Canadian Government Freezing Hockey Canada Funding- (2018 Canada World Jr Team Alleged Sexual Assault)

[Finlandia WOAT]

Just so understand the gist of it all...

Seems like she had sex with 1 guy consensually, right?
and then more guys joined in and essentially had a gangbang, and that's what's being contested, right?

Or do I have it wrong?

John Doe and Jane Doe had consensual sex, then John Doe left and brought back his buddies to allegedly gang rape her.

 

[Off Sides]

Yep, no amount of taxpayer money should ever be used as hush money to settle potential criminal lawsuits out of court.

In a perfect world, Hockey Canada would be given no further funding until they are prevented from doing so ever again.

Should have to disclose how the registration fees could be used as well.

No one paying those fees want any of that money going towards this type of disgusting stuff.

 

[MXD]

If it didn't make it to the courts, then it's done, right? The victim had the opportunity to by not accepting the settlement. Rick Westhead brought this back up. The victim did not. I'm saying if the victim felt it was resolved, that should have been respected. Sure, there are other things there that don't exactly involve the victim or the perpetrators. The conversation should be focused entirely on Hockey Canada and the CHL than about the victim, but here we are all talking about the resolved (legally) incident. I'm in no position to say what happened that night, but if there was a settlement, there was a settlement. Also, my reply was entirely about who won, and the only person who wins here is Rick Westhead and anybody else who gets paid from the clicks he generates and anybody down river from the story itself. Not to mention... a criminal case won't go to the court which is why the victim chose the civil route (possibly why, at least).

Long story short, it didn't make it to court due to how, generally speaking, complainants are treated in sexual assault cases, which is presumably why the victim didn't cooperate much with the police.

The settlement doesn't bind other parties. If the HoC wants an investigation on Hockey Canada regarding their practices, so be it. If the Crown wants to press charges now that the victim feels like she'll be somehow shielded from all the shit the survivors go through, so be it.

Rick Westhead is doing a fantastic job and is amply earning his paycheck.

 

[MXD]

Also, how about : ... Maybe if younger players know they don't have a full network of sycophants ready to make sure they don't have to face any f***ing consequence for their acts, that would go a really long way to clean up the culture. I clearly remembered bringing out this point regarding Logan Mailloux and the fact he wouldn't have faced ANY consequence if that shit had happened in Canada.

 

[PostBradMalone]

You're correct.

it sounds like things have gone off the rails in this thread about alcohol/inability to consent if her civil filing acknowledged she consented to the first encounter.

But that still doesn’t invalidate her claim(s). There is also the matter of the individuals involved plying her with increasing amounts of alcohol as the encounter progressed, ostensibly to lower her inhibitions, but also removing the possibility for her to provide informed consent- recorded or not.

Ultimately the most important piece of evidence we have came out of the text messages inexplicably leaked by defendant’s counsel, in which the victim said she felt “taken advantage of”. That’s it, that’s all we need to hear/read. From then on everything else should be considered moot.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Yep, no amount of taxpayer money should ever be used as hush money to settle potential criminal lawsuits out of court.

In a perfect world, Hockey Canada would be given no further funding until they are prevented from doing so ever again.

In the meantime it's "on with the show" I guess, eh?

WJCs right around the corner, CHL seasons boot up again in a few months too.

Hockey Canada will (read: should) feel the blowback from this, for a while.

 

[sennysensen]

Pretty worried 1 or 2 Sens could be involved. Also, the 7 players who's lawyer released a statement not denying any involvement, basically saying it was consensual. And the other players who have said nothing. Still wondering how many were with Team Canada (2-7?), and how many were CHL, probably London, not on the World Jr team.
What an awful story, shows we have a long way to go.

 

[Dan Patrick]

Yep, no amount of taxpayer money should ever be used as hush money to settle potential criminal lawsuits out of court.

In a perfect world, Hockey Canada would be given no further funding until they are prevented from doing so ever again.

What about taxpayer money being used to avoid significantly more expensive litigation/trial? What if HC used only registration money to pay to avoid expensive suits and not taxpayer money?

An allegory for this would be if HC started a fund because 2 people were breaking their legs on the ice every year and suing HC and insurance wouldnt cover it anymore, im not sure we should be upset that they had money to pay those settlements. I think we should absolutely be upset that HC wasnt taking steps to adress their leg breaking problem and question whether there should be an institutional shakeup in order to make sure the problem was properly being addressed and resolved. But im not sure the money is the real problem, that is just a biproduct and a business operating like any other big business.

Someone in HC should absolutely have been able to say "if we need a seperate fund to help settle all the sexual assault lawsuits then we should probably also be doing something to reduce the number of sexual assault lawsuits being levied against our members, maybe show them that tea video"

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

You fail to see the forest for the trees. Whether you agree with someone/something or not (hate/love) you sould learn to realize that it's all information that runs through a single point in space and time aka "I" or "you" (from my perspective.)

Stop worrying about matters of the ego. Attachment is the root of suffering. Learn to let go

I don't belive in using syncretic pop spiritualism as an excuse to deny the problems of the world and why we shouldn't do anything to fix them. A wierd zen-like Nihilism, if you will. Using a bunch of terms and tenets from different religions to dress up the scintillating notion, "hey, if you just ignore the problem, then it's like it's not even there!".

 

[Advanced stats]

You're correct.

it sounds like things have gone off the rails in this thread about alcohol/inability to consent if her civil filing acknowledged she consented to the first encounter.

So many variables for "the one guy"

-maybe she was a legitimate friend
-maybe he didn't invite any of his teammates back, but they intruded, or were invited by someone else
-maybe it wasn't even supposed to be sexual



It's important to not smear the guy harshly without knowing the facts.

 

[OG6ix]

So many variables for "the one guy"

-maybe she was a legitimate friend
-maybe he didn't invite any of his teammates back, but they intruded, or were invited by someone else
-maybe it wasn't even supposed to be sexual



It's important to not smear the guy harshly without knowing the facts.

Did he let it continue? Because if he did he's guilty.

 

[TheBeard]

Pretty worried 1 or 2 Sens could be involved. Also, the 7 players who's lawyer released a statement not denying any involvement, basically saying it was consensual. And the other players who have said nothing. Still wondering how many were with Team Canada (2-7?), and how many were CHL, probably London, not on the World Jr team.
What an awful story, shows we have a long way to go.

I thought I read they were all on the World Jr team?

 

[Korpse]

I thought I read they were all on the World Jr team?

8 CHL players including but not limited to members of the Canada U20 Men’s Junior Hockey Team.

Hockey Canada, CHL settle lawsuit over alleged sexual assault involving World Junior players - TSN.ca

A woman who alleged she was sexually assaulted by eight Canadian Hockey League players, including members of Canada’s gold medal-winning 2017-18 World Junior team, has agreed to drop a lawsuit against the players, Hockey Canada, and the CHL after reaching a settlement.

www.tsn.ca

 

[PostBradMalone]

Pretty worried 1 or 2 Sens could be involved. Also, the 7 players who's lawyer released a statement not denying any involvement, basically saying it was consensual. And the other players who have said nothing.

It only gets worse by the day for those five players who have yet to say anything at all, either individually or through their reps. A reasonable person would do anything they could to clear their name if it was as simple as issuing a categorical denial that they knew about or participated in what is alleged to have occurred, and indeed a number have done that.

Now, if they couldn’t truthfully state such a thing, that’s a different matter entirely…

What about taxpayer money being used to avoid significantly more expensive litigation/trial? What if HC used only registration money to pay to avoid expensive suits and not taxpayer money?

I am equally curious to learn what “assets” were “liquidated”. Were these donated items? Relics of history auctioned off? It’s important we know that detail I think.

It's important to not smear the guy harshly without knowing the facts.

The facts as we know them do not at all remove any liability from John Doe 1. In fact, it’s fair to say he precipitated everything that followed.

 

[Muddy Wilbury]

Pretty worried 1 or 2 Sens could be involved. Also, the 7 players who's lawyer released a statement not denying any involvement, basically saying it was consensual. And the other players who have said nothing. Still wondering how many were with Team Canada (2-7?), and how many were CHL, probably London, not on the World Jr team.
What an awful story, shows we have a long way to go.

Yeah I can think of two Sens and in my case one Flyer.

 

[Rob Brown]

Yeah I can think of two Sens and in my case one Flyer.

Difference is Hart has had an announcement made on his behalf, while the two Sens have not (to the best of my knowledge).

 

[I am toxic]

I thought I read they were all on the World Jr team?

We know for a fact that at least seven of them were on the World Jr team.

The Globe and Mail met with their lawyers last week, and reported on it.

And when we read the May 26 statement from the NHL, and the May 26 statement from Hockey Canada, all the evidence shows it was at least seven from the World Jr team. Maybe eight, possibly nine, virtually certain less than ten.

Had Hockey Canada and their lawyers made any kind of attempt at an honest investigation, this would have been clear from the beginning.

 

[TheBeard]

We know for a fact that at least seven of them were on the World Jr team.

The Globe and Mail met with their lawyers last week, and reported on it.

And when we read the May 26 statement from the NHL, and the May 26 statement from Hockey Canada, all the evidence shows it was at least seven from the World Jr team. Maybe eight, possibly nine, virtually certain less than ten.

Had Hockey Canada and their lawyers made any kind of attempt at an honest investigation, this would have been clear from the beginning.

Shows where we are as a society when these kinds of scandals still run rampant throughout all the four major sports in North America not to mention the lengths the leagues go to cover it up

 

[Advanced stats]

Did he let it continue? Because if he did he's guilty.

Was he in the room?

facts as we know

There's actually not a lot that we know definitively. That's my point.

 

[Rob Brown]

Of all the things pertaining to this thread, the idea that young men should be responsible and have integrity is "gross"?

I don't think that was his point, no.

 

[I am toxic]

Shows where we are as a society when these kinds of scandals still run rampant throughout all the four major sports in North America not to mention the lengths the leagues go to cover it up

It really doesn't.

Society has changed vastly since decades ago. Up until 1983, a husband could legally rape his wife in Canada. We've come a long way. Well, they could on January 3, 1983, but not on January 4th.

Unfortunately, hockey culture in Canada appears little different than it was in the '70's. And the amount of effort to keep it that way - on display in this thread and elsewhere - is absolutely astonishing.

Those elements in society that enable rapists and gang-rapists are greatly magnified in the hockey world here in North America. Hockey has a toxic culture problem, and it won't be addressed by those within who are so heavily invested in maintaining the status quo. And efforts to address it are greatly hampered by the denials that the problem exists in the first place. No surprise.

 

[pucksakes666]

What’s the fallout that will happen? I doubt we’ll see much other than a few people retire or resign. Players won’t get anything sadly they’ll be protected.

 

[didimentionlarseller]

It's common knowledge in Canada that consent can not be given when intoxicated. Period. The film showing her consenting is completely irrelevant.

filming an intoxicated person like that to get 'sexual consent' could actually be seen as consciousness of guilt

its kind of how ive seen this from the start a drunk woman cant consent to that situation

 

[TheBeard]

I don't think that was his point, no.

There were, what, 8 guys with her and not one of them had the maturity, integrity and common sense to assess the situation and realize how messed up it was? In this instance, if what was alleged happened then the responsibility was on the guys, every single one of them.

 

[Rob Brown]

It really doesn't.

Society has changed vastly since decades ago. Up until 1983, a husband could legally rape his wife in Canada. We've come a long way. Well, they could on January 3, 1983, but not on January 4th.

Unfortunately, hockey culture in Canada appears little different than it was in the '70's. And the amount of effort to keep it that way - on display in this thread and elsewhere - is absolutely astonishing.

Those elements in society that enable rapists and gang-rapists are greatly magnified in the hockey world here in North America. Hockey has a toxic culture problem, and it won't be addressed by those within who are so heavily invested in maintaining the status quo. And efforts to address it are greatly hampered by the denials that the problem exists in the first place. No surprise.

I don't think anyone is really denying that hockey has a problem, but more that society in general has problems. These kind of situations happen in a lot of sports, workplaces, industries etc. It's not exclusive to hockey. So while Hockey Canada and the NHL (as examples) have a lot of work to do to improve the culture and increase the level of accountability and respect, it's disingenuous to act like these problems do not occur elsewhere.