Olympics: Bettman hints NHL won't play in 2018 and 2022

[TheTwelfth]

Let's put it this way - in Finland and Sweden, family income is high enough so that very few talented kids would be turned away from the opportunity to learn hockey for financial reasons. In Russia, Slovakia and the Czech Republic, that is not true. NHL transfer fees don't come anywhere close to funding broad-based, mass participation hockey programs.

Still a lot of parents that prefer their kids to play a cheaper sport. Football (soccer), team handball, basketball are all much cheaper options for most families. I think families that are not i) high middle class or ii) having a high hockey interest, will have trouble supporting even one kid playing ice hockey through minors.

 

[Yakushev72]

Still a lot of parents that prefer their kids to play a cheaper sport. Football (soccer), team handball, basketball are all much cheaper options for most families. I think families that are not i) high middle class or ii) having a high hockey interest, will have trouble supporting even one kid playing ice hockey through minors.

I absolutely agree. As far as I know, hockey is much more expensive than any other youth sport designed for mass participation.

 

[Jussi]

Let's put it this way - in Finland and Sweden, family income is high enough so that very few talented kids would be turned away from the opportunity to learn hockey for financial reasons. In Russia, Slovakia and the Czech Republic, that is not true. NHL transfer fees don't come anywhere close to funding broad-based, mass participation hockey programs.

I don't know about Sweden but in Finland the expenses have become a huge concern. Former goalie and current MP Sinuhe Wallinheimo has recently "warned" that in 10-20 years hockey is in a risk of becoming an upper class sport in Finland.

 

[Yakushev72]

I don't know about Sweden but in Finland the expenses have become a huge concern. Former goalie and current MP Sinuhe Wallinheimo has recently "warned" that in 10-20 years hockey is in a risk of becoming an upper class sport in Finland.

I don't know specifically about Finland, but I would say that that is likely true everywhere. From indoor ice to expensive equipment, the cost continues to rise.

 

[patnyrnyg]

This is what is wrong with hockey, this kind of decision should not be on one league, this should the international committee decide. In the long run it would be best for hockey if KHl become the biggest league, they dont stand in the way for the international teams.

In football (soccer), all league stops even for friendly games, but for NHL to stop one time every 4 years is a big deal.

However, I dont think we have heard the last word about it. It would be fun with both world cup and olympcis, so we get one of this tournament every second year.

Do the soccer leagues shut down for the Olympics? Do the best soccer players in the World go to the Olympics?

We will get a best-on-best international tourney, it will just be in the form of a World Cup. Last time I checked, the soccer world cup gets plenty of attention. Same could eventually happen with hockey. Obviously on a scaled down level as world-wide there just aren't enough national teams to compete at that level.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Don't kid yourself, the khl won't have any more viewers because of an NHL less Olympics. The NHL is watched Worldwide and it barely gains anything from an Olympics in terms of new fans. Rephrase it correctly. it's a better opportunity because it's the only way Russia can win in the Olympics. And even that, who in the sporting World would value Olympic Hockey without the NHL? It's probably a number multiplied by 0, the players that will be there certainly don't deserve the honor of being in the Olympics and being called an Olympian. They are not the best of the best which is what the Olympics is. Might as well make it a under 23 like fifa, at least you get the best prospects.

Pretty much. Just like those World Championships. Maybe Russia takes them seriously, but in North America, there are very few who care.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Its interesting that many Canadian posters will not accept the legitimacy of the title "World Champion" because they say that Canada sends a B team to the WC, but then refuse to acknowledge that the Soviets brought a B team to the 1976 Canada Cup, missing most of their best players - such as Kharlamov, Yakushev, Petrov, Mikhailov, Shadrin, Blinov, Kuzkin, Luchenko, Gusev and a number of other A teamers. I have to believe that the IIHF was either referring to the 1976 Canada Cup on its own merits, or they are even dumber and more incompetent than I thought.

The World Championship is a joke. I get it, you are a fan of Russia, and this is the only international tourney they can win.

 

[cutchemist42]

Some details about the World Cup, sucks to hear its an invitational again.

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2014/11/06/SMT-Conference/John-Collins.aspx

Still think the Olympics product sounds a lot better.

 

[habsrule4eva3089]

Some details about the World Cup, sucks to hear its an invitational again.

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2014/11/06/SMT-Conference/John-Collins.aspx

Still think the Olympics product sounds a lot better.

If the format is switched to an NHL surface rink, sure.

But the Sochi 2014 Olympic games presented the worst international Hockey tournament for a best on best in history. Most World Juniors are more exciting.

A World Cup will be 10000000x more exciting product then Sochi 2014, but the Olympics has prestige, history and meaning. The World Cup means squat. So perhaps it's time the IIHF comes to an agreement and make every Olympics NHL Surface so we can have perfection

 

[Urbanskog]

Pretty much. Just like those World Championships. Maybe Russia takes them seriously, but in North America, there are very few who care.

And not many outside North America care about this unsanctioned, invitational 8-team Canada Cup.

 

[Canuckistani]

Some details about the World Cup, sucks to hear its an invitational again.

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2014/11/06/SMT-Conference/John-Collins.aspx

Still think the Olympics product sounds a lot better.

Great to hear that the World Cup seems to be heading for a best-of-three final. The three-game finals of 1987 and 1996 were epic battles.

As far as qualification is concerned, why not just have the top-eight IIHF ranked teams?

Sweden, Finland, Russia, Canada, Czech Rep, USA, Switzerland and Slovakia seem the logical choices anyway.

 

[Canuckistani]

And not many outside North America care about this unsanctioned, invitational 8-team Canada Cup.

I seem to recall Finnish fans being pretty interested in their team's performance in 2004.

And needless to say, the best players (aside from several Russians) took it quite seriously.

 

[Canuckistani]

If the format is switched to an NHL surface rink, sure.

But the Sochi 2014 Olympic games presented the worst international Hockey tournament for a best on best in history.

Completely agree. The ice was bad, the scoring low.

Vancouver 2010 was easily the best tournament EVER (best-on-best or otherwise), followed IMO by the 1987 Canada Cup, 2002 SLC Olympics, and 1996 World Cup.

 

[xxxx]

If the format is switched to an NHL surface rink, sure.

But the Sochi 2014 Olympic games presented the worst international Hockey tournament for a best on best in history. Most World Juniors are more exciting.

A World Cup will be 10000000x more exciting product then Sochi 2014, but the Olympics has prestige, history and meaning. The World Cup means squat. So perhaps it's time the IIHF comes to an agreement and make every Olympics NHL Surface so we can have perfection

I agree, but I also think that the World Cup / Canada Cup has prestige and history too. And meaning. HF is relatively small sample size, so even though some people here don't like the idea of World Cup, I would bet that the majority of hockey fans around the world do like it. An average fan in Europe maybe won't get up at 1/2/3 a.m., but I'm sure that he would celebrate the victory as much as an olympic victory. The tournament is played by the simply best players in the world there, I can't even explain how stupid it sounds to me that somebody wouldn't care about it. I doubt that an "average" fan gives a damn if the tournament is organized by the NHL or the IIHF.

 

[TheTwelfth]

As far as qualification is concerned, why not just have the top-eight IIHF ranked teams?

Sweden, Finland, Russia, Canada, Czech Rep, USA, Switzerland and Slovakia seem the logical choices anyway.

So, after crapping all over the WHC, you want to use the rankings largely decided by said WHC?

I agree, but I also think that the World Cup / Canada Cup has prestige and history too. And meaning. HF is relatively small sample size, so even though some people here don't like the idea of World Cup, I would bet that the majority of hockey fans around the world do like it. An average fan in Europe maybe won't get up at 1/2/3 a.m., but I'm sure that he would celebrate the victory as much as an olympic victory. The tournament is played by the simply best players in the world there, I can't even explain how stupid it sounds to me that somebody wouldn't care about it. I doubt that an "average" fan gives a damn if the tournament is organized by the NHL or the IIHF.

Only Canadian fans would ever value World cup on the level with Olympics.

The big problem is with a single league arranging a tournament, that there will not be many teams participating if they can't get other leagues to join in. At the moment, I have trouble seeing why any league wants to join the NHL in defying the IIHF. Without the other leagues, there will only be 2 or 3 teams (depending on if the Swedish federation wants to be loyal to IIHF or not).

 

[Yakushev72]

Aside from the fact that a number of the World's best players may not participate in the first place, my question would have to be: will anyone in the world outside of Canada be aware that the World Cup is actually going on? For example, in the United States, will anyone other than the usual and very small contingent of hockey freaks bother to turn on their televisions (assuming that it is televised in the US) to watch hockey exhibitions in August and September? Will anyone in Europe outside of Sweden and Finland know or care whether the World Cup is taking place? Contrast that with the Olympic Games, where every television set in the USA is tuned in in February. Its not even close.

 

[Urbanskog]

I seem to recall Finnish fans being pretty interested in their team's performance in 2004.

And yet the same year's WHC had ratings multiple times higher.

 

[JackSlater]

The big problem is with a single league arranging a tournament, that there will not be many teams participating if they can't get other leagues to join in. At the moment, I have trouble seeing why any league wants to join the NHL in defying the IIHF. Without the other leagues, there will only be 2 or 3 teams (depending on if the Swedish federation wants to be loyal to IIHF or not).

The IIHF is part of the discussions, so no one is "defying" them. The IIHF has always been a part of the Canada/World Cups.

 

[Canuckistani]

So, after crapping all over the WHC

Which I didn't do. I believe the WHC features B/C squads and isn't valued as highly in North America as it is in Europe. Nothing inaccurate about that.

you want to use the rankings largely decided by said WHC?

The IIHF rankings are, IMO, accurate when it comes to who the top-eight are, but wrong on their exact order.

So accepting the IIHF ranking as a basis for World Cup teams allows for the top-eight to "qualify" while at the same time appeasing the Europeans who put great stock in everything the IIHF says and does. Win-win.

 

[Canuckistani]

And yet the same year's WHC had ratings multiple times higher.

Great. So they can watch both.

 

[Canuckistani]

Aside from the fact that a number of the World's best players may not participate in the first place

There will be more of the best at the World Cup than at any WHC, of that you can be sure.

will anyone in the world outside of Canada be aware that the World Cup is actually going on?

The best players will know. If "fans" don't care because its not put on by the shootout-mongers of the IIHF then that's their problem.

If the NHL is smart they'll opt for both the World Cup and the Olympics. But they have to make business decisions based on the both money and growth. Will the game catch on in South Korea? Probably not. Hockey in Asia didn't grow after Nagano and isn't likely to do so outside of where it's already played. Parts of the US, Switzerland, Germany, the Baltics - not much growth to be had outside of there.

 

[Urbanskog]

I can already see Germany getting the 8th place instead of Switzerland since the NHL probably hasn't noticed that Switzerland has surpassed them.

 

[Canuckistani]

I can already see Germany getting the 8th place instead of Switzerland since the NHL probably hasn't noticed that Switzerland has surpassed them.

Nah, I can't see the NHL being that dumb (although they have surprised me in that regard before).

Surely they must know from the Olympics in 2006 (wins over Czech, Canada), 2010 (shootout vs Canada, close loss to USA) and the 2013 WHC (silver) that Switzerland has moved well past the Germans and arguably ahead of Slovakia in terms of performance if not talent.

 

[xxxx]

Aside from the fact that a number of the World's best players may not participate in the first place,

What players?

my question would have to be: will anyone in the world outside of Canada be aware that the World Cup is actually going on? For example, in the United States, will anyone other than the usual and very small contingent of hockey freaks bother to turn on their televisions (assuming that it is televised in the US) to watch hockey exhibitions in August and September? Will anyone in Europe outside of Sweden and Finland know or care whether the World Cup is taking place? Contrast that with the Olympic Games, where every television set in the USA is tuned in in February. Its not even close.

No one and no body in the USA/Canada, outside TSN (maybe CNBC) and a few people, give a damn about the world championships in Europe, but that doesn't discredit the tournament for you, right?

 

[xxxx]

So, after crapping all over the WHC, you want to use the rankings largely decided by said WHC?



Only Canadian fans would ever value World cup on the level with Olympics.

If you think that no one outside Canada values the WC the same as the olympics, you are delusional. Second, it's a best-on-best tournament, why should I value it less? Because it doesn't get the attention around the world as the olympics? That doesn't make sense.

The big problem is with a single league arranging a tournament, that there will not be many teams participating if they can't get other leagues to join in. At the moment, I have trouble seeing why any league wants to join the NHL in defying the IIHF. Without the other leagues, there will only be 2 or 3 teams (depending on if the Swedish federation wants to be loyal to IIHF or not).

I have seen no sign yet that would support this opinion, yet I have seen many people claim this, without anything to support it.

The IIHF is part of the discussions, so no one is "defying" them. The IIHF has always been a part of the Canada/World Cups.

Yep.