Post-Game Talk: Canucks def. Sharks - 4-3 (OT) (Burroughs, Mikheyev, Pettersson, Kuzmenko)

[krutovsdonut]

^ I think all of us just want some good vibrations for the team. Some aren't feeling that vibe. That's fine. For me, I'm trying to enjoy the wins as they come to not go crazy. I don't feel the vibe either, but I'd very much like to. After a really tough start, it's nice to the boys smiling again. If there's those who disagree, that will be whatever it will be. But on either side, if after a few wins or a few losses, people come here for a spin of the "told you so" circle. That I can not abide. That stupid tribalism that takes turns claiming this is the best team ever or worst team ever. It's not. It's a mediocre, playoff bubble team. Just enjoy it for that in whatever way you want. Just don't make it my problem.

yeah i will claim no particular vibe or corner turned here. i do feel something gave in the third period in boston that i cannot quantify, but i am far from thinking we are out of the woods.

it was just three good games that i enjoyed watching, plus what i perceive to be a very recent significant. progression by pettersson that is really exciting if he can sustain it.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Some of us look beyond our rose coloured glasses and want to see a plan for consistent Stanley Cup contention. Up until very recently you were adamant the old regime was THIS CLOSE. You’re the last person who should be advising anybody else on how to fan.

Adamant the old old regime was THIS CLOSE to what?...I'm not advising anybody on how to be a fan, but the same person whining when we win, and whining when we lose ...is flat out just whining.

 

[Zippgunn]

Given the way the team was fading in the third saw no way for a comeback. A couple of players dug deep and got the team out of the ditch. Team has skill and seems to adding grit. No master piece but maybe in the process of seeing our season saved.

Pettersson - the legend is building. HIs commitment is absolute and we don't win without both his skill and his tenacity. Great game

Kuzmenko - his OT winner is likely the highlight of the season. Somehow you knew game was over as soon as he broke for the net. A must re-sign at this point. What a breath of fresh air! How high is the ceiling on this player??

Myers - his game is moving up. Still prone to the big time gaffe but he is playing harder and is pushing the play up the ice. Too bad he can't ever score on his chances but he is playing bigger around his net and really extending his zone of coverage. When Burroughs faded in the third, Myers had to take over coverage for most of the area from the circles in.

MIkhayev - if he can just build off his scoring lately and start tucking away the chances he is getting, his line will be very dangerous. Chemistry seems to building and the talent is there.

Demko - good game. Something to build off of. Couple of the goals against were flukey and he had to come up with huge saves to keep the team in it. Wide open question as to who you start next game.

Garland - never stopped competing. Drove the play and helped late in third with the team on the ropes. One of the only ones providing the energy to get some o-zone time. Did his best to keep his line from totally falling apart.

Miller - had some ups and downs in the game but worked the PP well (even though it didn't score) and pass on the winner was elite.

Not So Good

Boeser - mostly a passenger and not a very good one. Does some dinky little things with his stick but he was getting left two zones behind the play in transition. Play in his end is just horrible. Waves his stick at people occasionally another wise mostly stands still and watches. His point is always open and when player slide up his side on the cycle he never does anything but briefly move towards them. Player loves no contact hockey and I guess he would say after this game -"Well I was tired, you know" - like everyone else wasn't??? Polar opposite to Pettersson in terms of commitment. Either that or he simply cannot skate well enough to be in the League.

Lazar - guy is suppose to provide forechecking and good defense. Provided neither in this game. Aman constantly covering for this player who again was lugging around. In the late Shark blitz, he went AWOL and was the principle reasons his line had trouble. At this point, I think you could make a case that Lockwood could replace him. At least Lockwood has the wheels to stay firmly in the play and likely produce some offense (of which Lazar provides none). History on Lazar has been that he can't provide enough over any length of time to stay in the League. Might be he is slipping back towards a home in the AHL. IMO not close to being good enough. You could find things about Hoglander's play to fault but his try is there. I don't see the same out of Lazar and don't see him accomplishing much of anything.

Schenn - has tailed off in the last couple of games. Has had to bear a ton of weight this year and I think it's beginning to tell. Making a lot of plays from deep in his zone instead of having the speed to move up and shorten his passes. Starting to get beat a bit by players going wide. You hate to criticize given how well he has done for so long but lapses around the net are creeping into his play. Too bad the team isn't deep enough to give him a rest now and then and doesn't have someone else who can play well with Hughes.

Others

Bear - great first couple of periods but tired in the third. Overall, he was helpful in this game and is helping lift OEL's game

Burroughs - really ditto Bear - had a tough third. However, taking on a load that he does not usually gets. More a positive in the game than a negative.

Great road trip and as I suggested before, you can have some optimism looking ahead.

...and, unsurprisingly, no mention whatsoever of Horvat which figures around here...

Also please note the last two goalies we faced played .860 and .800 (!!) Hockey. Get back to me when we start playing NHL netminders...

 

[Deeds26]

...and, unsurprisingly, no mention whatsoever of Horvat which figures around here...

Also please note the last two goalies we faced played .860 and .800 (!!) Hockey. Get back to me when we start playing NHL netminders...

Yes, Logan Thompson and his season's SV% of 0.920 (4th for goalies over 15GP), isn't an NHL netminder because he had one bad game against us and it makes us a terrible team for making him have a .860SV%.

But it was nice to face Kahkonen in last night's game who isn't an NHL netminder, considering it was the second game of a back-to-back.

 

[Canuckle1970]

How many teams with 6 ppg players have missed the playoffs?

Thumbs up to your poster name

 

[Shareefruck]

I made none of those claims.

My point was calling out the rebuild supporters and how short-sighted they are.

Errr.... Rebuild supporters are the most future-sighted people possible, almost by definition. Admittedly to a fault, if we want to go there.

Even if you think this team can compete, I'm not sure how thinking otherwise could possibly be considered "short-sighted". Especially ironic when you're the one calling for everyone to eat crow based on the three most recent games.

Too much of a pie-in-the-sky idealist/perfectionist to be practical might be a more fitting criticism.

 

[Shareefruck]

Also, this recent narrative that the team was good all along, it was just Demko that was the problem is a bit disingenuous, in my opinion. The defense was just as big of a problem as goaltending was-- not just by the defensemen, but by the forwards, and the coach's identification of who's reliable/who's not.

This recent improvement doesn't happen without all of these elements actually getting significantly better and working out its issues (Bear and Burroughs in over Stillman has helped reverse the tide a lot, too). The only difference is that Demko's struggles have persisted.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Also, this recent narrative that the team was good all along, it was just Demko that was the problem is a bit disingenuous, in my opinion. The defense was just as big of a problem as goaltending was-- not just by the defensemen, but by the forwards, and the coach's identification of who's reliable/who's not.

This recent improvement doesn't happen without all of these elements actually getting significantly better and working out its issues (Bear and Burroughs in over Stillman has helped reverse the tide a lot, too). The only difference is that Demko's struggles have persisted.

Who was saying that the team was good all along..?....It clearly wasnt just Demko that was THE problem, although I would say that his poor play has been 50% of the problem.

If Demko had even been average at the start of the season..the 'fragile team' and dreadful defence' discussion wouldn't be as big as it is...Not getting the saves in the 3rd period was a major trigger for everything else to go wrong.

 

[MS]

Also, this recent narrative that the team was good all along, it was just Demko that was the problem is a bit disingenuous, in my opinion. The defense was just as big of a problem as goaltending was-- not just by the defensemen, but by the forwards, and the coach's identification of who's reliable/who's not.

This recent improvement doesn't happen without all of these elements actually getting significantly better and working out its issues (Bear and Burroughs in over Stillman has helped reverse the tide a lot, too). The only difference is that Demko's struggles have persisted.

I don't think anyone was saying that Demko was *THE* problem or that the team would be great or anything with him performing well. I can't speak for everyone but what I have been saying is that Demko is the biggest issue causing the team to be worse than what was expected.

I expected that this team would score a lot of goals, have bad defense, have very good goaltending, probably finish 10-15th place in the league.

The offense is as expected (top-5 in the league), the defense is as expected (bad), but the goaltending has been unexpectedly atrocious.

 

[Vector]

I don't think anyone was saying that Demko was *THE* problem or that the team would be great or anything with him performing well. I can't speak for everyone but what I have been saying is that Demko is the biggest issue causing the team to be worse than what was expected.

I expected that this team would score a lot of goals, have bad defense, have very good goaltending, probably finish 10-15th place in the league.

The offense is as expected (top-5 in the league), the defense is as expected (bad), but the goaltending has been unexpectedly atrocious.

I think the defence has been worse than last year as well. OEL and Myers inability to eat up minutes really hurt in the first 15 games. Then a lot of the forwards have been very bad supporting the defensemen (Miller, Boeser, and Pearson stood out as atrocious). So that hadn’t helped and made an already rough start worse for Demko.

 

[Shareefruck]

I don't think anyone was saying that Demko was *THE* problem or that the team would be great or anything with him performing well. I can't speak for everyone but what I have been saying is that Demko is the biggest issue causing the team to be worse than what was expected.

I expected that this team would score a lot of goals, have bad defense, have very good goaltending, probably finish 10-15th place in the league.

The offense is as expected (top-5 in the league), the defense is as expected (bad), but the goaltending has been unexpectedly atrocious.

Who was saying that the team was good all along..?....It clearly wasnt just Demko that was THE problem, although I would say that his poor play has been 50% of the problem.

If Demko had even been average at the start of the season..the 'fragile team' and dreadful defence' discussion wouldn't be as big as it is...Not getting the saves in the 3rd period was a major trigger for everything else to go wrong.

I was following up on the post I made right before that and referring to Canuckle's comment (which was very very reductive and "toldja so" about something that isn't even true). Pretty clear that IS what's being implied in this post (that the team was good all along and it was just Demko holding it back). Not familiar with what you've said on the subject.

This post:

I just want to say all you naysayers no patient bandwagoners, rebuild-calling buffoons, y'all don't know jack. I've been saying since the off-season we have a good crop of forwards. I said it at the start of the season it's Demko that's the problem and it keeps showing to be that way. We don't need a rebuild. A rebuild won't look better than what we have right now. A rebuild might take 10 years to get to what we have now on the roster. Edmonton has McDavid and they're not the best team in the NHL they haven't even won a cup. Y'all need to go touch grass.

Very revisionist.

 

[BringBackTheV]

Big props to you if you were correct on Demko. I didn't see this at all. What flaws did you see in Demko last year that lead you to believe that he'd struggle this year?

I assume he saw "surgery in off season.....".

 

[PuckMunchkin]

Unfortunately, not really a surprise at all. He made another terrible giveaway in the first period of this game, same as he did last game. He just has no try out there anymore it seems.

I really don't know where the narrative came from that gets bandied around in the media that he's a strong defensive player who wins board battles. That has not been the case since he came into the league, but at least he had the skill and confidence his first couple years to outweigh those issues. These days the cycle is as good as over as soon as he gets into a puck battle in the corner or behind the net.

It comes from his previous play.

I think I have an idea from who here this narrstive comes from that he was not that player.

He has not been that player this season.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I don't think anyone was saying that Demko was *THE* problem or that the team would be great or anything with him performing well. I can't speak for everyone but what I have been saying is that Demko is the biggest issue causing the team to be worse than what was expected.

I expected that this team would score a lot of goals, have bad defense, have very good goaltending, probably finish 10-15th place in the league.

The offense is as expected (top-5 in the league), the defense is as expected (bad), but the goaltending has been unexpectedly atrocious.

I would push back there.

Myers and OEL going from holding their own in matchup minutes back to their previous selves has been more devastating.

Also. If a nobody was playing like Miller the first 15 games or so he would have been waived. The management failing to asses what he is has put us in a position where we have a career AHLer as our 3rd line C.

Demko is a close 3rd to these issues.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

I just want to say all you naysayers no patient bandwagoners, rebuild-calling buffoons, y'all don't know jack. I've been saying since the off-season we have a good crop of forwards. I said it at the start of the season it's Demko that's the problem and it keeps showing to be that way. We don't need a rebuild. A rebuild won't look better than what we have right now. A rebuild might take 10 years to get to what we have now on the roster. Edmonton has McDavid and they're not the best team in the NHL they haven't even won a cup. Y'all need to go touch grass.

I bet you’re fun at a party…..

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I just want to say all you naysayers no patient bandwagoners, rebuild-calling buffoons, y'all don't know jack. I've been saying since the off-season we have a good crop of forwards. I said it at the start of the season it's Demko that's the problem and it keeps showing to be that way. We don't need a rebuild. A rebuild won't look better than what we have right now. A rebuild might take 10 years to get to what we have now on the roster. Edmonton has McDavid and they're not the best team in the NHL they haven't even won a cup. Y'all need to go touch grass.

Ahh to be young and innocent.

 

[Kevinsane]

Errr.... Rebuild supporters are the most future-sighted people possible, almost by definition. Admittedly to a fault, if we want to go there.

Even if you think this team can compete, I'm not sure how thinking otherwise could possibly be considered "short-sighted". Especially ironic when you're the one calling for everyone to eat crow based on the three most recent games.

Too much of a pie-in-the-sky idealist/perfectionist to be practical might be a more fitting criticism.

YEAH, anyone who doesn’t support this team as is doesn’t deserve to watch their valiant but losing effort in round one of the playoffs.

What is the goal in the NHL? To win the Stanley Cup, or at least be a strong contender to do so.
People happy to eke out a shootout win over San Jose can have their validation of derrr it was all the goalie’s fault. .
I’d rather see the Canucks tear it down and aim for four rounds of winning.

A three game tear as a reason to circle the wagons of optimism is comical when the team still trots out the dead weight of OEL and Myers.

 

[alternate]

YEAH, anyone who doesn’t support this team as is doesn’t deserve to watch their valiant but losing effort in round one of the playoffs.

What is the goal in the NHL? To win the Stanley Cup, or at least be a strong contender to do so.
People happy to eke out a shootout win over San Jose can have their validation of derrr it was all the goalie’s fault. .
I’d rather see the Canucks tear it down and aim for four rounds of winning.

A three game tear as a reason to circle the wagons of optimism is comical when the team still trots out the dead weight of OEL and Myers.

Exactly. It's like people don't even recognize how COL went from sucking and picking top 3 overall to Cup champions. There was no growth or gradual improvement. And there certainly wasn't first round playoff exits. Those are for losers.

There's one way to win, and one way only: constant tear downs and tanking until you are the clear favorite. Then and only then, worry about making the playoffs. The Avs method, as it were.

 

[Kevinsane]

Exactly. It's like people don't even recognize how COL went from sucking and picking top 3 overall to Cup champions. There was no growth or gradual improvement. And there certainly wasn't first round playoff exits. Those are for losers.

There's one way to win, and one way only: constant tear downs and tanking until you are the clear favorite. Then and only then, worry about making the playoffs. The Avs method, as it were.

Your facetiousness and sarcasm is noted.
Tanking deliberately and acquiring pieces is one thing. The Canucks did it under Benning while maxed to the cap and still accruing horrendous and bloated contracts.

Im reserving judgment on the new regime, but signing Miller to an extension that’s going to make it harder, not easier, to resign the core doesn’t inspire one to believe we’re moving closer to contention.

 

[credulous]

demko hasn't been good but the team is much worse 5v5 this season. last year they were middle of the pack this year they are bottom 10 and closer to worst than they are to the median

 

[PuckMunchkin]

Exactly. It's like people don't even recognize how COL went from sucking and picking top 3 overall to Cup champions. There was no growth or gradual improvement. And there certainly wasn't first round playoff exits. Those are for losers.

There's one way to win, and one way only: constant tear downs and tanking until you are the clear favorite. Then and only then, worry about making the playoffs. The Avs method, as it were.

Oh you poor thing