Kings News: Brayden McNabb + Jonathan Parker + Two 2nd's to LA for Fasching + Deslaurier ‎

[damacles1156]

I'm not saying Gravel isn't ahead of Forbort. I just don't think he's ahead of McNabb.

1. McNabb
2. Gravel
3. Forbort

Not in terms of being ready, but talent wise:

Gravel
McNabb
Forbort.

I take it you have never seen Gravel play ?

 

[kinghock]

It's a standard asset management and player development approach. Greene, Mitchell, and Regehr won't be around forever.

I am saying that for our great package we could ask for more, or do not include ND.

 

[HYORI 1963]

Not in terms of being ready, but talent wise:

Gravel
McNabb
Forbort.

So, you think in a trade, Gravel would have netted us more in return than McNabb did?

 

[damacles1156]

I am saying that for our great package we could ask for more, or do not include ND.

Never marry yourself to prospects.

Nic D was a project that may not have even made the Kings roster.

 

[damacles1156]

So, you think in a trade, Gravel would have netted us more in return than McNabb did?

If The Kings Wanted to trade Gravel, yes he would net a better package.

Kings wouldn't do that though.

Players like Gravel are hard to find. His hockey IQ is off the charts.

Gravel and Shore are the best picks in the NCAA I think Lombardi/Futa has ever made.

Kings fans are going to love Nick Shore. He is Stoll without the Dumb penalties and very good hands.

Shore is also a beast in the Face off circle.

 

[kinghock]

Never marry yourself to prospects.

Nic D was a project that may not have even made the Kings roster.

I share Tonellisghost opinion and disagree with yours.
Tonellisghost:
“I have known and followed NickD for years going back to his days in the Q and have written a ton about him already but only had the chance to see him play LW in person twice. His exceptional skating and just plain old grit are enough to get him onto an NHL roster as a bottom 6er but the fact that he has an excellent shot and 100% commitment to everything he does around the game makes me see him as a very good prospect who should start playing in the NHL next season and blossom by seasons endâ€.

 

[damacles1156]

I share Tonellisghost opinion and disagree with yours.
Tonellisghost:
“I have known and followed NickD for years going back to his days in the Q and have written a ton about him already but only had the chance to see him play LW in person twice. His exceptional skating and just plain old grit are enough to get him onto an NHL roster as a bottom 6er but the fact that he has an excellent shot and 100% commitment to everything he does around the game makes me see him as a very good prospect who should start playing in the NHL next season and blossom by seasons endâ€.

Agree to disagree, I watched the kid play at Manchester as well.

Was never impressed with his hockey IQ. There is no doubt he is an Athlete, big body, decent hands.

But he was a liability on the ice in two zones. I wish him luck in Buffalo, I hope he makes it as a bottom sixer in the NHL.

I think Nick is a bottom six NHL player waiting to happen, just not for a Stanley Cup roster.

For Buffalo ? I think he will make it.

 

[kinghock]

Agree to disagree, I watched the kid play at Manchester as well.

Was never impressed with his hockey IQ. There is no doubt he is an Athlete, big body, decent hands.

But he was a liability on the ice in two zones. I wish him luck in Buffalo, I hope he makes it as a bottom sixer in the NHL.

I think Nick is a bottom six NHL player waiting to happen, just not for a Stanley Cup roster.

For Buffalo ? I think he will make it.

I still believe you undervalue Nick. I agree with importance of hockey IQ, but I don’t think Burns have very high hockey IQ either...

 

[damacles1156]

I still believe you undervalue Nick. I agree with importance of hockey IQ, but I don’t think Burns have very high hockey IQ either...

Brent Burns Is about 100 times more skilled than Nick D.

Lets not try and say Nick D would be Brent Burns.

Although Hockey IQ for both would be on par

 

[Johnny Utah]

Does McNabb go to Manchester?

 

[damacles1156]

Does McNabb go to Manchester?

Pretty sure he will, He is still waiver exempt if I am correct. Next year though he will have to pass waivers.

 

[Whiskeypete]

If The Kings Wanted to trade Gravel, yes he would net a better package.

but this is a subjective opinion, yours will be different than others. this is why all of this at some point is a "guessing game and gut instinct". in order to get past this, we have to look at and study the body of work each player has presented.

i have to see McNabb play yet, but i've seen the other two. on paper and based on results i would say McNabb is ahead of Gravel. he already has 30+ NHL games under his belt and named an AHL all-star twice.

Gravel has yet to play even in the AHL and be measured against the next tier of players he will compete against. we can't judge Gravel's performance to date to McNabb's because Kevin is playing against a totally different (lower) level of competition. Kevin is playing against a lot of players that won't even make it to the ECHL level, let alone the AHL or NHL.

this is a significant gap when it comes to judging one players performance over another's based on performance. McNabb has already stood out among his peers in the AHL. Kevin stands out against NCAA players.

i like Kevin's game, don't get me wrong. i look forward to it, but to say he is further along than a guy that has NHL experience and an all-star in the AHL doesn't make sense.

Gravel will have his up's/down's when he takes the next step. McNabb has faced these already and is now trying to overcome the obstacles facing him at the NHL level.

Gravel also will be a year behind Forbort. will he surpass and learn faster than Derek when he gets to MAN, once SCSU closes its season? time will tell, but Derek has now faced and played almost an entire AHL season. Derek has been playing against men that are professionals. Kevin is still playing college kids.

until Gravel steps out and plays for MAN, i rate him behind McNabb and Forbort. for the same reason we all see the arc of development these young kids go through at D. we only have to look up top at Muzzin and the on going struggles he faces nightly, adapting to the NHL.

 

[Johnny Utah]

So let's assume this for next year...

Doughty, Voynov, Muzzin, Martinez and Regehr are the locks because of contracts. That makes 5. Kings need 2 more D.

McNabb, since he will have to pass waivers will be #6. So do the Kings let both Mitchell and Greene go and sign a #7 utility guy? Or do they re-sign one, put McNabb in and rotate a guy like Martinez in and out...

I just don't see the Kings making McNabb a healthy scratch and I don't see Greene or Mitchell re-signing knowing they are in the #6-#7 role occasionally playing.

 

[damacles1156]

but this is a subjective opinion, yours will be different than others. this is why all of this at some point is a "guessing game and gut instinct".

i have to see McNabb play yet, but i've seen the other two. on paper and based on results i would say McNabb is ahead of Gravel. he already has 30+ NHL games under his belt and named an AHL all-star twice.

Gravel has yet to play even in the AHL and be measured against the next tier of players he will compete against. we can't judge Gravel's performance to date to McNabb's because Kevin is playing against a totally different (lower) level of competition. Kevin is playing against a lot of players that won't even make it to the ECHL level, let alone the AHL or NHL.

this is a significant gap when it comes to judging one players performance over another's based on performance. McNabb has already stood out among his peers in the AHL. Kevin stands out against NCAA players.

i like Kevin's game, don't get me wrong. i look forward to it, but to say he is further along than a guy that has NHL experience and an all-star in the AHL doesn't make sense.

Gravel will have his up's/down's when he takes the next step. McNabb has faced these already and is now trying to overcome the obstacles facing him at the NHL level.

Gravel also will be a year behind Forbort. will he surpass and learn faster than Derek when he gets to MAN, once SCSU closes its season? time will tell, but Derek has now faced and played almost an entire AHL season. Derek has been playing against men that are professionals. Kevin is still playing college kids.

until Gravel steps out and plays for MAN, i rate him behind McNabb and Forbort. for the same reason we all see the arc of development these young kids go through at D. we only have to look up top at Muzzin and the on going struggles he faces nightly, adapting to the NHL.

I rate Gravel based on skills, not production or competition.

You can't deny that Gravel has superb Hockey IQ. Much better puck moving skills than Forbort

I like Forbort, haven't seen McNabb enough, But Gravel is way more skilled than Forbort.

I look forward to seeing McNabb play at Manchester/Kings get a good gauge of him.

I look at prospects from a skills standpoint. Cause guys can have tremendous production even at the AHL level (Kozun/Weal). And not even make the NHL.

Like Vey vs Shore, Shore is a much better player than Vey. Except Shore is behind in EXP.

Also the Kings are big on paying your dues, so Vey is going to get every opportunity to play before Shore.

Same with McNabb vs Gravel/Forbort.

I value Hockey IQ more than anything cause it's hard to teach. Nearly impossible.

 

[kinghock]

So let's assume this for next year...

Doughty, Voynov, Muzzin, Martinez and Regehr are the locks because of contracts. That makes 5. Kings need 2 more D.

McNabb, since he will have to pass waivers will be #6. So do the Kings let both Mitchell and Greene go and sign a #7 utility guy? Or do they re-sign one, put McNabb in and rotate a guy like Martinez in and out...

I just don't see the Kings making McNabb a healthy scratch and I don't see Greene or Mitchell re-signing knowing they are in the #6-#7 role occasionally playing.

I think they will decide between Regehr and Greene.
Regehr has only one year left and can be traded.

 

[damacles1156]

With all that said McNabb is going to be in the Kings lineup well before Forbort/Gravel.

McNabb has already paid his dues, he is much further along in the Development process.

 

[Whiskeypete]

So let's assume this for next year...

Doughty, Voynov, Muzzin, Martinez and Regehr are the locks because of contracts. That makes 5. Kings need 2 more D.

McNabb, since he will have to pass waivers will be #6. So do the Kings let both Mitchell and Greene go and sign a #7 utility guy? Or do they re-sign one, put McNabb in and rotate a guy like Martinez in and out...

I just don't see the Kings making McNabb a healthy scratch and I don't see Greene or Mitchell re-signing knowing they are in the #6-#7 role occasionally playing.

it won't surprise me if DL signs another D over the summer. it won't surprise me to see Martinez packaged at the draft. how and why he keeps being overlooked amazes me. the same way Dean made the choice between Hickey or Muzzin. i think Dean will make a call on AMart moving forward and package him.

I rate Gravel based on skills, not production or competition.

You can't deny that Gravel has superb Hockey IQ. Much better puck moving skills than Forbort

I like Forbort, haven't seen McNabb enough, But Gravel is way more skilled than Forbort.

I look forward to seeing McNabb play at Manchester/Kings get a good gauge of him.

I look at prospects from a skills standpoint. Cause guys can have tremendous production even at the AHL level (Kozun/Weal). And not even make the NHL.

Like Vey vs Shore, Shore is a much better player than Vey. Except Shore is behind in EXP.

i look at skills and IQ all the time. stats i don't dwell on, they don't tell the complete picture.

kevin does have better puck skills and sees the first pass quicker than Derek, based on the NCAA. he also uses his body better positionally and as a weapon to hit guys. i will give him these skills. BUT, we haven't see him yet at the AHL level. we don't know how his skills yet will translate at the level.

 

[Fat Elvis]

I think that this deal will open up more possibilities come draft day. Now with the Kings Defense pipeline looking fuller, DL and staff may look to fill their forward corps. With Dowd, Mersch, Zykov moving up into the system, maybe DL drafts the next wave of forwards. Just a thought.

 

[damacles1156]

it won't surprise me if DL signs another D over the summer. it won't surprise me to see Martinez packaged at the draft. how and why he keeps being overlooked amazes me. the same way Dean made the choice between Hickey or Muzzin. i think Dean will make a call on AMart moving forward and package him.




i look at skills and IQ all the time. stats i don't dwell on, they don't tell the complete picture.

kevin does have better puck skills and sees the first pass quicker than Derek, based on the NCAA. he also uses his body better positionally and as a weapon to hit guys. i will give him these skills. BUT, we haven't see him yet at the AHL level. we don't know how his skills yet will translate at the level.

I see where you are coming from, and somewhat agree.

But you have to admit, that Hockey IQ translates to any level.

Drew Doughty, while being very skilled and athletic. Had very little trouble playing NHL minutes as a 19, due to his Savant like Hockey IQ.

I believe Gravel will only need one year in Manchester.

 

[damacles1156]

I think that this deal will open up more possibilities come draft day. Now with the Kings Defense pipeline looking fuller, DL and staff may look to fill their forward corps. With Dowd, Mersch, Zykov moving up into the system, maybe DL drafts the next wave of forwards. Just a thought.

Lombardi and Futa have drafted a glut of Forwards the last three years.

You following the drafts ?

They just traded Nick D and Hudson cause the Kings haven't drafted many defenders in the last three years.

 

[Whiskeypete]

I see where you are coming from, and somewhat agree.

But you have to admit, that Hockey IQ translates to any level.

Drew Doughty, while being very skilled and athletic. Had very little trouble playing NHL minutes as a 19, due to his Savant like Hockey IQ.

I believe Gravel will only need one year in Manchester.

i hear you D. i agree IQ will set guys apart from others. you can have a physically gifted player with poor IQ and they are worthless. no matter what that player will under perform, simply because they can't read the play. in contrast you can take a guys with average to good skills and physical assets with above average to excellent IQ, he will become a top asset to a team.

give me the last guy every time.

right now this is how i see Muzzin and AMart. Muzz has great physical tools, but the kid mentally just doesn't seem to be there. Alec on the other hand is far superior when it comes to seeing, reading and being in the right spot.

 

[HYORI 1963]

Des should be an nhler by next year. I have no idea how anyone can think that this kid can't make it to the nhl. To me, it's a no-brainer that this kid makes it. So much heart, size, grit and he can actually skate and score. It's a slam dunk!

 

[Fat Elvis]

You following the drafts ?
.

I looked at who's in the system and who'll be moving up and most likely who'll not be signed. With Leslie, LaDue, Roach, Ebert joining Miller, Forbort, Gravel, McNabb and Bods, I merely suggested that the defensive corp appears to be strong with a couple waves of these kids coming in. I was looking at the forwards and it's not as strong now that HF and NicDes have been dealt. Zykov, Dowd and Mersch are the new forwards moving up along with Kitsyn.
Just an observation that I think DL will look to add where he subtracted.

 

[damacles1156]

i hear you D. i agree IQ will set guys apart from others. you can have a physically gifted player with poor IQ and they are worthless. no matter what that player will under perform, simply because they can't read the play. in contrast you can take a guys with average to good skills and physical assets with above average to excellent IQ, he will become a top asset to a team.

give me the last guy every time.

right now this is how i see Muzzin and AMart. Muzz has great physical tools, but the kid mentally just doesn't seem to be there. Alec on the other hand is far superior when it comes to seeing, reading and being in the right spot.

That's my rub with Muzzin as well, the Kings fell in love with his Size and skating.

They picked him over Hickey due to it, But man, Hickey's IQ is much higher.

Hickey is proving that in NY, He remains a plus player on a dreadful Defensive team, playing 16+ minutes a night.

I have always said Muzzin's brain needs to catch up with his Body.

 

[damacles1156]

I looked at who's in the system and who'll be moving up and most likely who'll not be signed. With Leslie, LaDue, Roach, Ebert joining Miller, Forbort, Gravel, McNabb and Bods, I merely suggested that the defensive corp appears to be strong with a couple waves of these kids coming in. I was looking at the forwards and it's not as strong now that HF and NicDes have been dealt. Zykov, Dowd and Mersch are the new forwards moving up along with Kitsyn.
Just an observation that I think DL will look to add where he subtracted.

A simple (yes) would have answered it.

You talking Wingers only ? Cause you didn't even list the best Forward the Kings have in Development in Nick Shore.