Auston Matthews back to back hat tricks

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"Jesus Christ, man. I’m not parsing all of that to respond when all of it is just trying to make the same point."
-> Aka you are unwilling to prove your assertion wrong. Answering those questions will either prove you completely wrong (which you don't seem to want to do), or they will make you look ridiculous, and we can start looking into discussing those responses.

"I can’t remember a time when 50 goal seasons or 60 goal seasons or 300 goals in under 500 games wasn’t historically special in the NHL. But you do you."
->You claimed that adjusting for era is nonsense, and I showed you a bunch of players that point and goal wise (in a raw perspective) had 60 goal seasons (or better), and way better point seasons. I personally think that Matthews peaked higher than most of the players that I listed, but based on your raw stat belief, you'd have to agree that he DIDN'T.

Anyways, if you're not willing to discuss in good faith (ie. back up the ridiculous claims you're making), I'll let you soak in your ignorance.

I did back up my claims, 50 goal seasons have always been special in the NHL, regardless of era. 50 goals in 50 games has always been special in the NHL. 60 goal seasons have always been special in the NHL.

Scoring 300 goals as fast as Matthews has is …. Special in the NHL


How you could call anything I’ve said ‘ridiculous’ is actually the ignorance in the convo.
 
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I did back up my claims, 50 goal seasons have always been special in the NHL, regardless of era. 50 goals in 50 games has always been special in the NHL. 60 goal seasons have always been special in the NHL.

Scoring 300 goals as fast as Matthews has is …. Special in the NHL


How you could call anything I’ve said ‘ridiculous’ is actually the ignorance in the convo.

It’s especially ridiculous because the difference in their eras is less than .1 goals per game and Ovechkin plays twice as much on the powerplay :laugh:
 
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It’s especially ridiculous because the difference in their eras is less than .1 goals per game and Ovechkin plays twice as much on the powerplay :laugh:

When you start down this road of adjusting stats, it just gets so far off the point of stats that what you end up with doesn’t relate to actual reality anymore.

You start counting up goals per second on the ice, you start finding medians of penalty kill time and subtracting that (well of course, because you don’t usually score on the penalty kill, unless you’re gretzky but people smoked back then so we won’t count any of those), and then you need to take the median of the last 100 years of hockey, find the middle of thousands of goals scored per game, and then use that as a baseline hypothetical season.

Then you can start handing out 0.02 of a goal because of who the line mates were or weren’t, matthews plays with Marner and Ovechkin didn’t have a great center one or two seasons, so obviously those Ovechkin goals are worth 1.17 goals and matthews are only worth 0.87 of a goal.

And then one season there were 4.85 goals per game, and that’s higher than 4.30 goals per game, so subtract another 0.55 from matthews, so really matthews goals are only worth 0.32 and you need to add 0.17 goals for Ovechkin because of a higher scoring season and now every Ovechkin goal is really 1.75 of a matthews goal, and don’t even mention gretzky because Ovechkin adjusted has scored 85% of what gretzky actually scored and that’s good enough because we all know Bobby hull was out of shape as was Bure , just like the rest of the league and Lemieux smoked in the locker room. And some guys were plumbers or whatever during the off season, so take goals off for that.

Basically what I’m trying to say is that Ovechkin is the greatest goal scorer of all time even though adjusted as much as I want I can still only get to 80% of gretzky and matthews is a scrub and he’s really only scored 23 goals in 500 games and makes ninety-billion dollars on the cap and Stutzle is a much better choice, it’s too bad the sens have all that cap room and the leafs can only ice 4 players a game.

I’ll link you to the google doc with all my spreadsheets, and you can check my work. Trust the science, bro. I did the math, matthews and gretzky goals just aren’t the same. Ovechkin had to score goals walking up hill in the snow both ways.
 
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I'm the first person to knock down AM and anything leafs related...

But gotta give credit, off to an insane start to the season
 
No it's not alike, because in his best goal scoring season, Crosby didn't come close (51) to Ovy's best total (65), while getting fewer assists (58) than his best seasons (84, 78, 68, 65 ect).

McDavid beat (64) Matthews' best goal scoring season (60) while also getting the most assists in his career (89 vs 79, 75, 72, ect).

Crosby sacrificed some playmaking to get to 51, while McDavid didn't. If he did, he would've gotten more than 64.

Goalscoring is indeed more than goals scored, but I understand why you would want to avoid context and keep it reductive as possible.

Matthews is also far more reliant on his teammates for shot creation than McDavid is.
60 goals in 73 games is more impressive than 64 in 82 i feel like that is pretty important context that you are avoiding
 
60 goals in 73 games is more impressive than 64 in 82 i feel like that is pretty important context that you are avoiding

It’s not. If you want further context, McDavid hit 60 in 72 games and then focused on getting his teammates to their personal milestones during the last 10 games, while still potting more raw goals in a single season and handing out more assists than Matthews had total points.

5 goals in 2 regular season games for Matthews so far. Very impressive of course. That’s as many as he’s had in his last 12 playoff games. Sounds about right.
 
Insane seeing people be even mildly upset at the notion of Matthews winning the Rocket - he had 60 in 73 games in the '21-22 season, I'd say he's the favorite to take the award this season.
 
It’s not. If you want further context, McDavid hit 60 in 72 games and then focused on getting his teammates to their personal milestones during the last 10 games, while still potting more raw goals in a single season and handing out more assists than Matthews had total points.

5 goals in 2 regular season games for Matthews so far. Very impressive of course. That’s as many as he’s had in his last 12 playoff games. Sounds about right.

Some of the shit you'll read on these boards man...this just sounds like a fantasy/fairytale lol, don't have to diminish one's season to boost the other.
 
Some of the shit you'll read on these boards man...this just sounds like a fantasy/fairytale lol, don't have to diminish one's season to boost the other.

I watched the games live. It’s literally what happened. His focus shifted from scoring goals and getting his 60 to helping teammates like Draisaitl, Kane, Nugent-Hopkins hit various marks like 50 goals, 300 career goals, 100 points, etc, before he potted his own 300th goal to take the spotlight back to himself. If one watched the games, it was plain as day.

And when I’m replying to someone saying that 60 in 73 is more impressive than 64 in 82 and preaches about context, yes, I actually do have to provide further context.
 
I watched the games live. It’s literally what happened. His focus shifted from scoring goals and getting his 60 to helping teammates like Draisaitl, Kane, Nugent-Hopkins hit various marks like 50 goals, 300 career goals, 100 points, etc, before he potted his own 300th goal to take the spotlight back to himself. If one watched the games, it was plain as day.

And when I’m replying to someone saying that 60 in 73 is more impressive than 64 in 82 and preaches about context, yes, I actually do have to provide further context.

Yes, McDavid turned down free goals to help him team lose.

Get real. McDavid won't turn down a free goal if it meant sprinting full speed for the empty netter up 6.

Matthews scored more goals in fewer games on goalies.
 
It’s not. If you want further context, McDavid hit 60 in 72 games and then focused on getting his teammates to their personal milestones during the last 10 games, while still potting more raw goals in a single season and handing out more assists than Matthews had total points.

5 goals in 2 regular season games for Matthews so far. Very impressive of course. That’s as many as he’s had in his last 12 playoff games. Sounds about right.
Nice narrative you invented. It is in fact more impressive however.
 
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