Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

Dekes For Days

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Wanna know something funny? Treliving's third string goalie making $800K ended up playing more games for the Leafs, with a superior GAA and Save % than Kyle Dubas' $4 million goalie addition for 2021-22.
Why is that funny? I'm not sure that Treliving's best goalie acquisition being a third stringer who did better than his predecessor's worst goalie acquisition is the flex you wanted it to be. Both of your cap hits were wrong BTW.
We couldn't keep Zach Hyman cause we needed Petr Mrazek.
The decision to not re-sign Hyman had nothing to do with Mrazek.
 

DarkKnight

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Shanahan has left Treliving in a very tough spot with the core .

It should have been dealt with 2 yrs ago.
Treliving is in an impossible position.

Ask Marner to wave his NMC any trade will be pennies on the dollar

JT ask your captain to waive his NMC
I think he is here till his contract is finished

Unless Marner wants out of the fish bowl it won't happen .

I personally think they will bring in a new coach and change the way they play as a 5 man unit.

Jamcrock Kampf and Ljiligren will be traded

Most of our cap will go to defense

We need a dman with a bomb from the point and a pp quarter back
Montour

Until JT's cap is gone then you can judge Treliving
If we keep Domi, we can trade a Kampf, Holmberg has shown me enough that he can log 10 minutes in the four hole. Jarnkrok never ever ever produces in the playoffs, does good things, it never materializes. Lil I’m over too, his idea of a board win is a draw, I can’t believe how weak he is and mentally he turns to mush with any pressure whatsoever , zero poise, it just won’t work.
 

notbias

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Or you could just put reality goggles on and stick to the facts.

Dubas

Poor contract negotiatior.
Poor team builder. Soft
Could not assemble team to develop D or Gs
Could not generate PO success.
Did not move on from a coach that struggled in the NHL.
Traded far too many picks for no playoff success.

So yeah. Dubas was a complete failure and is gone because of it.

It is mind-boggling for people to write this and hate on Dubas for it and not realize this is describing Treliving as well...

This is a thread about Treliving... let's discuss how this applies to him
 

LEAFANFORLIFE23

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Klingberg hasn't been good for a long time and wasn't good in his time here, it wasn't just injuries.



What middle of the roster? He brought in mostly bottom of the roster guys.

I don't mind most of the guys he brought in, but he signed Domi, Bert, Kampf, Reaves, Sammy, Klingberg, Holmberg, Gregor, and Benoit.

They could have likely just promoted from within and only missed Domi and Benoit there.



Jones was a great #3 and I'd use him again as that, but you are bragging about .500 hockey, this just tells me they were much worse with Jones than without.

It is .658 hockey vs .523 hockey... that is a big gap.

The gap is the gap between the Flyers and Colorado.



I'm assuming that most players don't want to play in Canada.

The US is better if you have money.

I keep hearing tha, it only seems to impact Calgary, nobody is asking out of Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal, Edmonton, Ottawa, or hell even Winnipeg, and Winnipeg is where you'd probably expect it, but PLD aside it doesn't really happen.
 

myleafs

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If we keep Domi, we can trade a Kampf, Holmberg has shown me enough that he can log 10 minutes in the four hole. Jarnkrok never ever ever produces in the playoffs, does good things, it never materializes. Lil I’m over too, his idea of a board win is a draw, I can’t believe how weak he is and mentally he turns to mush with any pressure whatsoever , zero poise, it just won’t work.
I would have Lily spend a few days with Chris Pronger. Teams target Lily and he takes a beating. He needs to learn to be a mfkr. Spear, slash, elbow, anything that will get players thinking twice about dumping the puck in his corner. As it stands, nobody is afraid or intimidated by Lily and he just ends up being a victim.
 
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Stephen

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Why is that funny? I'm not sure that Treliving's best goalie acquisition being a third stringer who did better than his predecessor's worst goalie acquisition is the flex you wanted it to be. Both of your cap hits were wrong BTW.

The decision to not re-sign Hyman had nothing to do with Mrazek.

Your ongoing Kyle Dubas zombie lobbying, while energetic, simply doesn’t have the fuel from Treliving’s moves to be sustainable... A cheap third string veteran goalie who helped stabilize the team isn’t a legitimate point of criticism.

To quote your hero. Move on.
 

Antropovsky

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I would have Lily spend a few days with Chris Pronger. Teams target Lily and he takes a beating. He needs to learn to be a mfkr. Spear, slash, elbow, anything that will get players thinking twice about dumping the puck in his corner. As it stands, nobody is afraid or intimidated by Lily and he just ends up being a victim.
Well Chris Pronger was also 6'6
 

Antropovsky

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Liljegren is also Rasmus Andersson’s size and he’s an average sized monster out there. So it just goes back to a guy’s innate compete level and nastiness. Can’t teach it.
Agreed, I've always said we need to focus on acquiring players who hate to lose, I don't care if they are "nasty" but I want them to have a real dislike for losing. McDavid isn't nasty but he he is passionate and competitive.

Can't wait for Marner to be gone... his lack of any emotion on the ice is proof that its just a paycheck to him.
 

Dekes For Days

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Sep 24, 2018
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Your ongoing Kyle Dubas zombie lobbying, while energetic, simply doesn’t have the fuel from Treliving’s moves to be sustainable... A cheap third string veteran goalie who helped stabilize the team isn’t a legitimate point of criticism. To quote your hero. Move on.
If you'd read my post, you'd know that it wasn't about Dubas, or even about criticizing the Jones acquisition, which I've actually said was "a good acquisition by Treliving for that role". What Jones wasn't, however, was a "capable starter" or an upgrade for our playoff goalie, which is what was being discussed. Dubas was nobody's hero, and nobody is "zombie lobbying". You seem more focused on him than I am; bringing up Mrazek and Hyman. He was, however, a good GM, and moving on doesn't mean being satisfied with Treliving moving this team backwards.
 
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Antropovsky

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Jun 2, 2007
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If you'd read my post, you'd know that it wasn't about Dubas, or even about criticizing the Jones acquisition, which I've actually said was "a good acquisition by Treliving for that role". What Jones wasn't, however, was a "capable starter" or an upgrade for our playoff goalie, which is what was being discussed. Dubas was nobody's hero, and nobody is "zombie lobbying". You seem more focused on him than I am. He was, however, a good GM, and moving on doesn't mean being satisfied with Treliving moving this team backwards.
He was a bad GM. Keefe was a bad coach that was learning through the school of hard knocks, just as Dubas was.

Leafs organization and the fans paid a big price for hiring Dubas.

The teams "culture" was on a great path, until he took over, adopted a basketball like approach to the teams stars, created this "core 4 stuff" and literally let the core 4 walk all over him and treat him like a door mat.

Now we're back to needing to rebuild the culture and cancel out the Muskoka yaht club shit again.

Marner is a monster he created.
 

thewave

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Jun 17, 2011
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He was a bad GM. Keefe was a bad coach that was learning through the school of hard knocks, just as Dubas was.

Leafs organization and the fans paid a big price for hiring Dubas.

The teams "culture" was on a great path, until he took over, adopted a basketball like approach to the teams stars, created this "core 4 stuff" and literally let the core 4 walk all over him and treat him like a door mat.

Now we're back to needing to rebuild the culture and cancel out the Muskoka yaht club shit again.

Marner is a monster he created.

Exactly what happened
 
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thusk

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If we keep Domi, we can trade a Kampf, Holmberg has shown me enough that he can log 10 minutes in the four hole. Jarnkrok never ever ever produces in the playoffs, does good things, it never materializes. Lil I’m over too, his idea of a board win is a draw, I can’t believe how weak he is and mentally he turns to mush with any pressure whatsoever , zero poise, it just won’t work.

its not domi or holmberg who will replace everything Kampf was bringing in the defenside side.
 

DarkKnight

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its not domi or holmberg who will replace everything Kampf was bringing in the defenside side.
If Domi is in the three hole , or JT, Holmberg can take the fourth. He has good defensive acumen, Kampf isn't all that either, he a decent PKer and borderline shutdown C. Domi can't do that job obviously but he can play C, and I have faith Holmberg isn't a downgrade defensively, and he has more offence too.

Minten might be in the mix as well.
 
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A1LeafNation

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Timing is the real issue here.

Brad Treliving was hired as general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs on Wednesday May 31, 2023. As part of the agreement for the Leafs to be able to talk to Treliving before his contract expired on June 30th, 2023 was that he was not allowed to be an active participant in the Leafs draft on June 24th.

Marner's NMC contract clause would kick in July 1st, 2023, when his UFA status year kicked in.

With only 1 month on the job, and not allowed essentially trade Marner at the draft as part of his non-compete agreement there was very little time to make such a big trade.

That's on Shanahann and his 10 year pattern recognition plan (but not 9).

This is all on Shanahan.
 

thusk

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If Domi is in the three hole , or JT, Holmberg can take the fourth. He has good defensive acumen, Kampf isn't all that either, he a decent PKer and borderline shutdown C. Domi can't do that job obviously but he can play C, and I have faith Holmberg isn't a downgrade defensively, and he has more offence too.

Minten might be in the mix as well.

Holmberg is a huge downgrade defensively vs kampf...

Kampf is always the 1st guy send late in game to close the game, a guy coach never hesitate to send even vs top opposite line. Its not even close to be the case with Holmberg even if he had developped his defensive abilities. Holmberg couls be at best a kerfoot 2.0 defensively
 

Martin Skoula

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Holmberg is a huge downgrade defensively vs kampf...

Kampf is always the 1st guy send late in game to close the game, a guy coach never hesitate to send even vs top opposite line. Its not even close to be the case with Holmberg even if he had developped his defensive abilities. Holmberg couls be at best a kerfoot 2.0 defensively

How’d that go in game 7?
 

Dreakmur

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Mar 25, 2008
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Ah, so we're getting to a little more nuance now. You started off dismissing the regular season, and claiming that "contenders" are only determined by the playoffs, and now after getting caught in a contradiction, your position has suddenly changed again. So exactly how much weight does the mighty Dreakmur allow us to put on each?

I’ve always tried to explain to you that there’s a difference between regular season hockey and playoff hockey. You seem to be the only one confused.

We finally have you acknowledging sample sizes! Another one off the list! I wonder which sample size would be more representative of a team's quality... the outcome and underlying results of 82 games against 31 different opponents over a 7 month period, or just the end outcome of 4-7 games against one team over a 1-2 week period with no context. Exactly how big of a sample size do we need? Because you seem to be trying to simultaneously dismiss outcomes in a sample size of 4 series, while making contradictory declarations based on the outcome of 1 series.

Sample sizes have always been important, but only when measuring the same statistic. Regular season games are not the same as playoff games. While their sample size it greater, it doesn’t tell you anything accurate.

The issue is that you correctly identified something that he was good at, instead of pretending that he caused climate change. And yet even as you reminisce about the one compliment you ever gave him, you can't help but simultaneously make inaccurate criticisms.

That wasn’t reminiscent - that was exactly what I said at the time. It was accurate then and it’s accurate now. Dubas doesn’t understand the importance of roles on a team.

And people in the middle, like me. Getting into disagreements with everybody doesn't make you in the middle, or right.

The only thing you’re in the middle of is Dubas’ anus.

No, you just accuse people of "blaming luck" when they consider any of the context that you suddenly started considering once the GM changed to Treliving.

You have never blamed anything except bad luck. Posters who understood what was happening on the ice tried to explain to you what was actually happening, and why it seemed like luck, but you had your Dubas blinders strapped on tight.

So have we finally reached acknowledgement that Treliving chose to sign Samsonov, and then chose to go into the playoffs with no goalie changes? It seems like now that the GM is different, you're eager to consider context like the options actually available to a GM, and the fact that decisions that are "good at the time" don't always turn out well, but I think the first step is admitting what he did.

Cool.... so we've established the best choice at the time was still a bad option. Perhaps we should discuss why Tre walked into such a bad situation?

You sure have come a long way from bragging that Samsonov was brought in by Dubas....

We didn't even have a good record in the limited games we played with Jones, so I'm not sure how he "saved our season". He came up and filled in nicely for a stretch, before going back to struggling. Which is perfectly fine for a third stringer, and it turned into a good acquisition by Treliving for that role, but I'm not sure what the goalie that Treliving chose for his third stringer has to do with the playoffs.

So which available goalie should we have added? And what assets were we going to move?

We had a ton of cap space and assets. Every option was available to him. I think it's just that people are finally realizing that acquiring dominant goaltending is easier said than done.

We had some cap space, but the roster was in shambles after we went all-in with a pile of UFA rentals.

We had some assets, but our pool of picks and prospects has been diminished by years of trading them for UFA rentals.
 
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DarkKnight

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Jan 17, 2017
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Holmberg is a huge downgrade defensively vs kampf...

Kampf is always the 1st guy send late in game to close the game, a guy coach never hesitate to send even vs top opposite line. Its not even close to be the case with Holmberg even if he had developped his defensive abilities. Holmberg couls be at best a kerfoot 2.0 defensively
I think you over state Kampf, he simply isn't an elite shutdown guy. And just as often it's Matthews or Marner, JT, over the boards down the stretch. Also, Holmberg acquitted himself quite well, I fail to see any resemblance to his game and Kerfoot, seems an odd comparison. Kampf has a relatively high ticket, if we want to augment the blue line, he might be a salary casualty. He's a one tool player.
 

darrylsittler27

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Oct 21, 2002
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I think you over state Kampf, he simply isn't an elite shutdown guy. And just as often it's Matthews or Marner, JT, over the boards down the stretch. Also, Holmberg acquitted himself quite well, I fail to see any resemblance to his game and Kerfoot, seems an odd comparison. Kampf has a relatively high ticket, if we want to augment the blue line, he might be a salary casualty. He's a one tool player.
I used to like Kampf but no way do you pay a 4th line C $2.4 M. The Leafs have a junk team because they overpay everyone. How long did Las Vegas take to win a cup? Toronto is not close.
 

Apex Predator

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Jun 21, 2019
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I’ve always tried to explain to you that there’s a difference between regular season hockey and playoff hockey. You seem to be the only one confused.



Sample sizes have always been important, but only when measuring the same statistic. Regular season games are not the same as playoff games. While their sample size it greater, it doesn’t tell you anything accurate.



That wasn’t reminiscent - that was exactly what I said at the time. It was accurate then and it’s accurate now. Dubas doesn’t understand the importance of roles on a team.



The only thing you’re in the middle of is Dubas’ anus.



The only thing that really makes sense is a predetermined agenda. That’s actually the most flattering explanation for your stance. The alternative is either head trauma or some degenerative brain disease.



You have never blamed anything except bad luck. Posters who understood what was happening on the ice tried to explain to you what was actually happening, and why it seemed like luck, but you had your Dubas blinders strapped on tight.



Cool.... so we've established the best choice at the time was still a bad option. Perhaps we should discuss why Tre walked into such a bad situation?

You sure have come a long way from bragging that Samsonov was brought in by Dubas....



So which available goalie should we have added? And what assets were we going to move?



We had some cap space, but the roster was in shambles after we went all-in with a pile of UFA rentals.

We had some assets, but our pool of picks and prospects has been diminished by years of trading them for UFA rentals.
Kudos to you for trying with Dekes!
 

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