i've run the numbers and a good volume, successful brewpub will make the owners a boatload of money.
costs you over $2/litre to make. and you sell it in house for $15/litre.
OT: Beer Thread
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i've run the numbers and a good volume, successful brewpub will make the owners a boatload of money.
costs you over $2/litre to make. and you sell it in house for $15/litre.
- Mar 10, 2010
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Is the Cost of sales for brewed product about 8%? Whoops sorry I see you were reflecting approximately 13% which is still incredible. Have to recapture that cost of equipment somehow.
ya lost me with your question and the %.
beer's a volume business. you brew a minimum of 800 litre batches and your biggest worries are:
rent (in wpg? who cares!)
spoilage/drainpours
staffing
time for building/opening (see: PEG as what scares the crap out of me)
moving your volume
if you have a brewpub that seats 50+ people, and you have a patio for the 2 months of summer wpg has (*snicker*) and you have a bottle shop, if you aim to have the brewpub at 60% capacity most of the time and have decent movement from your bottle shop, you're doing pretty well.
a certain toronto brewery's bottle shop closed last week because it ran out beer to sell. this is a brewery that brews 800 litre batches and is very efficient. they can't keep beer on the shelf.
not everyone's going to be blessed like that. but i look at Half Pints and always wondered about their horrible location and their ugly-as-sin bottle shop. invest some $$ and make people want to drop by and have a drink and you'll increase your sales. or open up something closer to downtown or non-st james residential. took them long enough to do that reno.
anyways, in order to open a good-sized brewery, you need investors or cash or assets for a bank loan. guestimate getting one open for $500K (really tough to do) or, more likely, closer to $1 million.
nobody important
the pessimist returns
PEG has this up on their web site:
Well we’ve all been patiently waiting for beer and after considerable delays on a few fronts we are hoping to be brewing within a week or two. Some of the brewing ingredients are already on their way. So when we say very soon we really do mean it.
Trouble is, this was posted two months ago!
Maybe they should edit it to read...
When we say very soon we really mean maybe by Christmas.
- Mar 10, 2010
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My apologies for my confusing question.
You make intesting points about the type of establishment and what you are describing. I will need to emerce myself into this at at some point. The old school brew pubs I new of in the 90's use to do next to zero off premiss sales it as almost 100% sold in house. Sounds like the newer models are much more a blended brewery for off premiss sales (MLC, retail store, wholesaler to other pubs, other, etc?) and on premiss sales within the 4 walls.
The tax credit I was talking about was literally tax credit back to investors (who qualify) for 45% of their investment. In other words investor puts $100,000 into your "new" brew pub and gets a tax credit for $45,000. Net impact to investor $55,000 while business receives full benefit of $100,000. To be clear this was the ratio the person was talking to me about but the details were lacking so I need to follow up to find out which investors qualify and why? On the surface it sounds too good to be true but the guy I know that was chatting with me about it is not a bull ****ter however there is a possibility he is confused about the intricacies of the tax program.
Raising the cash is possible if the business plan is viable and your returns to investors reflect the risk. I have allot more to say on this part but don't want to bore the hell out of everyone.
I have never heard of half pints I may swing by to check it out.
i know little about the Manitoba liquor sales laws or tax credits. only Ontario.
i've heard there are some tax credits in Manitoba, but there also are huge hoops you need to jump through re: licensing. so apparently that's why PEG had a half year delay.
but ideally, you have sales numbers that are primarily a mix between in-house sales (where your expense is staff and rent per square foot) and takeaway bottle sales (where your expense is a bottling line). keg sales to bars (i.e. Torque's model) or the LC should be the least of your priority because, profit-wise, that's a lot less per unit. where guys like Half Pints are making money is by brewing 2-3x the volume of a brewpub. costs you the same labour hours, more or less, to brew more volume. so you make $$ in sales. i would rather have in-house sales and a takeaway bottle shop and have smaller volumes than worry about making lower margins off of LC sales, employing sales teams, shipping kegs, etc.
now, my model works well in cities like Toronto or Calgary or Vancouver. Winnipeg's a different beast. for example, if i opened a brewpub near MTS centre, would there be any takeaway sales? likely not. would be better served on Corydon or somewhere in Wollesly
nobody important
the pessimist returns
Back in July, Ben with the TLDR last name in the Freep reported "there’s a persistent rumour Alberta’s Big Rock brewery has been sniffing around, looking to open a brew pub... perhaps at the Masonic Temple downtown". Personally, always thought that would be a cool spot to have a brewpub. Lots of fun ghostly names for the beers. But Big Rock? Meh.
ps241, not trying to be a jerk or anything, but I'm really surprised to hear that a beer drinker in this city would never have heard of Half Pints.
- Mar 10, 2010
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zero offense taken.......I have kids 4 and 7 so unless they were open before 2008 given their location there is zero chance I would have got out there. To be honest I am just spreading my wings more now as a beer drinker.
- Mar 10, 2010
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Yea as a customer they were in the other end of town so I just wouldn't have strayed that far.
Half Pints is making some changes and doing renos, still in St James though
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/arts-and-life/food/whats-on-tap-388733741.html
nobody important
the pessimist returns
Then fly little white dove, fly. Sorry, hope I didn't give anyone an earworm.
On the topic of beers to try, LC has a new arrival from Germany, Hacker-Pschorr Munich Gold. It's a strong Helles style, more malty, less hoppy than a German Pils. I think it's just outstanding, and I'm going to be buying it on a regular basis.
Repoman
Registered User
No- they can't be bought just the red lights for $185.00
Glasses only available with purchase or one free glass if you were part of the giant Budweiser light getting your name engraved.
Bud is giving away a half million glasses. It is actually pretty good quality.
http://www.marketingmag.ca/brands/bottoms-up-budweiser-introduces-a-red-light-glass-182620
but....if you're watching the game, do you need a stein (not the best drinking vessel) that lights up to tell you there's a goal? does it actually tell you in real time or is there a delay?
that's a lot of $$ for a beer mug. good luck, friend, in drinking that Bud
that's a lot of $$ for a beer mug. good luck, friend, in drinking that Bud
Repoman
Registered User
but....if you're watching the game, do you need a stein (not the best drinking vessel) that lights up to tell you there's a goal? does it actually tell you in real time or is there a delay?
that's a lot of $$ for a beer mug. good luck, friend, in drinking that Bud
That's the problem... Now if they came with a 6 pack that might be another story. I'd like to get at least one glass. Not sure how well they work either, hopefully there is not a huge delay.
nobody important
the pessimist returns
but....if you're watching the game, do you need a stein (not the best drinking vessel) that lights up to tell you there's a goal? does it actually tell you in real time or is there a delay?
that's a lot of $$ for a beer mug. good luck, friend, in drinking that Bud
Could always use it for beer can chicken.
nobody important
the pessimist returns
you concoct, bro?
i'm making a IIPA for Thanksgiving. using Escarpment's Vermont ale yeast (i.e. the Alchemists' strain, which is fickle as hell). will be 12.5 wheat flakes. might sub in some flaked rye with that % just for the hell of it. the rest is Pearl. using 7C to bitter. 7.5% abv is the target
nobody important
the pessimist returns
Since I've started, might as well take you through my brew day.
Mash done, time to runoff the wort and rinse the grains (sparge). This is the nicely set grain bed which filters the wort...
View attachment 91767
... to produce nice, clear runoff.
View attachment 91769
Then, into my electric boil kettle.
View attachment 91771
Mash done, time to runoff the wort and rinse the grains (sparge). This is the nicely set grain bed which filters the wort...
View attachment 91767
... to produce nice, clear runoff.
View attachment 91769
Then, into my electric boil kettle.
View attachment 91771
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nobody important
the pessimist returns
nobody important
the pessimist returns
Nah, tried a decoction once. Just made a long brew day even longer.
Nothing like sailing the 7 C's. Someone on line thinks it's a blend of Cascade, Centennial, Chinook, Citra, Cluster, Columbus and Crystal. Should be yummy.
Mine's a Helles-ish attempt to give my new fermentation freezer a go. Pils, honey malt, Motueka hops, S-189 yeast.
lol. loaded question.
pardon the pun.
i had a Black Tuesday 2 weeks ago. 19%. was delicious.
Oerbier and Oerbier Reserva are also amazing.
Black Albert's a very good imperial stout.
in Ontario, Bring Out Your Dead is great.
Dragon's Milk is a nice beer to get when available from Michigan. For $10/750 mL and high abv, you get nice barrel character.
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