Confirmed with Link: [BUF/VGK] Jack Eichel & 3rd-2023(BUF) FOR Peyton Krebs, Alex Tuch, 1st-2022(VGK) & 2nd-2023(VGK)

[Jim Bob]

I think the Boychuk deal held this one up a few days. They had to settle there.

The Sabres were above the floor without it. If there was a cap timing reason, it could have been when Vegas could move Stone to LTIR.

 

[Jim Bob]

Friends, busy at work to scroll entire thread. When is Tuch expected to return?

Jan/Feb timeframe I believe.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Friends, busy at work to scroll entire thread. When is Tuch expected to return?

Seems like it could be anywhere from 1-3 months (December-February)

 

[Sabresbyswords104]

Will it not be painful seeing Eichel maybe hit 100 points for Vegas ? This trade Will look bad……. So Tired that all players Sabres draft looks bad. Dahlin sucks, cozens seem bad Krebs 0 points . Mitts bust…

 

[brian_griffin]

Yeah I couldn't believe he actually suggested that the Sabres should've "done what smart teams do" and retain $5 million on Eichel for the next 5 years, gtfo with that b.s.

Agreed. The value of $5M each year for 5 years to Vegas would be astronomical to Vegas and I don't know the Knights either have, or would be willing to give up, the assets to buy that retention. Additionally, it doesn't necessarily make sense from the Buffalo standpoint to (e.g., essentially) sink an incremental $5M into any assets coming back. It's a high price to pay for lottery tickets in picks and prospects.

I mean, I don't think anyone is saying he should retain 5M a year.

Going by the "value" of cap space (6M for Marleau = 1st round pick), if we could have retained 1.2M a year in cap space for 5 years and gotten a 1st round equivalent back (prospect, player, or just a pick), it is silly not to do it. Was that offered? Who knows. It's counter productive to say its a non starter without exploring the value for it. It kind of flies in the face of "it wasn't personal", it seems the ownership didn't want to keep paying Jack on principal. Just seems like more pettiness, just like taking away the captain's C was.

The retention part of your post was addressed in my reply above. Even if the retained salary was less, and the corresponding assets from VGK less, it is still paying a premium for more lottery tickets. While it may still be an acceptable strategy, given all the alternatives, I think a better strategy is to spend money on better-known outcomes. i.e., I'd rather spend an incremental $1.2M (or incremental $5M, etc.) on an incrementally richer contract for a known quantity.

Re: the bolded, taking away the captaincy wasn't pettiness, it was overdue. Eichel was/is a poor leader. Never showed he deserved it before or during his captaincy. Shouldn't have been named captain in the first place.

In what universe should the Sabres retain any salary at all for a player that wants nothing to do with the team for 5 years. That's lunacy.

In the relationship world, it would be like giving your ex higher alimony in order to keep the dishes.

The no retention thing makes sense as long as they decide to spend in the future

Or use the cap space to secure other future assets, or to move Skinner, etc. They don't necessarily need to, e.g., spend to the cap to make not retaining on Jack the right thing to do.

Lordy.

Saying that the team should view cap space as an asset and have been willing to retain an an appropriate asset level price (if you don't want to use the marleau example, there's the Ladd example, which is 2x 2nds and a 3rd for 11M in cap space but only 4M in cash), either way, there's a market level to asses on cap retention. The fact that it was a 'non starter' when it could have brought more suitors to the table, screams that the ownership simply didn't want to pay Jack to play for another team. It's a simple calculation of value. I think you can set a cap to it, but if a team is offering you tangible value for a small amount of cap space over 5 years, it should be considered.

While I agree with you in concept, we must therefore conclude either 1 or more of 3 things:
1. VGK and BUF had irreconcilable valuations.
2. VGK didn't ask / push BUF after hearing BUF was unwilling to retain.
3. Adams was adamantly unwilling.

Dea and Peters both have hinted at Eichel's off-ice temperament being less than team-friendly.

I used to sort of follow the Knights - my son does and he's not pleased with the deal - so we'll have to see how that translates.

Well, he'll always be your son, regardless of how that pans out...

You speculate an awful lot.

I hear there's a cream for that.

And there it is. Eichel asked for a trade before all the messy surgery stuff. Sabres obviously decided his next team can make the surgery decision.

Or, he's shifting the blame for his poor leadership as captain back to the Sabres franchise.

 

[valet]

After that interview he should be booed at Pajama Boy level everytime he steps onto the ice at KBC for the remainder of his career. The thing that hurts the most is that every single thing people said about his character and how he was a spoiled petulant brat that I defended him against ended up 100% true.

i feel similarly. i was definitely willingly blind to his immaturity for long while, up until this summer really. the way he handled the injury just rubbed me the wrong way, then when i started to think more about it, how he behaved publicly the last few seasons in interviews, he just seems like a selfish and stuck up kid. no hate, that’s just who he is. hard to have success with that attitude though

 

[Chainshot]

I love western NY. Takes me 12 minutes to get to work. I have a beautiful home that would cost a lot more elsewhere. There's also an airport that has planes that take me anywhere I want to go. It's pretty cool.

Remember Rivet's story about telling his realtor to find a home that was the same price as the one his family sold in the Bay Area? And then he and his wife are walking around these palatial estates and he's freaking out because he's expecting the price tag to be off the scale. Then the realtor asked him for square footage and he got something bigger than his old place for a quarter of the cost.

 

[Paxon]

I’m sure the fans are great like they are in just about every NHL city, market means a lot more than that. Pick 5 NHL cities you wouldnt live in in exchange for living in Buffalo? Edmonton, Winnipeg, Calgary (maybe), hmmm

It is a pointless exercise talking about where people would or wouldn't want to live. Everyone's different. Plenty of people wouldn't want to work and/or live in a massive metropolis like NYC. Plenty of people wouldn't want to live in the corporate desert hellscape that is Vegas. Plenty of people hate winter weather, plenty hate not having four seasons.

Overall, is Buffalo one of the most attractive markets in the NHL? Obviously not. The real issue, though, is the organization has been a shit show for a decade.

 

[Buffaloed]

Eichel never seemed to accept that he was a large part of the failures in Buffalo. He got 22+ min of playing time every game, every critical situation. And his team failed miserably. It's not all on him... he's clearly awesome, but I can't say that he elevated the players around him (outside of Skinner, who definitely owes Jack a cut).

Crosby makes every player on his team better. Jack was just the best player on his team.

Crosby went to a team team with veteran leadership. Eichel was dropped in the sea and told to learn how to swim.

 

[valet]

He and his team probably wanted to get ahead of the *Eichel asked to be moved* story before that came out so he finally said it. Not surprising if you read into the *players who want to be here* mantra.

not surprising at all. i still find it twisted that he made it all about the injury and tried to blame the team. it’s messed up. he made an 8 year commitment then played victim in the end

 

[joshjull]

 

[EmeraldCitySabre]

I’m sure the fans are great like they are in just about every NHL city, market means a lot more than that. Pick 5 NHL cities you wouldnt live in in exchange for living in Buffalo? Edmonton, Winnipeg, Calgary (maybe), hmmm

I was born, raised (everyone else in my family is from Buffalo), and lived most of my life in Las Vegas, it's really not that great there, at least it wasn't when I was there. If you're young and have no kids and are a party animal or a gambleholic, love 115 degree weather, hate rain, enjoy dust, if you're a big drought fan, or if you do have kids and crappy overcrowded schools are your thing, or horrible hospitals and health care, you'll absolutely love it there.

I moved to Buffalo for a few years when I was a teenager and couldn't wait to get back to Las Vegas, until I did go, then I immediately regretted it and begged my Dad to pay for me to come back to Buffalo. Having lived in both cities, I'd pick WNY over Southern NV all day everyday, but I'm older and have kids that actually want to do something with their lives.

 

[MacOfNiagara]

We blinked again. Suckers

We know little actual offers and details but my reading of the tea leaves is Vegas wouldn't put Krebs on the table during the summer. I think they blinked.

 

[iCanada]

One thing I'd like to know... where did Weekes get that Calgary rumour? Seems like that was what pushed Vegas to finalize the deal.

Idk that that Calgary rumor was that great.

Could have been Tkachuk + Monahan + Zadorov + 1st, in which case I think the Vegas deal is better.

For what is worth, I think you guys won the Vegas deal anyway.

 

[cybresabre]

Good job Terry, f*** them

Absolutely, f*** the rags... but even if I agree with Terry, this is still not what we want to see.

 

[Chainshot]

Crosby went to a team team with veteran leadership. Eichel was dropped in the sea and told to learn how to swim.

Maybe his card table bros weren't the best examples either.

 

[Buffaloed]

The first treatment Vegas should do with Jack is put a shock collar on him and give him a jolt every time he says the word "obviously".

 

[old kummelweck]

Jan/Feb timeframe I believe.

Friends, busy at work to scroll entire thread. When is Tuch expected to return?

Seems like it could be anywhere from 1-3 months (December-February)

Adam's said 'a couple' of months. I think 2-3 range.

 

[5 Minute Major]

Probably has been brought up but on my way to dinner with my wife, the Vegas GM was on NHL radio on SiriusXM and said his first conversation with Adams concerning Eichel took place in late August, early September.

 

[valet]

Probably has been brought up but on my way to dinner with my wife, the Vegas GM was on NHL radio on SiriusXM and said his first conversation with Adams concerning Eichel tookk place in late August, early September.

not surprising, that’s around when the rumors started circulating

 

[Chainshot]

Probably has been brought up but on my way to dinner with my wife, the Vegas GM was on NHL radio on SiriusXM and said his first conversation with Adams concerning Eichel tookk place in late August, early September.

Which puts the kibosch on people complaining that this was available over the summer. Similarly, that Krebs wasn't included in the deal until last week dampens that hand-wringing.

 

[brian_griffin]

I'm sure the NHL is going to bleed this news cycle story dry...wouldnt you?

(and)

Gary, the puppetmaster, has to be thrilled. This pushed the Blackhawks/Aldrich story way down the news cycle.

Beats forced sex & coverups by the powerful. BUF & VGK just got upgraded on Bettman's Christmas shopping list to gold tier gift status (along with MLSE, Jacobs, Dolan, etc.)

After that interview he should be booed at Pajama Boy level everytime he steps onto the ice at KBC for the remainder of his career. The thing that hurts the most is that every single thing people said about his character and how he was a spoiled petulant brat that I defended him against ended up 100% true.

Face it Mike, you're a zoologist, not a psychologist.

Will it not be painful seeing Eichel maybe hit 100 points for Vegas ? This trade Will look bad……. So Tired that all players Sabres draft looks bad. Dahlin sucks, cozens seem bad Krebs 0 points . Mitts bust…

Actually, while checking Krebs draft class, it turns out Cozens is in the same ~0.33 PPG tier as Jack Hughes, KKaappoo Kkaakkoo, and many others. Hoglander, Dach, and Zegras are the only ones in the better ~0.5ppg tier. Obviously a simple stat, and doesn't speak to role, play, advanced metrics, but for 50 NHL games (which he wouldn't have gotten if it weren't for COVID), I think it's too early to classify him as "bad" (or good, or anything). the potential is there. The work ethic is. Just needs to grow his game, improve, and be consistently impactful. I will say I think Cozens is proud to wear the sweater.

i feel similarly. i was definitely willingly blind to his immaturity for long while, up until this summer really. the way he handled the injury just rubbed me the wrong way, then when i started to think more about it, how he behaved publicly the last few seasons in interviews, he just seems like a selfish and stuck up kid. no hate, that’s just who he is. hard to have success with that attitude though

(and)

Eichel mystified that you can leave gracefully

Just not part of the Masshole lexicon.

 

[2 others]

Subtracting Tuch from Vegas means a potentially better draft position with the acquired 1st rounder.

 

[brian_griffin]

Subtracting Tuch from Vegas means a potentially better draft position with the acquired 1st rounder.

Welcome, new poster!!!

 

[2 others]

Welcome, new poster!!!

We thank you, sir