuing to refuse to pick a direction. either get aggressive about competing or get smart about hoarding assets to do it later. this middle road thing is just mediocrity

 

[ProviesGhost]

The goal is always to squeak into the playoffs. That's the context here, measure the moves based on that (whether you agree or not). I'd rather have Brock than 2nd round pick and a b-level prospect. And maybe this market assessment is a reality check for him, and he'll stay on a contract closer to where he's at now.

 

[Snatcher Demko]

"Hey Brock. You're are good but we think you aren't worth what you are asking"
"Hey Brock. We still like you but focused on re-signing Lankinen, MP and DOC as they are more a priority"
"Hey Brock. We are looking to trade you. Where would you be ok to moving to?"
"Hey Brock. Teams didn't value you enough so you're staying"
"Hey Brock. Still interested in re-signing?"

Good grief.

Thing is, I don't see Brock getting a huge deal in the offseason - he's had many setbacks and has had one great season. I could see him being offered $7.5 x 4 or maybe 5 years at most, at which point Vancouver looks a lot more attractive. Maybe Brock needs to see the market for himself.

 

[Peter Griffin]

He's also a lot better

He's also a life long Bruin and despite not having a full NMC, they probably traded him under those parameters.