As a fan what is your "Realistic" expectation for next season? What you want?

[Gabriel426]

I think the Leafs will be great in the regular season even if Murray and Samsonov played okay.
It is playoffs that will determine the success of the team. Past history certainly is not showing any indications that they can get it done. Will they be like the Bulls who just can’t win or will they finally be able to win a round.
What most likely going to happen is either they get knocked out again in round one or they win round one and everyone thought they done it, the slayed the demons and get swept in round 2. Then the discussions here would be something like be thankful we made pass the first round Vs they choked again….. which in a way is a much better discussions than they played great but couldn’t advance due to whatever reasons Vs they players couldn’t get it done.
The goal is to win the Cup and not the first round.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I think the Leafs will be great in the regular season even if Murray and Samsonov played okay.
It is playoffs that will determine the success of the team. Past history certainly is not showing any indications that they can get it done. Will they be like the Bulls who just can’t win or will they finally be able to win a round.
What most likely going to happen is either they get knocked out again in round one or they win round one and everyone thought they done it, the slayed the demons and get swept in round 2. Then the discussions here would be something like be thankful we made pass the first round Vs they choked again….. which in a way is a much better discussions than they played great but couldn’t advance due to whatever reasons Vs they players couldn’t get it done.
The goal is to win the Cup and not the first round.

Luckily the past does not dictate the future. Our playoff history is awful, we all know that but I'm starting to recover from our most recent loss and I resolve to at least try to focus on the positive going forward, the season will be a lot more enjoyable that way. And there is lots of positives to focus on, all one has to do is choose to do so. And isn't that why we watch, for the enjoyment of it?

Last I checked, only COL is given a better chance than us at winning the cup. Spare me the "wisdom" of how the Vegas odds don't aren't an accurate representation of our chances to win, I'm very familiar with how betting lines work and believe me, they're close enough to the truth to indicate that there is no question that we are one of the top contenders.

We have arguably the best player in the world who is IMO without question, the best scorer in the world who has one of the best (if not the best) playmaker in the world setting him up. Marner also started scoring like crazy last year which makes that line more dangerous then it's ever been and they will be a treat to watch! Our D is light years improved from what it was when Dubas took over and ever since Keefe took over, our defensive metrics are also light years improved. Our bottom 6 is meh but not really a big deal.

The one big question mark with this team is goaltending but we have not one, but two goalies on board who have the potential to give us what we need in the playoffs so if one of them can come through, watch out!

This could be the year we finally go on a deep run. Spare me the crap about the past, if anyone thinks this team can't win, go wallow in your misery if you that's what you want to do but no need to poison this board on a daily basis with the same old tired posts that have been posted a thousand times already.

If we win the cup this season, or at least go to the finals then I want to enjoy it all, starting with the first game of the season. I won't be looking back when it's all over thinking FML, we won the cup, what a historic season this was, I wish I had watched/enjoyed it more.

Even the Red Sox finally won after a period of misery that was much longer than ours has been so far. I believe this team has what it takes, they just need to go out there and do it. There is far too much talent here to lose again, I have to believe that this is the year they shake that monkey off their backs and once they finally win that first round, there will be a new swagger in their steps and stopping them isn't going to be easy.

Make it happen boys. GLG!!

 

[Gabriel426]

Luckily the past does not dictate the future. Our playoff history is awful, we all know that but I'm starting to recover from our most recent loss and I resolve to at least try to focus on the positive going forward, the season will be a lot more enjoyable that way. And there is lots of positives to focus on, all one has to do is choose to do so. And isn't that why we watch, for the enjoyment of it?

Last I checked, only COL is given a better chance than us at winning the cup. Spare me the "wisdom" of how the Vegas odds don't aren't an accurate representation of our chances to win, I'm very familiar with how betting lines work and believe me, they're close enough to the truth to indicate that there is no question that we are one of the top contenders.

We have arguably the best player in the world who is IMO without question, the best scorer in the world who has one of the best (if not the best) playmaker in the world setting him up. Marner also started scoring like crazy last year which makes that line more dangerous then it's ever been and they will be a treat to watch! Our D is light years improved from what it was when Dubas took over and ever since Keefe took over, our defensive metrics are also light years improved. Our bottom 6 is meh but not really a big deal.

The one big question mark with this team is goaltending but we have not one, but two goalies on board who have the potential to give us what we need in the playoffs so if one of them can come through, watch out!

This could be the year we finally go on a deep run. Spare me the crap about the past, if anyone thinks this team can't win, go wallow in your misery if you that's what you want to do but no need to poison this board on a daily basis with the same old tired posts that have been posted a thousand times already.

If we win the cup this season, or at least go to the finals then I want to enjoy it all, starting with the first game of the season. I won't be looking back when it's all over thinking FML, we won the cup, what a historic season this was, I wish I had watched/enjoyed it more.

Even the Red Sox finally won after a period of misery that was much longer than ours has been so far. I believe this team has what it takes, they just need to go out there and do it. There is far too much talent here to lose again, I have to believe that this is the year they shake that monkey off their backs and once they finally win that first round, there will be a new swagger in their steps and stopping them isn't going to be easy.

Make it happen boys. GLG!!

Agree to most of you said. I think the talents are there but the ultimate question is can they do it in the most important game of the season?
I hope they can.
The question marks are still the same from previous years, goaltending and depth.
Can’t do anything about goaltending at this point.
Depth is something I think Keefe can address internally as long as he is willing to split the big four into 3 lines.

 

[NMacrules]

Anything but a cup will be considered a failure.

 

[ChickenMcNugget]

Luckily the past does not dictate the future. Our playoff history is awful, we all know that but I'm starting to recover from our most recent loss and I resolve to at least try to focus on the positive going forward, the season will be a lot more enjoyable that way. And there is lots of positives to focus on, all one has to do is choose to do so. And isn't that why we watch, for the enjoyment of it?

Last I checked, only COL is given a better chance than us at winning the cup. Spare me the "wisdom" of how the Vegas odds don't aren't an accurate representation of our chances to win, I'm very familiar with how betting lines work and believe me, they're close enough to the truth to indicate that there is no question that we are one of the top contenders.

We have arguably the best player in the world who is IMO without question, the best scorer in the world who has one of the best (if not the best) playmaker in the world setting him up. Marner also started scoring like crazy last year which makes that line more dangerous then it's ever been and they will be a treat to watch! Our D is light years improved from what it was when Dubas took over and ever since Keefe took over, our defensive metrics are also light years improved. Our bottom 6 is meh but not really a big deal.

The one big question mark with this team is goaltending but we have not one, but two goalies on board who have the potential to give us what we need in the playoffs so if one of them can come through, watch out!

This could be the year we finally go on a deep run. Spare me the crap about the past, if anyone thinks this team can't win, go wallow in your misery if you that's what you want to do but no need to poison this board on a daily basis with the same old tired posts that have been posted a thousand times already.

If we win the cup this season, or at least go to the finals then I want to enjoy it all, starting with the first game of the season. I won't be looking back when it's all over thinking FML, we won the cup, what a historic season this was, I wish I had watched/enjoyed it more.

Even the Red Sox finally won after a period of misery that was much longer than ours has been so far. I believe this team has what it takes, they just need to go out there and do it. There is far too much talent here to lose again, I have to believe that this is the year they shake that monkey off their backs and once they finally win that first round, there will be a new swagger in their steps and stopping them isn't going to be easy.

Make it happen boys. GLG!!

Well i mean if you ignore all the flaws then of course they look like an amazing team lol. If one only looks at certain games then they went 54-0 in the regular season and 3-0 in the playoffs.

One can cheer for the success of the team while still being critical of the process.

 

[fahad203]

Agree to most of you said. I think the talents are there but the ultimate question is can they do it in the most important game of the season?
I hope they can.
The question marks are still the same from previous years, goaltending and depth.
Can’t do anything about goaltending at this point.
Depth is something I think Keefe can address internally as long as he is willing to split the big four into 3 lines.

I will argue even depth is not much of an issue. Getting the most out of your player is coache's responsibility

There are 6 20 goals scorers. 2 of them are 30 goals scorers. 1 of them is 60 goal scorer
I am not sure what else anyone can want from depth point of view

Last 2 series we were up in both of them. One of them 3-1

There were a lot of players come and gone.
There's a common denominator in all those 3 series losses = Coach and goaltender

Keefe had Andersen, Campbell and now Murray

I still have hard time coming to terms that this team lost to Habs being up 3-1 and somehow out of all these, Keefe still has a job

 

[tmlms13]

If morgan rielly isn't a number 1 D then that means there are probably 15 or less in existence. And last I checked there are 32 teams. Can't have a #1 at everything this isn't a video game.

 

[Gabriel426]

I will argue even depth is not much of an issue. Getting the most out of your player is coache's responsibility

There are 6 20 goals scorers. 2 of them are 30 goals scorers. 1 of them is 60 goal scorer
I am not sure what else anyone can want from depth point of view

Last 2 series we were up in both of them. One of them 3-1

There were a lot of players come and gone.
There's a common denominator in all those 3 series losses = Coach and goaltender

Keefe had Andersen, Campbell and now Murray

I still have hard time coming to terms that this team lost to Habs being up 3-1 and somehow out of all these, Keefe still has a job

Our top guys didn't score enough goals in the playoffs. You can't just blame Keefe for not getting the job done without pointing the fingers at the players for not scoring at their regular season rate. I think the fact that AM, MM, JT and to some extend Willie didn't provide the goals is one of the main reasons why the Leafs didn't advance the past few seasons.
I am not a Keefe's fans and I wish Trotz is the coach right now, but if Keefe can get AM to be a 60goals scorer in regular season, is it really on him when AM can't score at that rate in the playoffs? Or is it AM who needed to be better? Same questions can be asked for MM and JT?
Not saying Keefe and the goalies were not a problem these past playoffs but the fact that our top guys didn't produce the expected offence based on their regular season totals is one of the reasons why Leafs had been a playoff teams instead of being a real contender playing in ECFs or Cup Finals.
I think we tend to want to identify a scapegoat but the truth is that our top guys just have not done enough in the playoffs. Take a look at Drai and McD and see what they did this past playoffs. Look at Makar. For all the talk about AM and MM being the top elites in the league, both of them had yet to dominate a playoff series and put the team on their shoulders and steal a series or two.

 

[fahad203]

Our top guys didn't score enough goals in the playoffs. You can't just blame Keefe for not getting the job done without pointing the fingers at the players for not scoring at their regular season rate. I think the fact that AM, MM, JT and to some extend Willie didn't provide the goals is one of the main reasons why the Leafs didn't advance the past few seasons.
I am not a Keefe's fans and I wish Trotz is the coach right now, but if Keefe can get AM to be a 60goals scorer in regular season, is it really on him when AM can't score at that rate in the playoffs? Or is it AM who needed to be better? Same questions can be asked for MM and JT?
Not saying Keefe and the goalies were not a problem these past playoffs but the fact that our top guys didn't produce the expected offence based on their regular season totals is one of the reasons why Leafs had been a playoff teams instead of being a real contender playing in ECFs or Cup Finals.
I think we tend to want to identify a scapegoat but the truth is that our top guys just have not done enough in the playoffs. Take a look at Drai and McD and see what they did this past playoffs. Look at Makar. For all the talk about AM and MM being the top elites in the league, both of them had yet to dominate a playoff series and put the team on their shoulders and steal a series or two.

You are very correct. Not much argument there about our top guys .. our top players still yet to take over any series like Crosby, Mac and McDavid has

Then we have bigger problem. If we haven't won with our current core and they haven't elevated their game. When will they? Or will they ?

Then there are no amount of depth or coaching will help. I never get the sense with our core that they can come through in big games. They still haven't. Almost all of them played so many game 7s or clinching games.

But then the onus still has to be on the coach. He wouldn't try anything different. He goes back with the same Marner Matthew's and Nylander who hasn't worked out with Tavares

Why didn't he stack the lines in the 3rd period instead of waiting around? Tavares Matthew's and Marner together ? Just go with one good line. He waited until the last minute of the game

Against montreal he made multiple blunders in not taking away Matthew's from Denaults match up

Putting in Sandin instead of more experienced Dermott first game.

His challenges were garbage

Why didn't he just double shift Matthews in clinching games ?

Because he over coaches. He can't seem to make right call right time

 

[Gary Nylund]

Well i mean if you ignore all the flaws then of course they look like an amazing team lol. If one only looks at certain games then they went 54-0 in the regular season and 3-0 in the playoffs.

One can cheer for the success of the team while still being critical of the process.

Not sure why you're quoting me - I'm not ignoring any flaws, I never used the word "amazing team" and I've been critical of a number of things that have been done.

One can be critical of a number of things the team has done and still understand that despite thousands of posts which might give one the impression that this team has no hope of winning anything, this is in fact a very good team and is one of the top cup contenders.

 

[Gabriel426]

You are very correct. Not much argument there about our top guys .. our top players still yet to take over any series like Crosby, Mac and McDavid has

Then we have bigger problem. If we haven't won with our current core and they haven't elevated their game. When will they? Or will they ?

Then there are no amount of depth or coaching will help. I never get the sense with our core that they can come through in big games. They still haven't. Almost all of them played so many game 7s or clinching games.

But then the onus still has to be on the coach. He wouldn't try anything different. He goes back with the same Marner Matthew's and Nylander who hasn't worked out with Tavares

Why didn't he stack the lines in the 3rd period instead of waiting around? Tavares Matthew's and Marner together ? Just go with one good line. He waited until the last minute of the game

Against montreal he made multiple blunders in not taking away Matthew's from Denaults match up

Putting in Sandin instead of more experienced Dermott first game.

His challenges were garbage

Why didn't he just double shift Matthews in clinching games ?

Because he over coaches. He can't seem to make right call right time

Like I said, I am not saying Keefe did great and I wish Trotz is the current coach instead of him.
My point is that our top guys didn't perform as expected but thats probably had more to do with them than coaching.
In the Habs series, I think both MM and AM combined for ONE goal in the series, which is horrible.
In the TB series, AM scored 4 goals and MM got 2 goals. Better than the Habs series but thats still not good enough.
Now can our guys turn that switch like McD and Drai did last playoffs, I think and hope they can.

 

[Dekes For Days]

if Keefe can get AM to be a 60goals scorer in regular season, is it really on him when AM can't score at that rate in the playoffs? Or is it AM who needed to be better?

Not really sure why you're surprised that it's harder to score at a certain pace playing every game against Tampa and Vasilevsky instead of your average team and goalie.

 

[Uncus13]

Not having experimented with Matthews on the PK is a problem for me. Why not have him out there taking a turn instead of some useless idiot that looks like a giraffe?
Do star players all of a sudden become stupid players on the penalty kill? Is there a time you would prefer to have Kerfoot or Engvall out there instead of Matthews (except for obvious reasons)?

 

[fahad203]

Not having experimented with Matthews on the PK is a problem for me. Why not have him out there taking a turn instead of some useless idiot that looks like a giraffe?
Do star players all of a sudden become stupid players on the penalty kill? Is there a time you would prefer to have Kerfoot or Engvall out there instead of Matthews (except for obvious reasons)?

Probably because they dont' want him get injured. Still which makes no sense since Tavares and Marner kill penalties

I really think Matthews should be expanded more to different roles and scenarios. The challenge also becomes if Engvall /Kerfoot doesn't kill penalties, what is he really doing out there? what do they really bring?

 

[m1ker]

Seems like Nylander-Matthews-Marner is Keefe's go-to when we need a spark. I'd like to see them play more regular season games together if that's going to be his go-to

 

[Notsince67]

Our top guys didn't score enough goals in the playoffs. You can't just blame Keefe for not getting the job done without pointing the fingers at the players for not scoring at their regular season rate. I think the fact that AM, MM, JT and to some extend Willie didn't provide the goals is one of the main reasons why the Leafs didn't advance the past few seasons.
I am not a Keefe's fans and I wish Trotz is the coach right now, but if Keefe can get AM to be a 60goals scorer in regular season, is it really on him when AM can't score at that rate in the playoffs? Or is it AM who needed to be better? Same questions can be asked for MM and JT?
Not saying Keefe and the goalies were not a problem these past playoffs but the fact that our top guys didn't produce the expected offence based on their regular season totals is one of the reasons why Leafs had been a playoff teams instead of being a real contender playing in ECFs or Cup Finals.
I think we tend to want to identify a scapegoat but the truth is that our top guys just have not done enough in the playoffs. Take a look at Drai and McD and see what they did this past playoffs. Look at Makar. For all the talk about AM and MM being the top elites in the league, both of them had yet to dominate a playoff series and put the team on their shoulders and steal a series or two.

this isnt even true.
Goals in the series

player	Total
Auston Matthews	4​
Ondrej Palat	3​
Morgan Rielly	3​
Ross Colton	3​
William Nylander	3​
John Tavares	3​
David Kampf	2​
Nicholas Paul	2​
Jake Muzzin	2​
Steven Stamkos	2​
Nikita Kucherov	2​
Brayden Point	2​
Ilya Mikheyev	2​
Mitchell Marner	2​
Corey Perry	2​
Victor Hedman	2​
Pierre-Edouard Bellemare	1​
Alexander Kerfoot	1​
Ryan McDonagh	1​
Michael Bunting	1​
Pat Maroon	1​
Brandon Hagel	1​
Colin Blackwell	1​
Anthony Cirelli	1​

 

[Gabriel426]

this isnt even true.
Goals in the series
[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]player[/TD]
[TD]Total[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Auston Matthews[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Ondrej Palat[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Morgan Rielly[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Ross Colton[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]William Nylander[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]John Tavares[/TD]

[TD]

3​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]David Kampf[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Nicholas Paul[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Jake Muzzin[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Steven Stamkos[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Nikita Kucherov[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Brayden Point[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Ilya Mikheyev[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Mitchell Marner[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Corey Perry[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Victor Hedman[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pierre-Edouard Bellemare[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Alexander Kerfoot[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Ryan McDonagh[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Michael Bunting[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Pat Maroon[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Brandon Hagel[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Colin Blackwell[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Anthony Cirelli[/TD]

[TD]

1​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Compare to McD, Drai, Mack and Makar.
Then you had AM and MM combined for ONE goal against the Habs last season.

 

[WTFMAN99]

My expectation?

Make playoffs, lose in the 1st round. We're consistent.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Compare to McD, Drai, Mack and Makar.
Then you had AM and MM combined for ONE goal against the Habs last season.

Against Tampa, Maker had 3 and MacK had 2.

McD and Drai played easier opponents.

Against Tampa we scored 3.43 gpg, and Avs scored 3.33. But we gave 3.29 while the Avs gave up 2.50. Our offence, particularly from our top players, wasn't the main problem.

 

[ALine]

Not having experimented with Matthews on the PK is a problem for me. Why not have him out there taking a turn instead of some useless idiot that looks like a giraffe?
Do star players all of a sudden become stupid players on the penalty kill? Is there a time you would prefer to have Kerfoot or Engvall out there instead of Matthews (except for obvious reasons)?

There’s a lot of things to rip on Keefe for but this shouldn’t be one of them.
You should prefer Kerfoot or Engvall out there on the PK so Matthew’s can be fresh for 5on5 play or if we. If you have Marner and Matthew’s on the PK, and Tavares too sometimes, who takes the first shift at even strength? under your experiment, it would be… Kerfoot and Engvall.
Not a great plan

 

[andora]

There’s a lot of things to rip on Keefe for but this shouldn’t be one of them.
You should prefer Kerfoot or Engvall out there on the PK so Matthew’s can be fresh for 5on5 play or if we. If you have Marner and Matthew’s on the PK, and Tavares too sometimes, who takes the first shift at even strength? under your experiment, it would be… Kerfoot and Engvall.
Not a great plan

Or just roll three units and depending on time a matthews or marner can start the next shift after the pk just fine

 

[Gabriel426]

Against Tampa, Maker had 3 and MacK had 2.

McD and Drai played easier opponents.

Against Tampa we scored 3.43 gpg, and Avs scored 3.33. But we gave 3.29 while the Avs gave up 2.50. Our offence, particularly from our top players, wasn't the main problem.

And how many playoffs rounds did our top guys and their offence help our team win over the past 6 years?

 

[notbias]

And how many playoffs rounds did our top guys and their offence help our team win over the past 6 years?

Why not just start with this argument if it is your go-to when someone proves you wrong?

 

[TheRumble]

And how many playoffs rounds did our top guys and their offence help our team win over the past 6 years?

"We should blown it up for Bedard."

Just come out and say it.

 

[Kazparov]

I'm realistic. The will have a decent regular season, will make the playoffs, where it's coin flip if they can win a round or two.

Beyond that doubtful, I question goalies and overall depth.