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C Auston Matthews (2016, 1st, TOR) VII

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McMatthews said:
I frankly don't put a whole lot of stock in a couple inches.

Crosby is thick as hell. He's a pretty big boy, despite being just around 6'0.
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You called him a "big centre", he really isn't, he's 5'11". He was what, 5'10"/175 lbs on draft day, and around 5'11"/190 lbs when he won his first cup? Not tiny, but below average size for an NHLer, certainly not big. He has a super strong lower body, and is crazy tenacious/strong on the puck, but plenty of smaller guys have super strong legs (Martin St. Louis jumps to mind), that doesn't make them big.

With that being said, size is great to have, and is certainly an advantage for Matthews. But it's not necessary for success, some of the top centres of the last decade have been on the small side (Crosby, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Giroux, etc.).
 
I wanted to share something for posterity since the question of exactly how much of a consensus had Matthews as #1 comes up occasionally.

Based on 15 sources that list 40 scouts/services polled we have exactly 85% who consider Matthews the BPA in 2016.

Here are the sources and counts:

April 27th, Bob McKenzie "8 of 10 scouts prefer Matthews"

Jume 16th, "NHL.com recently asked 13 NHL scouts for their choice if given the option; Matthews earned an 11-2 edge"

June 18th, Sportsnet interviewed 3 scouts from different teams (2 from lottery teams, 1 from a non-lottery team that knew they would never be in the lottery in 2016) and all 3 picked Matthews

ISS final ranking has Matthews #1

Button's final ranking has Matthews #1

Redline Report's final ranking has Matthews #1 (source is 3rd party site that confirms the ranking since Redline is behind a paywall)

Hockey Prospects' final ranking has Matthews #1

Pronman's final ranking has Matthews #2 (behind paywall)

Future Considerations' final ranking has Matthews #1

McKeen's final ranking has Matthews #2

Hockey Writers' final ranking has Matthews #1

Hockey News' final ranking has Matthews #1

NHL CSS' final ranking has Matthews #1

SI has Matthews #1 overall for "Top Forwards" (can't find a complete draft ranking, but they're obviously not putting d-men in front of Matthews)

The Draft Analyst's final ranking has Matthews #1

**There are a bunch of smaller sites that list mock drafts with Matthews #1 but I can't find where/how they come up with their rankings so I don't think it's fair to include them.
 
TDK88 said:
I wanted to share something for posterity since the question of exactly how much of a consensus had Matthews as #1 comes up occasionally.

Based on 15 sources that list 40 scouts/services polled we have exactly 85% who consider Matthews the BPA in 2016.

Here are the sources and counts:

April 27th, Bob McKenzie "8 of 10 scouts prefer Matthews"

Jume 16th, "NHL.com recently asked 13 NHL scouts for their choice if given the option; Matthews earned an 11-2 edge"

June 18th, Sportsnet interviewed 3 scouts from different teams (2 from lottery teams, 1 from a non-lottery team that knew they would never be in the lottery in 2016) and all 3 picked Matthews

ISS final ranking has Matthews #1

Button's final ranking has Matthews #1

Redline Report's final ranking has Matthews #1 (source is 3rd party site that confirms the ranking since Redline is behind a paywall)

Hockey Prospects' final ranking has Matthews #1

Pronman's final ranking has Matthews #2 (behind paywall)

Future Considerations' final ranking has Matthews #1

McKeen's final ranking has Matthews #2

Hockey Writers' final ranking has Matthews #1

Hockey News' final ranking has Matthews #1

NHL CSS' final ranking has Matthews #1

SI has Matthews #1 overall for "Top Forwards" (can't find a complete draft ranking, but they're obviously not putting d-men in front of Matthews)

The Draft Analyst's final ranking has Matthews #1

**There are a bunch of smaller sites that list mock drafts with Matthews #1 but I can't find where/how they come up with their rankings so I don't think it's fair to include them.
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When Laine had that big playoff run and started putting up all those highlight goals to "close the gap" on Matthews, I saw a few complete game isolation videos on both players and it became pretty clear that Matthews was the pick. Laine scores unreal goals, but takes a ton of ill-advised shots and gets behind the play alot. Matthews just looks good all over the ice and is always pursuing the puck. I like the Laine pick for Winnipeg because they have lots of pieces to put around him, Schiefele looks like a budding #1 centre, but Matthews looks like the piece to build around.
 
Randy Randerson said:
When Laine had that big playoff run and started putting up all those highlight goals to "close the gap" on Matthews, I saw a few complete game isolation videos on both players and it became pretty clear that Matthews was the pick. Laine scores unreal goals, but takes a ton of ill-advised shots and gets behind the play alot. Matthews just looks good all over the ice and is always pursuing the puck. I like the Laine pick for Winnipeg because they have lots of pieces to put around him, Schiefele looks like a budding #1 centre, but Matthews looks like the piece to build around.
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Yea, I scrubbed my original post of any Laine mentions b/c I don't want to turn this into another debate, but I agree. I think the BPA assessment from the majority comes from the overall play of Matthews. He might not have the best shot in this draft, but he has such a combination of elite skills in other categories that when you factor in him being a big-bodied center, the BPA moniker becomes somewhat of a no-brainer.
 
TDK88 said:
Yea, I scrubbed my original post of any Laine mentions b/c I don't want to turn this into another debate, but I agree. I think the BPA assessment from the majority comes from the overall play of Matthews. He might not have the best shot in this draft, but he has such a combination of elite skills in other categories that when you factor in him being a big-bodied center, the BPA moniker becomes somewhat of a no-brainer.
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Ya no need for anyone to take Laine criticisms personally, his highlight packages are going to be unreal and has a chance to be a very good NHL'er, I just think Matthews is going to be the better overall player - "The kind of guy that you win with" as a bunch of draft reviewers wrote about him. But fair enough, any time someone says something that isn't positive about Laine it devolves into a mud slinging match
 
Randy Randerson said:
Ya no need for anyone to take Laine criticisms personally, his highlight packages are going to be unreal and has a chance to be a very good NHL'er, I just think Matthews is going to be the better overall player - "The kind of guy that you win with" as a bunch of draft reviewers wrote about him. But fair enough, any time someone says something that isn't positive about Laine it devolves into a mud slinging match
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Matthews is and most certain will remain a better overall player, from those two. I'll be happy as long Laine isnt liability in his own end.

Your comment about criticisms about Laine is sadly true, but also Matthews fans arent angels concerning that thing :P But most fans from both camps are behaving good, just couple fanatics in both sides.
 
TDK88 said:
Yea, I scrubbed my original post of any Laine mentions b/c I don't want to turn this into another debate, but I agree. I think the BPA assessment from the majority comes from the overall play of Matthews. He might not have the best shot in this draft, but he has such a combination of elite skills in other categories that when you factor in him being a big-bodied center, the BPA moniker becomes somewhat of a no-brainer.
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FWIW Craig Button feels that Matthews does have the best shot from this draft. I'm not saying that he does or doesn't, but I do think his shot is going to transfer to the NHL a bit easier as he needs less time and space to get it off.
 
Sundinisagod said:
FWIW Craig Button feels that Matthews does have the best shot from this draft. I'm not saying that he does or doesn't, but I do think his shot is going to transfer to the NHL a bit easier as he needs less time and space to get it off.
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I think what makes Matthews so dangerous is he can shoot it in so many different ways at a high level. He might not have the best wrist shot, back hand, slap shot but he's got a high quality variety of shots and dekes he can pull off in different situations.

He's very unpredictable when it comes to offense.
 
Liminality said:
I think what makes Matthews so dangerous is he can shoot it in so many different ways at a high level. He might not have the best wrist shot, back hand, slap shot but he's got a high quality variety of shots and dekes he can pull off in different situations.

He's very unpredictable when it comes to offense.
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His wrister reminds me of Joe Sakic's. IMHO you could label him as a hybrid of Sundin and Sakic and you wouldn't be too far off.
 
Sundinisagod said:
His wrister reminds me of Joe Sakic's. IMHO you could label him as a hybrid of Sundin and Sakic and you wouldn't be too far off.
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I find it hard to compare any current player to Sundin, the backhand is a dying art and Sundin was very reliant on his, whereas I don't see Matthews using that too often. The way Matthews sees and processes the game reminds me of Tavares, but he has better physical tools (better skating and size).

As for the best shot stuff, he may not have the best in the draft. It is hard to argue with Laine's one-time, even if their wrist shots are comparable, the only advantage I'd say Matthews has is getting his shot off in close and in traffic. I'm not sure if it is the size of his stick or just his overall size, but Laine seems to have trouble readjusting off dekes in close to getting off a high-quality shot. Eichel seemed to have similar problems, and many attributed it to the length of his stick. Even if Matthews shot isn't the best, he seems to be in second. Puljujarvi, Bellows, and Nylander are probably his closest competition.
 
Liminality said:
I think what makes Matthews so dangerous is he can shoot it in so many different ways at a high level. He might not have the best wrist shot, back hand, slap shot but he's got a high quality variety of shots and dekes he can pull off in different situations.

He's very unpredictable when it comes to offense.
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I keep reading "he may not have the best wrist shot". Is this just a general statement, like there are other players in the nhl with better shots? Because that would be accurate but that could be said about any prospect coming into the league. Among his peers he absolutely does have one of the best releases.
 
93LEAFS said:
I find it hard to compare any current player to Sundin, the backhand is a dying art and Sundin was very reliant on his, whereas I don't see Matthews using that too often. The way Matthews sees and processes the game reminds me of Tavares, but he has better physical tools (better skating and size).

As for the best shot stuff, he may not have the best in the draft. It is hard to argue with Laine's one-time, even if their wrist shots are comparable, the only advantage I'd say Matthews has is getting his shot off in close and in traffic. I'm not sure if it is the size of his stick or just his overall size, but Laine seems to have trouble readjusting off dekes in close to getting off a high-quality shot. Eichel seemed to have similar problems, and many attributed it to the length of his stick. Even if Matthews shot isn't the best, he seems to be in second. Puljujarvi, Bellows, and Nylander are probably his closest competition.
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That's not where I see similarities either. They both play a heavy game, use their big bodies in a similar way to shield the puck, especially along the boards and driving to the net...that's where I see some Sundin in his game.
 
Sundinisagod said:
That's not where I see similarities either. They both play a heavy game, use their big bodies in a similar way to shield the puck, especially along the boards and driving to the net...that's where I see some Sundin in his game.
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Huge difference in curves that are allowed now these days...hard to back hand with the curves these guys have.
 
WTFMAN99 said:
Huge difference in curves that are allowed now these days...hard to back hand with the curves these guys have.
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Yeah seriously.
From what I remember, didn't Sundin have only a slight curve to his stick and kept it pretty straight?

What curve does Matthews use?
 
Sundinisagod said:
That's not where I see similarities either. They both play a heavy game, use their big bodies in a similar way to shield the puck, especially along the boards and driving to the net...that's where I see some Sundin in his game.
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True, I just remember the backhand being used so much by Sundin, I find it hard to draw that comparable. Sundin was also the size of a yeti, he makes Matthews look small in comparison.

Liminality said:
Yeah seriously.
From what I remember, didn't Sundin have only a slight curve to his stick and kept it pretty straight?

What curve does Matthews use?
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No idea on Matthews, but I do remember Sundin using a very straight blade, which allowed him to have much more accuracy, while also making the shot hard to read off the blade.
 
will13 said:
I keep reading "he may not have the best wrist shot". Is this just a general statement, like there are other players in the nhl with better shots? Because that would be accurate but that could be said about any prospect coming into the league. Among his peers he absolutely does have one of the best releases.
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His wrist shot is utterly lethal. Not only that, but he has a terrific nose for the net, and with a big body he will be able to score lots of greasy goals.

I know Laine is touted as the best goal-scorer of the draft (and rightfully so) but Matthews will most certainly be challenging him.
 
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