ATD 2017 Draft Thread II

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BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
31,059
13,987
Was strongly considering Marty Barry, along with Mike Modano and another center, hoping to create a 1-2 two-way punch down the middle with Bryan Trottier.Lafayette just made my choice easier.

Is Marty Barry on the LW acceptable (like say Zetterberg)? I considered this option earlier this week.
 

markrander87

Registered User
Jan 22, 2010
4,216
62
Was strongly considering Marty Barry, along with Mike Modano and another center, hoping to create a 1-2 two-way punch down the middle with Bryan Trottier.Lafayette just made my choice easier.

Is Marty Barry on the LW acceptable (like say Zetterberg)? I considered this option earlier this week.

I'm not sure, but I don't think too many GM's realized he did spend some time at LW as well. We plan on playing him at C but this time on LW could have definitely impacted his AS voting for C.
 

Ben Grimm

Smells like teen spirit 🥗
Dec 10, 2007
25,050
6,251
G Clint Benedict

benedict.jpg


Many fans today automatically assume Georges Vezina was the first great goaltender, after all his name lives on with the trophy that honours the best goalie in the NHL each year. But many would argue Clint Benedict of the Ottawa Senators and later the Montreal Maroons was the better netminder. And if it were not for Vezina's tragic death, goalies today could very well be dreaming of winning a Benedict Trophy.

Yet you would be hard pressed to find a fan who knows who "Praying Bennie" was.

Clint Benedict greatly influenced goaltending as we know it. He was responsible for a significant rule change that allowed goalies to leave their feet to stop the puck. Originally, and unthinkable to today's fans, goalies would be given a 2 minute penalty for falling on the ice to make a save. But Benedict made an art out of the accidental fall on the puck, admitting that "if you did it a bit sneaky and made it look accidental, you could fall on the puck without being penalized." These comments made NHL rule makers aware of the problem and from that point on goaltenders were allowed to fall to the ice to stop pucks. He spent so much time on the ice he quickly earned the nickname Praying Bennie!

Also influencing the position was his rudimentary mask. Jacques Plante is inaccurately portrayed as the first goalie to wear a mask. While Plante was the first to regularly wear one, Clint Benedict was the first to wear a mask in a game. Benedict was hit in the nose by a rifle-like shot by Howie Morenz. Benedict wore a tailor made mask in an attempt to protect the wound, but after just one game, a 2-1 loss against Chicago, with the leather mask he decided not to wear as he felt it obstructed his vision and would lead to more losses.

Born in Ottawa in 1892, he played for 17 seasons, four of which were on Stanley Cup winning teams -- three with the Ottawa Senators and one with the Montreal Maroons.

Born in Ottawa in 1892, Clint Benedict would star with the original Senators. He apprenticed for 5 seasons with the Sens in the National Hockey Association, the forerunner to the NHL, guiding his team to an unsuccessful Stanley Cup appearance in 1915. An equally notable lacrosse player, Benedict was a solid goaltender on the verge of stardom. Wearing his trademark cricket-style leg pads that he would wear beyond Pop Kenesky's creation of the modern goalie pads, the ill tempered Benedict was already establishing himself with opponents as an unfriendly and combative foe.

Benedict reached his prime as the Senators joined the newly minted National Hockey League. Led by the goaltending of Benedict, superstars Cy Denneny and Frank Nighbor, and the clutch playoff scoring of Jack Darragh, the Senators were the NHL's first dynasty, winning three Stanley Cups in the four seasons between 1920 and 1923.

Based on the rudimentary statistics of the era, Benedict was undisputedly the NHL's top goalie. He led the NHL in wins in 6 of the 7 seasons with Senators, and lead or shared the lead in shutouts and GAA in each of those 7 seasons. In fact, in his most impressive season (in 1919-20) his 2.66 goals-against mark was 2.13 goals better than the league average. However there was no such thing as a Vezina trophy back then to honour the best goalie each season. Under the original Vezina trophy rules of best GAA, Benedict would have had owned the trophy.

In October 1924, the cash-strapped Senators sold off Benedict and scoring ace Punch Broadbent to the Montreal Maroons in exchange solely for cash. His six seasons with the weaker Maroons were not quite as dominant statistically, yet he was honoured as Montreal's best player upon his arrival. A year later in 1926, Benedict, with a puny 0.75 GAA, led the Maroons to the Stanley Cup, giving him the the distinction of being the first netminder to backstop two different NHL teams to Stanley Cup championships.

Clint Benedict was enshrined in the Hockey Hall of Fame in 1965, two decades after Georges Vezina and Charlie Gardner, the two goalies among the original 12 inductees. Benedict himself suggested this was a blatant example of how political the hockey world can be, for some reason the powers that be kept Benedict out of the Hall, instead inducting the very worthy Hugh Lehman, Percy LeSueur and George Hainsworth as Hall of Fame goaltenders before finally inducting Benedict.
http://www.greatesthockeylegends.com/2014/06/praying-bennie-clint-benedict.html
 

markrander87

Registered User
Jan 22, 2010
4,216
62
Random thought of the day.........

What are everyone's thoughts on adding on to the VsX numbers to also include those 7 or 10 seasons compared to number 2 on that players team in scoring as well.

Is it that impressive if a player has a 87 VsX score but is routinely 3-4th on their own team in scoring for example. To me a guy who have poor teammates and had a VsX score of 84 is a lot more impressive then a player with a VsX score of 88 but had much better teammates to play with.
 

jarek

Registered User
Aug 15, 2009
10,004
238
I was hoping to do some more research for this pick but alas, I'm at work.

Drew Doughty, D

The Norris win for him last year was huge.

Record stands at 1, 2, 3, 6, 9, 10, with a strong playoff resume.

Bonus that he has a good chance of adding some more to his resume this year.

PM'ing next.
 

seventieslord

Student Of The Game
Mar 16, 2006
36,373
7,712
Regina, SK
Random thought of the day.........

What are everyone's thoughts on adding on to the VsX numbers to also include those 7 or 10 seasons compared to number 2 on that players team in scoring as well.

Is it that impressive if a player has a 87 VsX score but is routinely 3-4th on their own team in scoring for example. To me a guy who have poor teammates and had a VsX score of 84 is a lot more impressive then a player with a VsX score of 88 but had much better teammates to play with.

Everyone is free to pimp their players and teams however they like, and everyone is free to value the information provided as they see fit. I, for one, have always been a strong advocate for considering the team situation a player had, particularly when discussing offensive totals.

Like I always say, a guy who scores 80 points with a 100 point linemate is not the same as a guy who scores 80 with a 60 point linemate. VsX is a starting point but there are many things to consider beyond it.
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
31,059
13,987
I was hoping to do some more research for this pick but alas, I'm at work.

Drew Doughty, D

The Norris win for him last year was huge.

Record stands at 1, 2, 3, 6, 9, 10, with a strong playoff resume.

Bonus that he has a good chance of adding some more to his resume this year.

PM'ing next.

Doughty is fine at this point, I vaguely looked into him recently and was surprised at how good he looked.Not sure if he is the best D available, but he is getting in that range for sure, especially considering he's the 2nd greatest defenseman playoff performer of his generation (after Keith).
 

Iceman

Registered User
Jun 9, 2014
10,648
2,043
I was hoping to do some more research for this pick but alas, I'm at work.

Drew Doughty, D

The Norris win for him last year was huge.

Record stands at 1, 2, 3, 6, 9, 10, with a strong playoff resume.

Bonus that he has a good chance of adding some more to his resume this year.

PM'ing next.

This year? Not so sure about that. In the future? Without a doubt.

He might get a couple of Norris votes based on who he is though.

I like the pick but I personally have a tough time placing him in an all time sense. Who are his comparable all time? Both in terms of career value and skillset. What speaks for him is that he doesn't necessarily have any major weaknesses but I wouldn't rely too much on him for contributing on the PP.
 

BenchBrawl

Registered User
Jul 26, 2010
31,059
13,987
Everyone is free to pimp their players and teams however they like, and everyone is free to value the information provided as they see fit. I, for one, have always been a strong advocate for considering the team situation a player had, particularly when discussing offensive totals.

Like I always say, a guy who scores 80 points with a 100 point linemate is not the same as a guy who scores 80 with a 60 point linemate. VsX is a starting point but there are many things to consider beyond it.

I agree, VsX is nice for a quick check-up but it's not the last word on offense.To add to your exemple, a player who scored 80 points in 80 games is not the same as a guy who scored 80 points in 60 games (which is ignored by VsX).All of this should be considered, along with teammates, linemates, team system, etc...
 

jarek

Registered User
Aug 15, 2009
10,004
238
For me, Doughty was the BDA.

The other 3 guys I was looking at after Siebert all have comparable, maybe even slightly better AS records.. but they all did it in the O6 era. One of them was a "war guy". Everything meaningful he did came right after the war.

And none of them have anything on Doughty in the playoffs.

We probably won't use him on the PP, he isn't a stellar offensive defenseman, he was just the best value at D that I could see.
 

seventieslord

Student Of The Game
Mar 16, 2006
36,373
7,712
Regina, SK
I agree, VsX is nice for a quick check-up but it's not the last word on offense.To add to your exemple, a player who scored 80 points in 80 games is not the same as a guy who scored 80 points in 60 games (which is ignored by VsX).All of this should be considered, along with teammates, linemates, team system, etc...

Absolutely right.
 

Hawkey Town 18

Registered User
Jun 29, 2009
8,263
1,656
Chicago, IL
OP updated, people that traded please check to make sure everything is right


Fun fact...more than half of the picks this round have been traded
 

PatrikOverAuston

Laine > Matthews
Jun 22, 2016
3,573
989
Winnipeg

:handclap: So psyched to get this guy! Ranked 12th in the History of Hockey project rankings, that means in a 25-team draft, Benedict was the last remaining goalie clearly in the top half of starters. He went 30 picks later than last year, and we simply couldn't risk waiting another to go by without getting him for ourselves.

Our starting six has shaped up quite nicely thanks to Wrigley's patience and guidance:


Firsov-Clarke-Conacher
Fetisov-Kasatonov
Benedict

Onto our second units! :yo:
 

tony d

New poll series coming from me in June
Jun 23, 2007
76,697
4,607
Behind A Tree
Some thoughts on recent picks:

Gilbert Perreault: Was scouting for 2nd line centres yesterday and this was a name at the top of my list, solid pick.

Turk Broda: Decent goalie, might not have been the best available when you picked but still in that 11-15 range of all time great goalies.

Adam Oates: Wasn't on my radar this time but that was more because I had him 1 year than anything else, still a solid player. Schmidt-Oates down the middle is pretty good Leaf.

Sergei Zubov: A good player as well, I've always found him un-appreciated. He'll do good on a team with Gretzky and Luc Robitaille.

Babe Seiebert: Don't know much about him to be honest but I think he's going to be a good player.

Marty Barry: The 1st name at the top of my list for 2nd line centres when I went to bed last night, very good pick.

Mike Modano: Another name on my list last night, he was a good player who much like Steve Yzerman didn't become a good 2 way centre until later in his career.

Charlie Gardiner: Another goalie in my 11-15 range, solid player.

Clint Benedict: My goalie from 2015. The best of the goalies took over the past day. A guy worth trading up for.

Drew Doughty: Good pick, he went up 47 spots this year, guy is still doing relatively well in real life despite his team not doing so hot this year.

Patrick Kane: He went up 2 spots this year despite winning the Hart Trophy and Art Ross last year, very good pick. I'm not much on modern players in this environment but Kane should have went higher.

Anyways those are my thoughts on recent picks. I'm headed out around 1:30 PM EST for an hour, Hawkey town has my list for 162 and I pick again at 164. I'll make pick 164 as I should be gone only an hour but if 162 comes up when I'm gone Hawkey can make the pick.
 

JFA87-66-99

Registered User
Jun 12, 2007
2,923
31
USA
I was hoping to do some more research for this pick but alas, I'm at work.

Drew Doughty, D

The Norris win for him last year was huge.

Record stands at 1, 2, 3, 6, 9, 10, with a strong playoff resume.

Bonus that he has a good chance of adding some more to his resume this year.

PM'ing next.

I was considering Doughty/Siebert for a long-time. I think Doughty is a great pick at this point in the draft.
 

JFA87-66-99

Registered User
Jun 12, 2007
2,923
31
USA
:handclap: So psyched to get this guy! Ranked 12th in the History of Hockey project rankings, that means in a 25-team draft, Benedict was the last remaining goalie clearly in the top half of starters. He went 30 picks later than last year, and we simply couldn't risk waiting another to go by without getting him for ourselves.

Our starting six has shaped up quite nicely thanks to Wrigley's patience and guidance:


Firsov-Clarke-Conacher
Fetisov-Kasatonov
Benedict

Onto our second units! :yo:

Is Benedict the guy you wanted to trade up for? I was also thinking Gardiner/Benedict. How do you guys think C. Benedict compares to G. Vezina?
 

King Forsberg

16 21 28 44 68 88 93
Jul 26, 2010
6,192
59
I'm truly torn on what to do. There's several players that I feel like would be good picks and I'd be more than happy with but then there's some bold picks I think I could make that would set my team up great if I get the exact right players later but if I don't then my team will suffer. I'll have a pick shortly one way or the other.
 

Sturminator

Love is a duel
Feb 27, 2002
9,894
1,070
West Egg, New York
Mike Modano: Another name on my list last night, he was a good player who much like Steve Yzerman didn't become a good 2 way centre until later in his career.

Kinda sorta. Like Yzerman, Mo's scoring numbers are a bit underrated due to how much time he spent as by far the best offensive player on his team, and they both did transition to more two-way roles after coaching changes. Peak two-way Modano appeared at the age of 26, however, while Yzerman didn't really enter that phase of his career until he was 30, and no longer even the best forward on his own team. Modano in his prime was also just plain better defensively than Yzerman ever was, and had more defensive responsibilities (Fedorov often checking other teams' top offensive threats), while prime offensive Yzerman was far better than Modano ever was.

There are some similarities, but just as many differences, imo. Defensive ability is a much bigger part of Mo's legacy.

Patrick Kane: He went up 2 spots this year despite winning the Hart Trophy and Art Ross last year, very good pick. I'm not much on modern players in this environment but Kane should have went higher.

Kane probably went a bit early last year, though.
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,903
3,561
Edmonton
Is Benedict the guy you wanted to trade up for? I was also thinking Gardiner/Benedict. How do you guys think C. Benedict compares to G. Vezina?

I'll fire the first shot, Benedict's fame is largely driven by team statistics. Numerous first hand sources show Vezina was even more highly thought of than Benedict before his death.
 

seventieslord

Student Of The Game
Mar 16, 2006
36,373
7,712
Regina, SK
I'll fire the first shot, Benedict's fame is largely driven by team statistics. Numerous first hand sources show Vezina was even more highly thought of than Benedict before his death.

You're absolutely right about the first part, but it doesn't automatically follow that Benedict was a team product, that he wasn't the best goalie available, or that he shouldn't be drafted around now.
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,903
3,561
Edmonton
You're absolutely right about the first part, but it doesn't automatically follow that Benedict was a team product, that he wasn't the best goalie available, or that he shouldn't be drafted around now.

I don't disagree that this is the right spot to draft him at all, and don't mean to just call him a team product. I'm just saying that Vezina compares favourably to Benedict
 

King Forsberg

16 21 28 44 68 88 93
Jul 26, 2010
6,192
59
Pick 160

After much deliberation, Im going to take František Pospíšil, D. I'm not sure if I want to seperate Leetch and MacInnis yet but Pospíšil can either play on the top pairing with MacInnis or he can be he the lead on my second paring. Either way he'll add some more leadership and clean physical play to the backend.

2x WC Best Defenseman
3x WC All-Star Team
2x Czech Player of the Year

frantisek-pospisil1.jpg
 
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