C Frederik Gauthier (2013, 21st, TOR)

[Ho Borvat]

It wouldn't matter either way whether Gauthier was producing or not. If he's got 90 points by now you'll hear "yeah well it's just junior stats which don't matter" or if he's not it's "I told you this guy was a bust, 4'th liner at best". This is HF in a nutshell.

He would probably be regarded about the same as Henrik Samuelsson (Phx prospect) if he was a big point producer?

I just see Brendan Gaunce 2.0 in Gauthier, and I think both guys are going to fall somewhere between a Nate Thomson and a Kyle Chipchura at the end of the day.

 

[Whileee]

It wouldn't matter either way whether Gauthier was producing or not. If he's got 90 points by now you'll hear "yeah well it's just junior stats which don't matter" or if he's not it's "I told you this guy was a bust, 4'th liner at best". This is HF in a nutshell.

Not me. If Gauthier was producing a lot of offense, I would think he has a lot more potential, because scoring rate in junior is actually a pretty good predictor of future NHL success. It usually indicates that the player skates well enough and has good puck skills, which are needed in the NHL. Players that have very poor scoring rates in junior (especially in the years after their draft) don't often become effective NHLers.

 

[TheGroceryStick]

I am counting the days down until this kid is dominating the NHL - Can't wait.

Everyone jelly.

 

[Ho Borvat]

I am counting the days down until this kid is dominating the NHL - Can't wait.

Everyone jelly.

We have different definitions of dominating

 

[TheGroceryStick]

We have different definitions of dominating

-Shutdown top players
-Put up good numbers
-Kill crucial penalties
-Take key draws
-Selke nominee
-Patrice Bergeron clone + size

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

-Shutdown top players
-Put up good numbers
-Kill crucial penalties
-Take key draws
-Selke nominee
-Patrice Bergeron clone + size

To quote Jeremy Clarkson: "Ambitious, but rubbish."

 

[TheGroceryStick]

To quote Jeremy Clarkson: "Ambitious, but rubbish."

Similar stats in their draft year. both PPG junior.
Don't write anyone off until you give them a chance to prove themselves as a pro.

I don't actually think that he will reach those "milestones" ; but I am not selling him out either.







----

Prove us wrong kid. Or in other words - prove Canucks fans wrong kid.

 

[Ho Borvat]

Similar stats in their draft year. both PPG junior.
Don't write anyone off until you give them a chance to prove themselves as a pro.

Prove us wrong kid. Or in other words - prove Canucks fans wrong kid.[/QUOTE]

1) Bergeron made the jump straight from Junior to the NHL. Not a good comparable.

2) If that portion was directed at me, I am a Leafs fan (or would you like me to return my Rielly jersey I bought last month..)

 

[Ho Borvat]

-Shutdown top players
-Put up good numbers
-Kill crucial penalties
-Take key draws
-Selke nominee
-Patrice Bergeron clone + size

1) Shutdown top players --> Hes done this just fine so far.
2) Put up good numbers --> His production was low... and has not improved.
3) Kill crucial penalties --> Sure
4) Take key draws --> Sure
5) Selke nominee --> This is for 2-way players. Gauthier isn't a 2-way player... he's a defensive specialist. There is a difference.
6) wait... I am still explaining why Gauthier won't be better than Bergeron, and be a Selke winner?

So what you end up with is a 1-dimensional penalty kill/faceoff specialist who likely doesn't have the offensive skill to turn play in the other direction.

 

[613Leafer]

At this point, we're hoping Gauthier can become a ~Gaustad type of player. No reason to expect him to become a Selke calibre two-way top 6 centre. Given his age, his offensive development at this point is pretty bad.

 

[TheGroceryStick]

Similar stats in their draft year. both PPG junior.
Don't write anyone off until you give them a chance to prove themselves as a pro.

Prove us wrong kid. Or in other words - prove Canucks fans wrong kid.[/QUOTE]

1) Bergeron made the jump straight from Junior to the NHL. Not a good comparable.

2) If that portion was directed at me, I am a Leafs fan (or would you like me to return my Rielly jersey I bought last month..)

Please do.

1) Shutdown top players --> Hes done this just fine so far.
2) Put up good numbers --> His production was low... and has not improved.
3) Kill crucial penalties --> Sure
4) Take key draws --> Sure
5) Selke nominee --> This is for 2-way players. Gauthier isn't a 2-way player... he's a defensive specialist. There is a difference.
6) wait... I am still explaining why Gauthier won't be better than Bergeron, and be a Selke winner?

So what you end up with is a 1-dimensional penalty kill/faceoff specialist who likely doesn't have the offensive skill to turn play in the other direction.

You didn't have to run down my list. I perfectly explained that I was over exaggerating. The key is - people can't write a guy off from his Jr. numbers - Bergeron was no world beater, who's to say his numbers would have leveled if he stayed. Pro can do wonders for certain types of players.

 

[So Truculent]

Gauthier at times seems like he can barely handle a puck, I dunno how you can think he will be anywhere near Bergeron lol and the fact Bergeron is a better skater as well

 

[Ho Borvat]

Please do.

You didn't have to run down my list. I perfectly explained that I was over exaggerating. The key is - people can't write a guy off from his Jr. numbers - Bergeron was no world beater, who's to say his numbers would have leveled if he stayed. Pro can do wonders for certain types of players.

Strange that I should have to return my Leafs Jersey considering I seem to have a better grasp of our prospects

He could put it together and prove me wrong. But his stock has fallen pretty substantially since his draft year.

 

[TheGroceryStick]

Strange that I should have to return my Leafs Jersey considering I seem to have a better grasp of our prospects

He could put it together and prove me wrong. But his stock has fallen pretty substantially since his draft year.

You didask me the question - has nothing to do with your knowledge.

Oh for sure. I am still laughing that people think I was legit comparing him to Bergeron!

I saw a Canucks fan (sorry Leafs fan) talking about the guy, seemed all to similar to other Leaf prospect threads. Thought I would switch gears and give our players a bit of recognition for once.

Here's hoping Pro hockey can turn the player into a regular. It isn't the first time that a Junior player found his legs once he committed himself full time to hockey.

 

[Whileee]

-Shutdown top players
-Put up good numbers
-Kill crucial penalties
-Take key draws
-Selke nominee
-Patrice Bergeron clone + size

A bigger version of Bergeron isn't exactly how I'd describe Gauthier at this point.

I don't know how often this needs to be repeated, but a very good defensive center in the NHL has to be very quick in his reactions and needs to be very smart and quick with the puck. Otherwise, he's just a checker who gets hemmed in his own zone because he's a poor puck possession player.

The notion of a big checking lug dominating defensively in the NHL is way out of date.

He could have a role as a penalty killer, because you don't really need much in the way of puck skills in that role. But he'll be buried on the 4th line if he's not able to move the puck in his own zone.

 

[bursilym]

This guy sucks. Why can't we draft good prospects consistently

 

[WilliamNylander]

In hindsight and at the draft this was not the best pick given who was available.

Projecting him as a Bergeron type is like almost impossible - it would take a miracle where he woke up with hands, a better hockey IQ, and skating ability.

As of now it looks like he will be a good 3C/great 4C for the Leafs. Hope they do give him time to develop his skills and improve before throwing him in the NHL.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

At this point, we're hoping Gauthier can become a ~Gaustad type of player. No reason to expect him to become a Selke calibre two-way top 6 centre. Given his age, his offensive development at this point is pretty bad.

This is the big issue for me. Gauthier's totals in his draft year aren't an issue. Some players, especially big guys, take a bit of time to put their raw tools together. It's the fact he hasn't improved at all offensively since his draft year, and production-wise, has actually regressed a bit.

Most players with potential to produce at the next level usually see an improvement in their offensive game after their draft year. Offensively, Gauthier's still got the same issues he showed at age 17.

 

[Whileee]

In hindsight and at the draft this was not the best pick given who was available.

Projecting him as a Bergeron type is like almost impossible - it would take a miracle where he woke up with hands, a better hockey IQ, and skating ability.

As of now it looks like he will be a good 3C/great 4C for the Leafs. Hope they do give him time to develop his skills and improve before throwing him in the NHL.

At this point, I think a good 3C / great 4C is his ceiling, but maybe his development trajectory will change.

 

[TheGroceryStick]

I think it is about a 88% chance he turns into a Bergeron.





and 99% chance that people don't read beyond my first post.

 

[Whileee]

I think it is about a 88% chance he turns into a Bergeron.


and 99% chance that people don't read beyond my first post.

I think that there is a 51.6% chance that he becomes a regular, big, solid draw man, who can kill penalties.

 

[Face Of Bear]

I think there is a ~50% chance he'll crack the Marlies next year. Wont be surprised if he ends up toiling around the ECHL for most of the season.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

I think it is about a 88% chance he turns into a Bergeron.





and 99% chance that people don't read beyond my first post.

I'd say most likely a Dave Steckel-lite.
Just doesn't have the skating to be a Bergeron.
Mind you, very few players do.

 

[The Podium]

http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/2...-gauthier-named-qmjhls-best-defensive-forward

 

[Bill Waters*]

-Shutdown top players
-Put up good numbers
-Kill crucial penalties
-Take key draws
-Selke nominee
-Patrice Bergeron clone + size

Don't forget: -skates like a tractor