Player Discussion Artemi Panarin

[Chaels Arms]

His line mates were productive and way more visible in this series.

He's making 11.6. If he isn't a warhorse, he can get the f*** out of here for that kind of money. He didn't get locked in on in this series, That happened to CK/Mika. They drew the tough matchups, not Artemi. I'd be less annoyed if he were creating and getting goalie'd because you can't handle that. He wasn't.

The best thing the Rangers can do is move on from this guy. He's proven that he's not the guy or even the guy after the guy. You're not going to win with this guy as your featured offensive player.

The fact that his line was the only one that was remotely productive doesn't help your argument in the slightest, it actually defeats it. That being said, I'm not going to continue to engage with someone who is clearly on an absolutely embarrassing bender right now when it comes to this particular topic. Have a good night.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

The fact that his line was the only one that was remotely productive doesn't help your argument in the slightest, it actually defeats it. That being said, I'm not going to continue to engage with someone who is clearly on an absolutely embarrassing bender right now when it comes to this particular topic. Have a good night.

They were productive despite him, not because of him. Anyone with eyes and even a shred of honesty would say the same.

Funny enough, I'm sober as a nun right now. Have a good night as well!

 

[huerter]

If he was wearing a Roslovic jersey you’d be like damn we got bad Roslovic in this series.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

If this is going to be your take today, I highly suggest you come back in a week or so after the board has calmed down.

I mean, do what you want to do, but these takes are incredibly dumb and untimely.

His takes are politics related not hockey related. If his name were Art Panara we wouldn't hear from him at any point.

 

[shizovitch]

A neutral hockey fan coming with peace.

Bread is a family man with many millions on his account. He doesnt care about ever winning a cup. Ideally for bread, his team never makes the playoffs and his holiday starts in April. Its just what it is.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

A neutral hockey fan coming with peace.

Bread is a family man with many millions on his account. He doesnt care about ever winning a cup. Ideally for bread, his team never makes the playoffs and his holiday starts in April. Its just what it is.

I'm not here for the laughable yet predictable excuse train that some are going to ride but I'm not really game with assassinating his character either.

I think it's pretty clear that he does care. He just isn't a guy you can build an offense around if you want to win the whole thing. Once the playoffs start he's at best a tertiary option being paid top dollar.

Doesn't mean he's only about the money and just wants to go on expensive vacations once the regular season is over.

 

[Kendo]

He's obviously more of an 82-game player than a 16-game player. We did well with pairing him with 16 & 13 that both play a heavier game.

I think having our own issues with 20-93-XX and the third line made it easier for FLA to focus on shutting down the Bread line. Pair that with Lindgren and Trouba regressing HARD, and a likely injured Fox, and there was little to no puck-movement from the back end.

I'm not out here making excuses for Panarin. He had a shit series. I'm just hammering home the fact that we had a number of issues and we were STILL two wins away from the Cup final.

If we want to consider moving him for someone that's more like an 80-pt guy but has that bullish playoff style game, I'm all ears. Just dumping him and trying to backfill with two 60-pt guys could hurt us more than help.

Just a month or so ago, everyone (Except for GoAwayPanarin LOL) was saying it was one of the best FA signings in Rangers history. Some saying the literal best. There was a Twitter narrative that we should explore what an extension would look like in two years, and I was thinking "Y'all trippin'." I would just let him gracefully walk to UFA. Now that people are going to talk about dumping him out right, I'm not into it unless there's a realistic top-30 F replacement provided.

It would be hilarious if there were a number of moves that ended up effectively Panarin for Buch+.

 

[Kendo]

I'm not here for the laughable yet predictable excuse train that some are going to ride but I'm not really game with assassinating his character either.

I think it's pretty clear that he does care. He just isn't a guy you can build an offense around if you want to win the whole thing. Once the playoffs start he's at best a tertiary option being paid top dollar.

Doesn't mean he's only about the money and just wants to go on expensive vacations once the regular season is over.

Fair.

The whole reason his line was called the 2nd line all season is because he's built like an elite 2nd liner and PP monster, in a way. I agree that he's not the "build around guy." That was "supposed to be" okay since we had "bona fide 1st line players Chris and Mika" to build around. It's just that we never ended up building a top line around those two (plus a huge slump of a season from Mika).

If we're right back to 10-16-13 next season, I'm pretty okay with that. Troch and Laf are the guys being built around, and Panarin's the one that fits THEM. Call them the 1st line. We just need to have a viable 2nd line threat to withstand a series that's a bad matchup for Panarin. Oh, and a healthy, competent D all around. LOL

There are three other "free up some money" moves to look at before creating such a huge hole. We've already been missing a top 6 W for 4 years now. For however flawed Panarin is as a #1 guy, at being "that dude," 100+ points is 100+ points. His plus side is already mitigating a big deficit elsewhere.

 

[Zats Muccarello]

As others have mentioned above, if we've learned anything about Bread over the last three postseasons its that he can be a great number 2 or 3 guy on your team but he won't be the one driving offense.

 

[JohnC]

You’d have to be pretty touched to think Panarin was playing with the same level of effectiveness as Tro and Laf out there.

 

[Kendo]

As others have mentioned above, if we've learned anything about Bread over the last three postseasons its that he can be a great number 2 or 3 guy on your team but he won't be the one driving offense.

Totally. Being a top 5 in the NHL regular season "on paper" player is a huge plus if he's on the secondary threat line in the PO's. If Trocheck and Laf are deserving enough of being the primary threat in the postseason with or without Panarin, then everything hinges on that second line.

So even if everything you said except it's "number 3 or 4 guy," then still, yeah.

 

[Nyr88nyg]

Don’t care about presidents trophies. Only cups. Time to move on

 

[irishlaxburger2]

I don’t think you move on from him yet, but it’s clear he’s not going to be the driving force to win a Stanley Cup. That’s difficult to swallow given his contract.

I don’t think he was net detrimental when on the ice this series. His line was actually the one that out chanced Florida the whole series. You may claim it was Laf and Tro that drove that - and I’d probably agree - but still I don’t think he was net detrimental to the team. I think he was net average to the team, which isn’t enough for a $11m+ player.

Mika and Trouba were net detrimental. Need to move on from them first.

 

[Bob Richards]

I thought this was his best postseason compared to the previous two years but it still leaves so much to be desired.

I'm a Panarin fan and defender but I'd be lying if I said he didn't look like he dropped a tier or two as player in the playoffs.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Fair.

The whole reason his line was called the 2nd line all season is because he's built like and elite 2nd liner and PP monster, in a way. I agree that he's not the "build around guy." That was "supposed to be" okay since we had "bona fide 1st line players Chris and Mika" to build around. It's just that we never ended up building a top line around those two (plus a huge slump of a season from Mika).

If we're right back to 10-16-13 next season, I'm pretty okay with that. Troch and Laf are the guys being built around, and Panarin's the one that fits THEM. Call them the 1st line. We just need to have a viable 2nd line threat to withstand a series that's a bad matchup for Panarin. Oh, and a healthy, competent D all around. LOL

There are three other "free up some money" moves to look at before creating such a huge hole. We've already been missing a top 6 W for 4 years now. For however flawed Panarin is as a #1 guy, at being "that dude," 100+ points is 100+ points. His plus side is already mitigating a big deficit elsewhere.

Yeah I don't buy any of the bolded - Look at their pay checks. Up until recently he carried the 2nd highest cap hit in the league (he's now dropped all the way to 4th.) They aren't paying him all of that money to just blend in.

I never got caught up in who played on what line or how they were labeled (mostly because its pretty useless at the end of the day) and always assumed that Kreider-Zibaenejad got called the "1st line" because they've been here the longest and played together the longest. Anyone who watched this team knew what line was the best one on the team. Maybe Florida agreed with everyone else though seeing as how Barkov was matched up against them instead of Panarin. Now that doesn't absolve them either (especially Zibanejad who had a horrendous series) but if you (not specifically you) are willing to extend that excuse to Panarin, then it should apply to those guys even more so.

I think the other issue with this is that he was completely outplayed by both of his line mates despite being the big money star player on that line - That is completely independent of anyone else on the team.

Now I agree that the defense needs to be fixed first and that there are guys who need to get the boot ahead of him (namely Lindgren and Trouba) but the excuse train needs to be derailed for him. I've heard it all for him - Oh he was having a tough time going into the playoffs, he was hurt before they started, his line mates weren't any good, etc. None of those applied this year.

100+points are 100+ points, but I would expect someone who is capable of putting up 100+ points to to carry over most of their RS production to the PS. As a Ranger he has a PPG of 1.31 in the RS (comes out to a 108 point pace)

In the playoffs? .76 PPG or a 62 point pace.

Find me another player who drops off THAT drastically.

I thought this was his best postseason compared to the previous two years but it still leaves so much to be desired.

I'm a Panarin fan and defender but I'd be lying if I said he didn't look like he dropped a tier or two as player in the playoffs.

Yeah this was easily his best run in a Ranger uniform.

It also happened to be a run where he was the worst player on his line.

 

[huerter]

Fair.

The whole reason his line was called the 2nd line all season is because he's built like and elite 2nd liner and PP monster, in a way. I agree that he's not the "build around guy." That was "supposed to be" okay since we had "bona fide 1st line players Chris and Mika" to build around. It's just that we never ended up building a top line around those two (plus a huge slump of a season from Mika).

If we're right back to 10-16-13 next season, I'm pretty okay with that. Troch and Laf are the guys being built around, and Panarin's the one that fits THEM. Call them the 1st line. We just need to have a viable 2nd line threat to withstand a series that's a bad matchup for Panarin. Oh, and a healthy, competent D all around. LOL

There are three other "free up some money" moves to look at before creating such a huge hole. We've already been missing a top 6 W for 4 years now. For however flawed Panarin is as a #1 guy, at being "that dude," 100+ points is 100+ points. His plus side is already mitigating a big deficit elsewhere.

Stop line numbering.

 

[leetch99]

Oh well.....can't win it every 30 years .

 

[leetch99]

One change like Lafreniere on PP 1 could maybe have made a huge difference with a timely goal . They could have sat Rempe and had Laf /Kakko eat the 3 minutes . Lavi made probably more bad moves then Gallant did or non moves . He also could have sat Rempe and in doing so inserted Jones to help the overwhelmed D . Despite all our faults of being slow and soft....a good coach could have got us into a game 7 IMO with some tweaks .

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

As others have mentioned above, if we've learned anything about Bread over the last three postseasons its that he can be a great number 2 or 3 guy on your team but he won't be the one driving offense.

same story with our star players over and over and over

hopefully laf keeps developing bc he looks like a playoff guy

 

[Kendo]

Stop line numbering.

I know, and that's sort of the point I was making.

If Mika and/or Bread had a "career average" season that carried over to the postseason, we'd be in the finals. 20-93-XX & 10-16-13 SHOULD BE enough of a top 6 to get to the dance. The "XX" wasn't enough.

I was kind towards Lavi basically the whole way, but Wennberg with 20-93 was NOT "it." We didn't have TWO top lines when it mattered, regardless of numbering "L1 & L2." Right??

 

[PuckLuck3043]

A neutral hockey fan coming with peace.

Bread is a family man with many millions on his account. He doesnt care about ever winning a cup. Ideally for bread, his team never makes the playoffs and his holiday starts in April. Its just what it is.

This is bullshit. He worked hard last post season and came back to prove something. He had a great 120 point season in which he challenged the best point season in Rangers history. He also had 16 points in 15 playoff games. He cares. He was just shut down by a better team this series that knows a thing or 2 about playing defense in the playoffs.

 

[Kendo]

Yeah I don't buy any of the bolded - Look at their pay checks. Up until recently he carried the 2nd highest cap hit in the league (he's now dropped all the way to 4th.) They aren't paying him all of that money to just blend in.

I never got caught up in who played on what line or how they were labeled (mostly because its pretty useless at the end of the day) and always assumed that Kreider-Zibaenejad got called the "1st line" because they've been here the longest and played together the longest. Anyone who watched this team knew what line was the best one on the team. Maybe Florida agreed with everyone else though seeing as how Barkov was matched up against them instead of Panarin. Now that doesn't absolve them either (especially Zibanejad who had a horrendous series) but if you (not specifically you) are willing to extend that excuse to Panarin, then it should apply to those guys even more so.

I think the other issue with this is that he was completely outplayed by both of his line mates despite being the big money star player on that line - That is completely independent of anyone else on the team.

Now I agree that the defense needs to be fixed first and that there are guys who need to get the boot ahead of him (namely Lindgren and Trouba) but the excuse train needs to be derailed for him. I've heard it all for him - Oh he was having a tough time going into the playoffs, he was hurt before they started, his line mates weren't any good, etc. None of those applied this year.

100+points are 100+ points, but I would expect someone who is capable of putting up 100+ points to to carry over most of their RS production to the PS. As a Ranger he has a PPG of 1.31 in the RS (comes out to a 108 point pace)

In the playoffs? .76 PPG or a 62 point pace.

Find me another player who drops off THAT drastically.



Yeah this was easily his best run in a Ranger uniform.

It also happened to be a run where he was the worst player on his line.

I think I agree with you more than you think you agree with me. =)

Panarin had a top-5 paycheck that went along with top-5 regular season production. I too wanted that to carry over to the postseason. His linemates picked it up when it mattered, so it's technically fine that he was a "2nd liner" in the playoffs. All you need to work with that setup is another line that's in that 1st or 2nd line cusp range. We totally ALMOST had that. If Panarin himself did more, then we'd be in the finals DESPITE Mika having a rough go of it. If Mika did more, then we'd be in the finals despite having Panarin revert from a top-5 F in the league to a "3rd or 4th guy on a true contender."

We failed on having a "Sixth top-6 guy." Yet again. That's three seasons in a row that we needed to add two guys, hoping that one of them was "the one."

 

[huerter]

One change like Lafreniere on PP 1 could maybe have made a huge difference with a timely goal . They could have sat Rempe and had Laf /Kakko eat the 3 minutes . Lavi made probably more bad moves then Gallant did or non moves . He also could have sat Rempe and in doing so inserted Jones to help the overwhelmed D . Despite all our faults of being slow and soft....a good coach could have got us into a game 7 IMO with some tweaks .

What’s the PP1 alignment with Laf? Who does it run through? Does playing on PP1 mean plays stop dying with Laf shooting and passing into ankles which happen constantly on PP2?

 

[Jauffre]

One change like Lafreniere on PP 1 could maybe have made a huge difference with a timely goal . They could have sat Rempe and had Laf /Kakko eat the 3 minutes . Lavi made probably more bad moves then Gallant did or non moves . He also could have sat Rempe and in doing so inserted Jones to help the overwhelmed D . Despite all our faults of being slow and soft....a good coach could have got us into a game 7 IMO with some tweaks .

I don't get this, the Laf we saw on the rush doesn't translate to Zib's spot on the PP.

There's just as good a chance he disrupts the flow of those other 4. It's just not something you do IMO. We've all seen the wackiness that is PP2. He doesn't exactly look great on it. The PP requires a different level of timing, drawing players to and away from areas, and moving around/switches places. Laf just can't be trusted with that yet, especially in a game 6. It's not a knock on Lafreniere at all.

 

[RempireStateBuilding]

I don't get this, the Laf we saw on the rush doesn't translate to Zib's spot on the PP.

There's just as good a chance he disrupts the flow of those other 4. It's just not something you do IMO. We've all seen the wackiness that is PP2. He doesn't exactly look great on it. The PP requires a different level of timing and drawing players to and away from areas that Laf just can't be trusted with yet, especially in a game 6. It's not a knock on Lafreniere at all.

Ah yes, the lord and savior Mika Zibanejad cannot be touched in fear of something happening without him. 4 other players would, uh..have to do other things.

Most of these playoffs happened without Mika, even when he was there.