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C William Nylander (2014, 8th, TOR) VI

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obey86 said:
But your logic doesn't make sense because at this point we aren't projecting anything with Larkin as it comes to his play in the NHL. We've seem him play, we've seen him put up some points, there is zero projection to the NHL happening.


We know Frattin sucked in the NHL despite his college totals. We know Larkin is (thus far) arguably the best player on the Red Wings and is playing very well. If you can't see the difference between projecting an AHL/college player's points to the NHL and looking at what a player is currently doing in the NHL I don't know what to tell you. One is a projection, one is an actuality. If Larkin was currently still in college hockey you may have a point, but he isn't and you don't.
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Yes, that's why I said last season. Most Wings fans were bringing up Toews' freshman numbers vs Larkin's freshman numbers. It's much more reasonable to compare considering the proximity to their draft years as 17/18 year old prospects.. it would've been unreasonable last season to bring up a 22-23 year old Frattin's performance in the NCAA, as a way to be skeptical about Larkin's future.

Just as it's a bit unreasonable to compare a soon-to-be 23 year old Jurco with a 19 year old Nylander.
 
TheLeastOfTheBunch said:
You literally just posted about comparing Larkin with another freshman NCAA player, and now you're comparing Nylander with a soon-to-be 23 year old Jurco.

Why do I even bother..
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Jurco put up a ppg during his 2nd season in the AHL (same as Nylander) while being only 20 years old. He hasn't been able to crack the NHL roster consistently since then. He's looking more and more like a player that is too good for the AHL but not quite good enough for the NHL. Do I think this will happen to Nylander? Absolutely not, but it could and certain Leafs fans are acting like it's a guarantee he will put up 60+ points next year because he's very good at the AHL level.

Obviously it looks like Nylander is a much better prospect than Jurco but we have no idea at this point how he will perform in the NHL.
 
TheLeastOfTheBunch said:
Edited that post, have a read. Maybe you can explain why you are okay with comparing an older Jurco with Nylander, but have a problem with comparing an older NCAA player (like Frattin) to Larkin

:rolleyes:
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I dont think its a completely fair comparison but its also not completely crazy either. The difference being is that one has an NHL sample size to use at this point and is already a legit first liner in the league. NCAA, SEL, AHL numbers can be argued all the time about whats more impressive but the end goal is the NHL here.

I think the comparison to Jurco earlier is just a way of saying not all guys can transfer their game to the NHL level, regardless of what league they come out of before. Larkin has already basically scored as much as Frattins highest scoring NHL season. Nylander can have NHL equivalences and other metrics used for him but literally no one can say for sure how he will translate to the next level, because guys like Jurco have looked better in that league and worse than they shoulda in the NHL.

The clear difference in these comparisons is that Larkin is developing a track record and showing it at the highest level. Hes already a first liner in the best league in the world, arguably the best player on a playoff calibre hockey team, and is scoring at a very consistent clip. Its not like we're talking about a guy playing on the third line and doing alright or a Frattin who did nothing at the NHL level.

Nylander will get his chance to develop that track record obviously in the coming seasons but I think its clear that Larkins game translates well to the NHL at this point. That still isnt 100% certain for Nylander as has been evidenced by lots of other guys not translating their games like a Jurco
 
WTFMAN99 said:
3 pts in 5GP is respectable. Playing out of position on smaller ice as an 18 year old? Not the worst performance ever, and to his credit like you said he's really come out strong this year for the Marlies. Here is hoping we have a #1 or #2 centre for the Leafs.
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Right on, but Larkin managed 3 goals and 2 assists in 6 playoff games for GR last season also, so you can understand why somebody flat out saying Nylander is a better player than Larkin is sort of silly at this point while Larkin out performed him in the ahl playoffs and is putting up top line numbers in the NHL this season while Nylander is still in the AHL.

Both fanbases should be excited to see these two battle for years to come though.
 
William Nylander currently holds a 3 point lead in the AHL scoring race.

17gp - 10g- 13a- 23pts
 
There was never a question of whether William being able to score in the AHL. Afterall he had 32 points last season in 37 games. Add 3 more in 5 playoff games.

I would like to see more analysis on the intangible parts of his game. Specically Defensively as a Center and how he's handling the physical play in the AHL.

This is the only question left answered as Dubas alluded to. When he is polished enough to master being in the NHL perhaps this year?

Citing points for him is really not telling any of us what we already know.
 
Kid's a complete stud. Going to be a star in the NHL. He would probably be the Leafs' best forward if he were on the team right now, but they're keeping him away for the year (for good reason) while he develops his defensive side in the AHL (which is coming along very very nicely).

Leafs' future #1C, along with Marner (and perhaps Stamkos?). Laine would look terrific on his wing, just sayin Hunter...
 
It's embarrassing that Wings fans are arguing about Larkin in a Nylander thread. It's not about Larkin here. Some of us Wings fans just need to learn how to be more respectful and leave it be.

That said, Nylander is doing awesome in the AHL. It's very impressive. And I can say for a fact that if it was Larkin in the AHL putting up those kind of numbers, DRWs fans across the world would be ecstatic!
 
There is a TSN video of Willie talking about potentially making the big club this season and Clune And Sparks speaking pretty highly of him. Can someone post it in this thread? I'm living in the Caribbean now and can't watch any TSN videos because I'm out of viewing range lol
 
mazzman17 said:
There is a TSN video of Willie talking about potentially making the big club this season and Clune And Sparks speaking pretty highly of him. Can someone post it in this thread? I'm living in the Caribbean now and can't watch any TSN videos because I'm out of viewing range lol
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Clune took him to the gym to teach him how to box. Gotta love the kids determination even though I don't think I want him scrapping a whole bunch but if he has to at least he'll have some idea how to.
 
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leaflover said:
Clune took him to the gym to teach him how to box. Gotta love the kids determination even though I don't think I want him scrapping a whole bunch but if he has to at least he'll have some idea how to.
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great vet move by Clune doing this - even if fightings dying outs, nothing worse than being clueless and completely hopeless if he were to drop the gloves.
 
leaflover said:
Clune took him to the gym to teach him how to box. Gotta love the kids determination even though I don't think I want him scrapping a whole bunch but if he has to at least he'll have some idea how to.
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If Clune is just teaching him boxing strategies Meh, but if he's training as a boxer would; that's a great fitness regime to incorporate. I hope it's the latter.
 
saltming said:
If Clune is just teaching him boxing strategies Meh, but if he's training as a boxer would; that's a great fitness regime to incorporate. I hope it's the latter.
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Beginners don't learn boxing strategies, they learn how to throw punches with proper technique, which results in less unnecessary energy expenditure and more importantly reduces the risk of injury.
 
Rodimus Prime said:
Beginners don't learn boxing strategies, they learn how to throw punches with proper technique, which results in less unnecessary energy expenditure and more importantly reduces the risk of injury.
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Which to me is still about technique. I would rather he's in there with the rope, the medicine ball and all the conditioning stuff!
 
saltming said:
If Clune is just teaching him boxing strategies Meh, but if he's training as a boxer would; that's a great fitness regime to incorporate. I hope it's the latter.
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I'm sure it was more Clune teaching him the basics/defensive aspects.
Nylander sure comes across as a player that accepts evaluations and works hard to improve those shortcomings. Those guys are a joy to coach/mentor and tend to develop quickly. He won't be in the "A" long.
 
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