Confirmed Trade: [BUF/EDM] Ryan McLeod and Tyler Tullio for Matt Savoie

[Treb]

based on your say so?

personally, I think his floor is 2nd liner. If you think differently, that's up to you, but your word isn't gospel.

This is extra funny because Habs fans talk about their prospects like every single one is going to pan out and hit their ceiling, never mind their floor.

So you think Savoie has 0% bust chance?

What other Habs fans do is irrelevant.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

His floor is AHL top6 guy. He's not a lock for the NHL.

When you draft guys like Kotkaniemi and Galchenyuk consistently for years in the first round I can see someone becoming disillusioned.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

So you think Savoie has 0% bust chance?

What other Habs fans do is irrelevant.

I think it's pretty damn unlikely he busts.

He played for our current director of player development when he was running Dubuque and he's got a very strong track record.

It's not irrelevant when Habs fans shitting all over our players is fine, but threads where they look foolish nine months after doing so get shut down immediately.

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

No one is anointing him, but his potential is still top line winger. He was stagnating there, and the organization dicked him around this year before sending him back. The moment they drafted Benson Savoie was expendable and the Sabres treated him like that.

Now he can compete for a spot that he can actually earn on his merit and not by organization preference

My reply was to people like chaotic orange above… They are in fact anointing him unless you consider statements like his floor is a good 2nd liner ( like the #1 worst outcome possible for this player is that)

That’s an utterly ridiculous statement for a guy who has played three minutes in the NHL. Who is not a number top three draft pick

I have no problem with saying he is top six upside and has a lot of potential… But saying that it his floor is out of control and that is my whole point!

based on your say so?

personally, I think his floor is 2nd liner. If you think differently, that's up to you, but your word isn't gospel.

This is extra funny because Habs fans talk about their prospects like every single one is going to pan out and hit their ceiling, never mind their floor.

I laugh at the irony here - calling out someone’s opinion as “based on your say so?”

And your through the roof “ floor” projection on this player is based on what exactly?

Based on years and years of drafts his floor is for sure an AHL player, his likely outcome is a middle 6 nhl player, with like a 10% chance of being a star

 

[Treb]

When you draft guys like Kotkaniemi and Galchenyuk consistently for years in the first round I can see someone becoming disillusioned.

In opposition to Paajarvi, Yakupov and Puljujarvi?

Or Kassian, Grigorenko and Nylander?

1st rounder bust all the time.

For the record, I think Savoie is a good player and should become a top6 NHL player.

I just acknowledge his flaws and see a scenario where he struggles to make the NHL. Wouldn't be the first smallish skilled player to end up like that.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

Why do people get so upset when fans project where a prospect could potentially fit into the teams roster?

If Savoie pans out (and he may not like any other prospect even a first overall) he's probably going to get minutes in the top 6 with other skilled forwards because of the type of player he is.

Nobody thinks this kid is a bonafide star player before he's even played in the NHL like people are suggesting.

 

[Treb]

I think it's pretty damn unlikely he busts.

He played for our current director of player development when he was running Dubuque and he's got a very strong track record.

It's not irrelevant when Habs fans shitting all over our players is fine, but threads where they look foolish nine months after doing so get shut down immediately.

Where did I shit on Savoie?

 

[ChaoticOrange]

My reply was to people like chaotic orange above… They are in fact anointing him unless you consider statements like his floor is a good 2nd liner ( like the #1 worst outcome possible for this player is that)

That’s an utterly ridiculous statement for a guy who has played three minutes in the NHL. Who is not a number top three draft pick

I have no problem with saying he is top six upside and has a lot of potential… But saying that it his floor is out of control and that is my whole point!


I laugh at the irony here - calling out someone’s opinion as “based on your say so?”

And your through the roof “ floor” projection on this player is based on what exactly?

I cleverly indicated that it was my opinion by saying I personally think Savoie's floor is that of a good 2nd line winger. The sky is the limit with his ceiling.

I'm not in here making sweeping declarations asserting my rightness like a third world dictator.

I think he's got a high floor. You might think differently, that's your right.

 

[Treb]

Why do people get so upset when fans project where a prospect could potentially fit into the teams roster?

If Savoie pans out (and he may not like any other prospect even a first overall) he's probably going to get minutes in the top 6 with other skilled forwards because of the type of player he is.

I think you need to look up what floor means. Not panning out is the floor.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

I feel like I can understand most trades and where both teams are coming from, even if I don't agree with the trade. This one is a bit of a head scratcher.

Even if Buffalo traded from a position of strength, this reminds of Dorion's claim that he gave up a 3rd for Hamonic because the asking price was a 4th and Ottawa didn't have a 4th.

Couldn't they have traded Savoie for draft picks, and then sent lesser draft picks to Edmonton? Was this a scenario where Buffalo thinks McLeod is going to have a Tage Thompson style uptick in production, and when they called Edmonton, Edmonton said he wasn't available for anything but an overpayment?

This is a Forsberg for Erat type trade, where you just can't make sense of it because it seems to be so far removed from the path of least resistance to get the player.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

I think you need to look up what floor means. Not panning out is the floor.

So you agree with me. A high end prospect like Yakupov or Galch could end up not even playing the NHL. Gotcha.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Where did I shit on Savoie?

You didn't, but you sure came to the rescue of your fellow Habs fans with alacrity that were taking heat for shitting on him and his value by locking the other thread down.

 

[Siludin]

Matt Savoie is a hockey prodigy and he is a good prototype for a player who can play and understand the game the same way as McDavid or Draisaitl. If he plays with those players, he won't have to dumb his game down, which could be a very nice complement when Edmonton moves to mix things up.
Frankly I see Savoie as a linemate for Draisaitl moreso than McDavid. If he clicks I think Edmonton will run two lines more often than not. Also can make their PP2 dangerous.

 

[Raistlin]

I feel like I can understand most trades and where both teams are coming from, even if I don't agree with the trade. This one is a bit of a head scratcher.

Even if Buffalo traded from a position of strength, this reminds of Dorion's claim that he gave up a 3rd for Hamonic because the asking price was a 4th and Ottawa didn't have a 4th.

Couldn't they have traded Savoie for draft picks, and then sent lesser draft picks to Edmonton? Was this a scenario where Buffalo thinks McLeod is going to have a Tage Thompson style uptick in production, and when they called Edmonton, Edmonton said he wasn't available for anything but an overpayment?

This is a Forsberg for Erat type trade, where you just can't make sense of it because it seems to be so far removed from the path of least resistance to get the player.

or, simply put, Adams knows something about the prospect that we don't? sometimes its beyond performance, say a PLD for example. In the end, most trade balances out, Adams is not a moron as some of us forum posters believe him to be.

 

[Treb]

You didn't, but you sure came to the rescue of your fellow Habs fans with alacrity that were taking heat for shitting on him and his value by locking the other thread down.

Savoie has a lot of value and Edmonton won the deal hands down IMO.

I only said Savoie is not yet a surefire NHLer IMO.

As for the other thread, why have two thread open for the same topic? You're attributing imaginary motives to my actions.

Edit: Also, I technically "rescued" a Rangers fan, not a Habs fan so again, imagining motives.

 

[LTIR]

I think you need to look up what floor means. Not panning out is the floor.

I guess the floor for Savoie is about the same as Demidov.
Both potential busts.

 

[Treb]

So you agree with me. A high end prospect like Yakupov or Galch could end up not even playing the NHL. Gotcha.

So why did you respond to my first post the way you did if we both agree high end prospects like Savoie can bust?

 

[Treb]

I guess the floor for Savoie is about the same as Demidov.
Both potential busts.

Yes.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

In opposition to Paajarvi, Yakupov and Puljujarvi?

Or Kassian, Grigorenko and Nylander?

1st rounder bust all the time.

For the record, I think Savoie is a good player and should become a top6 NHL player.

I just acknowledge his flaws and see a scenario where he struggles to make the NHL. Wouldn't be the first smallish skilled player to end up like that.

You watch your mouth regarding Magnus Svensson-Paajarvi. He should’ve been great. That Oilers team just took his will away.


The problem with this trade is that you could’ve gotten McLeod for far less than a top prospect.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

So why did you respond to my first post the way you did if we both agree high end prospects like Savoie can bust?

I don't know, why did you only compare him to a bunch of prospects who did bust?

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Savoie has a lot of value and Edmonton won the deal hands down IMO.

I only said Savoie is not yet a surefire NHLer IMO.

As for the other thread, why have two thread open for the same topic? You're attributing imaginary motives to my actions.

And all I said was I don't think he busts, I said "I THINK" his floor is a 2nd liner, which appeared to cause significant umbrage.

Just suspicious, is all. If that wasn't your intention, then I apologize.

 

[Coffey]

 

[Treb]

I don't know, why did you only compare him to a bunch of prospects who did bust?

You're the one who brought up prospects who disappointed first, so I'm not sure I follow your reasoning here?

My first post only said he could bust, no prospects. Then you took a jab at the Habs drafting, which I responded with examples from Edmonton and Buffalo.

 

[elchud]

Let's say that McLeod checks all of the following boxes

*decent at faceoffs
*plus defensive player
*high compete
*fast
*young but experienced
*on a good contract
*team control on next contract
*offensive upside
*solid 3C
*playoff experience

Is there a comparable young center that checks all those boxes who could be had for Matt Savoie?

 

[Coffey]

His floor is AHL top6 guy. He's not a lock for the NHL.

If Yamamoto can make the NHL, so can this dude.