Prospect Info: Blues 2023-2024 Prospect Thread

[Brockon]

These are also all guys whose defensive weaknesses get brutally exposed in the playoffs, which is the real hockey competition time.

Dunn was sheltered during the Blues Cup run and that's the only Cup any of these guys have touched.

So Shattenkirk's 2020 TBL cup ring doesn't count? 25gp 3g-10a-13p. His 487.5 mins played translates to ~19.5 mins atoi for the run. Not top mins, but pretty hard to bury a guy for 19+ mins a night.

Not that I disagree with your premise, I just find it convenient that you overlooked another example of an offensive dman that has a cup, despite being recognized as poor defensively.

 

[Brian39]

These are also all guys whose defensive weaknesses get brutally exposed in the playoffs, which is the real hockey competition time.

Dunn was sheltered during the Blues Cup run and that's the only Cup any of these guys have touched.

Klingberg had 21 points in 26 games while playing 23:20 a night for Dallas on their run to the Cup Final in 2020. That TOI was 3rd on the team and his point total was 2nd on the team. He played a huge part in that team getting to the Cup Final. The year before, he had 9 points in 13 games through 24:38 a night when they took us to double OT of game 7. His play fell off a cliff in his late 20s, but he was pretty damn far from being brutally exposed in the playoffs before that.

Shatty has a Cup ring and had 13 points in 25 games while playing 19:30 a night that season. His performance in the playoffs was basically right in line with what he did for them in the regular season. He had 11 points in 20 games on our trip to the Conference Final in 2016, bringing his performance well in line with his regular season performance.

Karlsson dragged a Sens team to double OT of game 7 of the Conference Final in 2017. He played 28 minutes a night in the playoffs and his 18 points in 19 games led the team (2nd best was 15 points and 3rd best was just 11 points). That team only had 3 forwards top the 40 point mark and their leading scorer besides Karlsson had 61 points. This team had absolutely no business getting 1 goal from a Cup Final. He would have been the runaway Conn Smythe pick if they had scored one more goal and gotten to the Cup Final. 2 years later he got back to the Conference Final with San Jose, putting up 16 points in 19 games. He "only" averaged 24:45 a night for that team and him leaving game 5 with injury in our series was pretty much the final nail in the coffin. He was averaging 25:32 a night prior to playing just 10 minutes in that game 5.

Burns had 16 points in 19 games on that 2019 Conference Final run while playing 28:25 a night. He had 9 points in 15 games on a Conference Final run with Carolina last year while playing 26 minutes a night (which was 1st on a damn good Hurricanes team). He also had 24 points in 24 games while playing 25:07 a night in 2016 when San Jose went to the Cup Final.

Dunn was absolutely sheltered when he got his name on the Cup, but he was contributing as a 22 year old. This past season, he had 7 points and played 23:10 for Seattle as they eliminated the defending Cup champs and then got to game 7 in round 2 as a Wild Card team.

All told, these 5 guys combine for 2 Cups, 4 total trips to the Final, and 9 total trips to the Conference Final. I don't see a brutal exposition of weakness that fundamentally changes their impact from regular season play to playoff play. I see a ton of examples of these guys being a huge contributor to team playoff success.

 

[PocketNines]

So Shattenkirk's 2020 TBL cup ring doesn't count? 25gp 3g-10a-13p. His 487.5 mins played translates to ~19.5 mins atoi for the run. Not top mins, but pretty hard to bury a guy for 19+ mins a night.

Not that I disagree with your premise, I just find it convenient that you overlooked another example of an offensive dman that has a cup, despite being recognized as poor defensively.

It wasn't convenient since despite what people like you imply I play it straight with what I think and if I make a mistake like I did forgetting how Shattenkirk was on Tampa 2020, I always say so.

I resent the implication that I need the help of dishonesty to bolster my case.

 

[Blueswin]

top 10 prospects MSN

 

[Frenzy31]

Otto with and assist and Snugs with a goal.

 

[Mike Liut]

top 10 prospects MSN

Good write up. Damn, we are loaded. Best pool we’ve ever had.

 

[PJJJP]

This should be fun to watch. I always like stuff like this

 

[greybush314]

This should be fun to watch. I always like stuff like this

I wonder if they include the part where Army reminds Yzerman about the photos he has and politely informs him that he will not be taking Dvorsky

 

[542365]

This should be fun to watch. I always like stuff like this

Probably a stupid question, but this is just going to be a video that lives on YouTube, right? I don’t have to tune in right at 7?

 

[PJJJP]

Probably a stupid question, but this is just going to be a video that lives on YouTube, right? I don’t have to tune in right at 7?

I'm pretty sure you can watch it at any time, it's just that it goes live at 7pm

 

[DatDude44]

i'm actually excited for cooley to leave. if he was back he would be the man and snuggy the sidekick. now it's up to snuggy to step up and be the man. it's not like there won't be other talent there (moore, for example) but after several of their stars (and leaders) move on it should hopefully help snuggy's development.

The only sh***y thing is that Moore doesn’t see the ice well and likes to do everything himself, snuggys gonna get a lot less puck touches and opportunity to score playing with him than Cooley. His point production might hinder a bit, which is fine, we all know he’s a stud, but I don’t wanna deal with the overreactive stat watchers on this site lmfaooo

 

[bleedblue1223]

He could have a year like Boeser, who had a pretty decent drop in production from his freshman to sophomore seasons, but it didn't really mean anything. He still entered the NHL that year, and in that next season was highly productive.

For Snuggs, it's less the stats and more how his overall game gets more NHL ready, which is hard to track for those not watching.

 

[DatDude44]

He could have a year like Boeser, who had a pretty decent drop in production from his freshman to sophomore seasons, but it didn't really mean anything. He still entered the NHL that year, and in that next season was highly productive.

For Snuggs, it's less the stats and more how his overall game gets more NHL ready, which is hard to track for those not watching.

Correct, which is why i said it's fine, we all know he's a stud, but the annoying stat only watchers are gonna throw a fit when it looks like he's "downtrending" when in reality, it's a product of not playing with knies and cooley. and those D they had snapping the puck up the ice.

Who knows though, maybe snuggy takes over and tosses up 60 points in a line driving role.

 

[PJJJP]

Just finished watching the blues behind the scenes of the draft and it was very interesting. Dvorsky was one of 7 players who we wouldn’t move back from and if he wasn’t there seems like they might have moved back to #13

 

[542365]

Just finished watching the blues behind the scenes of the draft and it was very interesting. Dvorsky was one of 7 players who we wouldn’t move back from and if he wasn’t there seems like they might have moved back to #13

Watched it too. Seemed we had a deal with Buffalo to move back to 13 if Dvorsky was taken. I wouldn’t be shocked if they were hoping to move up to 10 and grab Benson, who they got anyway at 13.

 

[shpongle falls]

Just finished watching the blues behind the scenes of the draft and it was very interesting. Dvorsky was one of 7 players who we wouldn’t move back from and if he wasn’t there seems like they might have moved back to #13

Just watched it as well it was great. I guess they wanted Dvorsky the whole time, and were high on Stenberg and Lindstein too. Its rad they were able to snag all three of the players they wanted. This is one of the better drafts we’ve had in awhile.

I thought it was funny when Army did some early congratulations to David Poile and said “we’re just going to go old school and say the guys name” Lol

 

[Mike Liut]

Just watched it too. Wish it was 2 hrs long. Cool stuff. They loved Dvorsky so much they were ready to move up for him. Cant say I blame them. Also, they had no intention of moving down from their other 2 picks. They wanted to walk away with 3 1st rounders. Good choice.

 

[STL fan in MN]

Interesting view but nothing too earth shattering. Only 20 minutes. They apparently took 50 hours of video total so somewhat surprised they only made it 20 min.

Some notable things:

Army asks Feltrin if he’d rather have 4 picks in the top 38 or 3 1sts and 2 3rds. Feltrin indicates he’ll think about it. Pick 38 belonged to Arizona. That tells me ARZ was likely offering pick 12 and 38 for pick 10, with maybe one of the Blues 3rds going the other way to even it out. Obviously it didn’t happen.

Army then starts to work on another option to move back. They say that if the next 2 picks are Leonard & Dvorsky, they’ll move back to 13. Dvorsky lasts to pick 10 so that nixes the deal. But it was BUF that had pick 13. So it likely would’ve been similar to the ARZ deal. 13 and 39 for 10.

In discussing Dvorsky in the pre-draft meetings, Feltrin says Dvorsky is one of the 7 guys he wouldn’t move off of and Vopat says he’d move up to get Dvorsky but also says he thinks there’s a chance Dvorsky lasts to 10. He nailed it. So they had Dvorsky in their top-7. Or at least their head scout did but that likely means he was top-7 in the final list as well. The comment that included Leonard likely indicates Leonard was also in that group of 7. All other comments about players in the pre-draft meetings didn’t have players names attached. Only when discussing the 3 they actually ended up picking on Day 1.

They gave a few seconds to Stenberg and Lindstein at the end. Nothing on Day 2 was covered. I would’ve liked to have seen more. Seemed rushed at the end.

In the end, I’m glad they got Dvorsky.

 

[Blanick]

Interesting view but nothing too earth shattering. Only 20 minutes. They apparently took 50 hours of video total so somewhat surprised they only made it 20 min.

Some notable things:

Army asks Feltrin if he’d rather have 4 picks in the top 38 or 3 1sts and 2 3rds. Feltrin indicates he’ll think about it. Pick 38 belonged to Arizona. That tells me ARZ was likely offering pick 12 and 38 for pick 10, with maybe one of the Blues 3rds going the other way to even it out. Obviously it didn’t happen.

Army then starts to work on another option to move back. They say that if the next 2 picks are Leonard & Dvorsky, they’ll move back to 13. Dvorsky lasts to pick 10 so that nixes the deal. But it was BUF that had pick 13. So it likely would’ve been similar to the ARZ deal. 13 and 39 for 10.

In discussing Dvorsky in the pre-draft meetings, Feltrin says Dvorsky is one of the 7 guys he wouldn’t move off of and Vopat says he’d move up to get Dvorsky but also says he thinks there’s a chance Dvorsky lasts to 10. He nailed it. So they had Dvorsky in their top-7. Or at least their head scout did but that likely means he was top-7 in the final list as well. The comment that included Leonard likely indicates Leonard was also in that group of 7. All other comments about players in the pre-draft meetings didn’t have players names attached. Only when discussing the 3 they actually ended up picking on Day 1.

They gave a few seconds to Stenberg and Lindstein at the end. Nothing on Day 2 was covered. I would’ve liked to have seen more. Seemed rushed at the end.

In the end, I’m glad they got Dvorsky.

I liked the comment about Stenberg and his leadership. Big Walt said something akin, "he drags his teammates into the fight."

My biggest takeaway is that the two qualities the Blues value most this draft is drive and character. They are looking for in house replacements to the Steen, Backes and ROR of the past.

 

[Spektre]

It's just interesting to see the trade talks. In true Army form at one point on the phone he said something like "I'm not telling anyone". He's always the keep everything close to the chest guy.

 

[STL fan in MN]

It's just interesting to see the trade talks. In true Army form at one point on the phone he said something like "I'm not telling anyone". He's always the keep everything close to the chest guy.

Well yeah. He was asking Yzerman there who they were picking before DET made the pick. So I’d assume Yzerman at first hesitated to release that piece of info until Army clarified he wouldn’t tell anyone and he just wanted to know so he could tell Buffalo if the deal to move back to 13 was on or off.

Quite the interesting trust factor some of these guys have with each other.

As NSH is heading up to take pick 24, Army tells him they want Stenberg. Poile responds that they’ll be taking Molendyk.

I would guess Army doesn’t trust all 31 fellow GMs equally, but clearly he has a strong bond of trust between Yzerman and Poile.

 

[DatDude44]

Well yeah. He was asking Yzerman there who they were picking before DET made the pick. So I’d assume Yzerman at first hesitated to release that piece of info until Army clarified he wouldn’t tell anyone and he just wanted to know so he could tell Buffalo if the deal to move back to 13 was on or off.

Quite the interesting trust factor some of these guys have with each other.

As NSH is heading up to take pick 24, Army tells him they want Stenberg. Poile responds that they’ll be taking Molendyk.

I would guess Army doesn’t trust all 31 fellow GMs equally, but clearly he has a strong bond of trust between Yzerman and Poile.

I’d say recent trade history further confirms that too. Larkin in a blue note soon? Lmao

 

[Johnny97]

Stancl on the Czechia roster for the U20 tournament later this month.

 

[Renard]

I was just pumping your tires on stenberg in this thread. thought you would get kick out of it.

My point on hofer isn’t that the posters are wrong about his projection. He is backup ready now and I think can be a starter. Some sharp posters voted for him. My point is that what we all think he will be isn’t as valuable as what we all think the forwards will be. And that is the discussion I think would be interesting to have, and we are at some level, the value of 15th best goalie versus quality 2nd line winger.

Rating prospects is educated guesswork. How highly rated was Mike Luit, after a college career at Bowling Green?

Goal is the most important position in hockey and a good prospect in goal is worth more than a good skater at another position, other things being equal.

 

[Renard]

I think the hope is that one of them surprises and exceeds expectations, with the bigger reality that the prospects we have will satisfy the depth needs of our future d-core, but the big question mark will be how does Faulk and Parayko age, and are we able to acquire a younger, but similar caliber type dman that is capable of playing top pair.

And hell, some of these guys might hit their higher ceiling, but it could be a Dunn situation, where they never get that opportunity here. Or even Walman. My hope is that we'll give younger guys a bigger opportunity now that we aren't contenders, but that's the other complexity, are these guys going to be a fit on the roster when they are aged 22-24.

I liked your post but I disagree about Dunn. He got plenty of ice time here. I just wish we had protected him in the draft.