Canadian Government Freezing Hockey Canada Funding- (2018 Canada World Jr Team Alleged Sexual Assault)

[Dr Pepper]

Kind my point, Westhead, Strang etc dont suck up, and tells the story and just dont give a d..n

Which makes it all the more surprising that Westhead is with TSN, given their infatuation with all things WJC.

 

[Ghost of Jody Hull]

Do we know the first guy invited the others for this purpose?

Don't forget, these are 17/18 yr olds. Hotel rooms are one of the few places they can hook up.

It wouldn't shock me if the events unfolded like this: The others came up to the room for some sort of afterparty, and/or knew and wanted to prank/surprise the first guy. Then the first guy probably had an "oh shit, the boys are here for the afterparty! throw some clothes on!" moment. Then the 9 of them probably hung out for a while, had some drinks, while things gradually escalated to a gross level. Probably starting with random ass grabbings, then "you should make out with him", then you should take your top off, then you should do x to that guy, then to the point where it was a full on gang rape. We know these events took place over the course of a few hours until 4am, and some guys left early, before partaking in any of these acts, probably in disgust.

It's important to understand how sexual assault often takes place. People always assume it's like in the movies, where rapists are aggressive and physically restrain the victim. Often times, that's not the reality. It often starts very gradually, until the victim is uncomfortable, withdraws consent (assuming she gave consent), but the aggressor(s) don't stop.

I saw some people in this thread talk about golf clubs.... I just don't think that necessarily means anything. It could have been related to the assault, but I think it's far more likely it had nothing to do with it.

This. 99% of sexual assaults are not like what you see in Law & Order SVU.

The perpetrator is usually someone the victim knows and likes. Sometimes, a person consents to one act but not to something that happens next. Afterwards, it's easy for victims to start thinking, "well... was it my fault? Did I lead him on?" That's why it can be so traumatic and difficult for those who were assaulted to actually come forward. They go through an incredibly complex set of emotions that would be hard for anyone to navigate, let alone someone who's in their late teens or early twenties.

It's also common for the perpetrators to misread "signals". They don't go into a situation with the intention of rape or assault. And when the person they're with says, "I'm not sure about this" instead of "stop", they keep going. They assault someone without realizing they're assaulting someone.

The theme from the text messages is so incredibly common, it's crazy and scary. "I felt taken advantage of". "But I thought you were having fun." This happens more than people know. It happens every single night.

That's why it's so important for there to be a much louder and in-depth conversation about consent in schools, and kids need to start being taught these concepts when they're 12 or 13.

Honestly, while Hockey Canada acted abhorrently here, I think the Federal Government needs to take control of this. There needs to be a national curriculum around sexuality and consent taught to every single kid in this country, and one that's tailored for today's age.

 

[Deuce22]

Great job by the media suddenly dredging up a sexual assault story from 2003. As if anyone with a brain can't see that they're been enabling this kind of behavior all along.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

Great job by the media suddenly dredging up a sexual assault story from 2003. As if anyone with a brain can't see that they're been enabling this kind of behavior all along.

It's almost like "the media" isn't made up of 1 single person but by a large, diverse group, which is constantly changing.

 

[Deuce22]

It's almost like "the media" isn't made up of 1 single person but by a large, diverse group, which is constantly changing.

Yeah, kind of like hockey players.

 

[wetcoast]

Considering how you keep saying how a hockey forum knows Jack shit, I would think a lawyer would know more than you.

I don't even know why you are quoting the post I presented.

Option A the courts, a defined legal process

Option B, the court of public opinion, in this case HF Boards

One doesn't need to be a lawyer to know which option is "better"

Maybe instead of trying to score points you keep up with the conversation?

 

[ClydeLee]

Kind my point, Westhead, Strang etc dont suck up, and tells the story and just dont give a d..n

Westhead isn't even a hockey reporter though, he just kept getting thrown into these things and told about them as a reporter who is trusted because he broke prior similar situations open. You can't just compare him and say other hockey reporters don't do x, well that's not the same job.

 

[AvroArrow]

Omg now they're reporting the 2003 junior team also being accused of group sexual assault....what the f***.

Police open investigations into 2003 and 2018 Canadian world junior teams

Two of Canada's men's world junior hockey teams are now being investigated by police following alleged group sexual assaults in 2003 and 2018.

www.ctvnews.ca

 

[theVladiator]

Great job by the media suddenly dredging up a sexual assault story from 2003. As if anyone with a brain can't see that they're been enabling this kind of behavior all along.

Well, some folks could have been holding out until all the facts are on the table...

 

[I am toxic]

Hockey Canada's absolute incompetence at "investigating" gang rape allegations is beyond belief.

Millions of dollars and third party "investigators" (hatchet persons) at their disposal, and they get scooped by Westhead.

They couldn't maintain a greater cone of silence on these things if they were actively trying to hush it up.

 

[Transplanted Caper]

Obviously a secondary factor in all this, but how TSN covers - and who they get to cover - the WJC will be fascinating. I don't think they can just ignore it, but they also don't likely have many personalities who are equipped to talk about it properly. I assume their on-air talent have been warned to not be flippant about it or to really not discuss it at all up until now. Once those games get started, it'll be hard for them to not fall back into the habit of worshipping these guys and getting into the Canadiana of it all, but putting themselves in the line of fire is something their bosses will want avoided.

 

[Deuce22]

Well, some folks could have been holding out until all the facts are on the table...

Touche! 19 years later, it seems they are.

 

[canucksfan]

This. 99% of sexual assaults are not like what you see in Law & Order SVU.

The perpetrator is usually someone the victim knows and likes. Sometimes, a person consents to one act but not to something that happens next. Afterwards, it's easy for victims to start thinking, "well... was it my fault? Did I lead him on?" That's why it can be so traumatic and difficult for those who were assaulted to actually come forward. They go through an incredibly complex set of emotions that would be hard for anyone to navigate, let alone someone who's in their late teens or early twenties.

It's also common for the perpetrators to misread "signals". They don't go into a situation with the intention of rape or assault. And when the person they're with says, "I'm not sure about this" instead of "stop", they keep going. They assault someone without realizing they're assaulting someone.

The theme from the text messages is so incredibly common, it's crazy and scary. "I felt taken advantage of". "But I thought you were having fun." This happens more than people know. It happens every single night.

That's why it's so important for there to be a much louder and in-depth conversation about consent in schools, and kids need to start being taught these concepts when they're 12 or 13.

Honestly, while Hockey Canada acted abhorrently here, I think the Federal Government needs to take control of this. There needs to be a national curriculum around sexuality and consent taught to every single kid in this country, and one that's tailored for today's age.

Students in BC are taught it or at least should be. I taught sex ed to grade 8 students and one of the topics is consent.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

I don't even know why you are quoting the post I presented.

Option A the courts, a defined legal process

Option B, the court of public opinion, in this case HF Boards

One doesn't need to be a lawyer to know which option is "better"

Maybe instead of trying to score points you keep up with the conversation?

What’s the conversation wetcoast?

You putting your head into the ground denying anything wrong with hockey culture?

Playing devils advocate for the players?

Telling everyone who don’t agree as some internet mob?

Not giving a single shit for the victim?

This isn’t a thread about the due process of the legal system. No matter how many times you say it, it doesn’t make it so. If you can’t handle that, maybe take a hike.

 

[Blitzkrug]

Everyone likes to counter with "b-but this happens in all sports!"

While I'm sure that statement isn't a lie, I have a harder and harder time believing that when the other 3 of the big 4 have a scandal pop up like once every few months combined whereas hockey is having shit come out what feels like every other week now.

"Well blame the people." Sure, but at the same time you can acknowledge it's not just the people committing these crimes, it's the culture enabling thinking shit like this..

Disband Hockey Canada, burn it to the ground and get some leadership in there that actually has a problem with covering up sexual assault and other misdeeds. It's time to acknowledge we have a serious culture issue in the sport of hockey.

 

[Transplanted Caper]

Well, some folks could have been holding out until all the facts are on the table...

If hockey insiders are known for anything, it's their discretion and avoiding rumour and speculation.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Can't wait to hear Colaiacovo's take on this, next week on TSN 1050 here in Toronto.

Should have lots to say.

 

[swiftwin]

I don't even know why you are quoting the post I presented.

Option A the courts, a defined legal process

Option B, the court of public opinion, in this case HF Boards

One doesn't need to be a lawyer to know which option is "better"

Maybe instead of trying to score points you keep up with the conversation?

Neither option is better than the other. Both are important.

Option A has such a high threshold of proof required that option B is often necessary to enact the societal change required to stop these things from happening.

 

[Static]

Neither option is better than the other. Both are important.

Option A has such a high threshold of proof required that option B is often necessary to enact the societal change required to stop these things from happening.

25 out of every 1,000 sexual assault cases lead to jail time. There is a reason women don't come forward and it's because the justice system fails them time and time again.

The system is not set up to protect the weak, far from it, it is set up to protect those who set it up in the first place.

The Criminal Justice System: Statistics | RAINN

The majority of perpetrators of sexual assault will not go to prison.

www.rainn.org

 

[CanHeDoIt99]

A telling part about the statement is that Hockey Canada heard rumours about an incident weeks ago, hired an investigating firm, and didn't uncover what occured (perhaps that investigation is still ongoing and thus, HC hasn't received the report on what happened yet).

If however that isn't the case, and they simply couldn't uncover the information about the incident, but Rick Westhead and a conservative MP can? Maybe you aren't taking investigations seriously enough.

Perhaps we don't have enough information yet to conclude there - but it would follow what seems to be a pattern with Hockey Canada.

 

[Static]

I don't even know why you are quoting the post I presented.

Option A the courts, a defined legal process

Option B, the court of public opinion, in this case HF Boards

One doesn't need to be a lawyer to know which option is "better"

Maybe instead of trying to score points you keep up with the conversation?

Option B has a higher success rate than option A has ever had. The only reason any of this is carrying weight is because of public pressure, not the justice system. Same with the Blackhawks scandal, same with whatever the next terrible story is.

As always, you have no idea what you're talking about. You're out of your depth here.

 

[swiftwin]

25 out of every 1,000 sexual assault cases lead to jail time. There is a reason women don't come forward and it's because the justice system fails them time and time again.

The system is not set up to protect the weak, far from it, it is set up to protect those who set it up in the first place.

The Criminal Justice System: Statistics | RAINN

The majority of perpetrators of sexual assault will not go to prison.

www.rainn.org

I know, that's why I'm saying option B is important. We need to shine a light on these types of events and publicly shame those people if the law can't do it.

 

[wetcoast]

Where did I question her character?

You didn't it appears that he came to that conclusion for you.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

25 out of every 1,000 sexual assault cases lead to jail time. There is a reason women don't come forward and it's because the justice system fails them time and time again.

The system is not set up to protect the weak, far from it, it is set up to protect those who set it up in the first place.

The Criminal Justice System: Statistics | RAINN

The majority of perpetrators of sexual assault will not go to prison.

www.rainn.org

I see it as set up to make as few catastrophic mistakes as possible. The social, political and monetary penalties for false imprisonment are so great that very few are willing to risk being responsible for it if there is any kind of hole in evidence.

Not educated on this, just my gut feeling. Seems like a liability to prosecute or even pass a guilty verdict if you don't have DNA, multiple corroborations or some kind of video evidence.

 

[Static]

I see it as set up to make as few catastrophic mistakes as possible. The social, political and monetary penalties for false imprisonment are so great that very few are willing to risk being responsible for it if there is any kind of hole in evidence.

Not educated on this, just my gut feeling. Seems like a liability to prosecute or even pass a guilty verdict if you don't have DNA, multiple corroborations or some kind of video evidence.

Consider the threshold for both. What do you make of a system that places more consideration on false claims than true claims, especially when all statistical information available for the better part of 75 years shows false claims amount to the number of fingers on my hand? It certainly shows where the system's true concern lays.