Around the NHL XXXIX

[aragorn]

The Babcock and Peters situations while different are both horrific in their own unique ways imo and frankly I'm glad these types are being exposed, I say it's a good day for hockey with ultimate respect for both the unknown victims as well as those who are now coming forward...I have zero personal experience to draw on as I've never personally had coaches or teamates acting in anyway close to this throughout my orgainzed sporting life so to speak but I have always heard the rumoured stories passed along of this stuff going on. Hopefully those who are guilty pay their price!

And now there is a story on Yahoo's website where Daniel Carcillo alleges the WHL & Hockey Canada knew about abuses involving the Sutters. I think there just might be more stories coming out about the hockey world as this begins to trend & go viral.

 

[Upgrayedd]

And now there is a story on Yahoo's website where Daniel Carcillo alleges the WHL & Hockey Canada knew about abuses involving the Sutters. I think there just might be more stories coming out about the hockey world as this begins to trend & go viral.

I suspect sadly there are likely 1000's of similar stories out there presently.

 

[swiftwin]

It's All Your Fault: Here's What's Happening With Kyle Turris

Looks like Turris has gone the way of Boedker and Ryan in Nashville.

I was laughed at when I said the Turris contract would be worse than Bobby Ryan's. He's only on year 2 of this 6x6 deal. At least Ryan is much closer to the end of his contract before getting perma-scratched.

 

[BonkTastic]

Looks like Turris has gone the way of Boedker and Ryan in Nashville.

Turris is infinitely better than either of Boedker or Ryan. You're ignoring a criminally immense amount of context with this take.

I don't think the situations are comparable in almost any context outside of "they have been scratched".

 

[swiftwin]

Turris is infinitely better than either of Boedker or Ryan. You're ignoring a criminally immense amount of context with this take.

I don't think the situations are comparable in almost any context outside of "they have been scratched".

Really? Boedker had a more points and a higher points per game total than Turris last season.

Both Turris and Boedker were healthy scratches at times towards the end of last season too. This, is despite Turris averaging more TOI and more PP time than Boedker.

edit: Also, yes, I understand points aren't the "be all end all", but if Turris is not producing, he's not bringing anything else to the table either. He's not an energy guy, he's not a physical presence, nor is he a PK specialist either.

 

[BonkTastic]

Really? Boedker had a more points and a higher points per game total than Turris last season.

Did Boedker also play the majority of the season with a broken foot? Because Turris did.

Hey, look at that - context!

 

[swiftwin]

Did Boedker also play the majority of the season with a broken foot? Because Turris did.

Hey, look at that - context!

Ok, but Turris is still producing less this season than Boedker was last season too. Explain to me how that makes him infinitely better than Boedker.

...and I'm not even going to touch Ryan, because his production was even better than both Turris and Boedker despite his constant broken hand injuries.

 

[Six Assets]

Snakes

 

[BonkTastic]

... Turris is still producing less this season...

I'm not surprised that you have these bad takes when you're using a sub-20 game sample size, with literally no context, as some master thesis.

 

[swiftwin]

I'm not surprised that you have these bad takes when you're using a sub-20 game sample size, with literally no context, as some master thesis.

Well, maybe his sample size would be bigger if he wasn't a healthy scratch.

 

[OD99]

b) I really doubt this. there was a Russian player just last year that spoke to a Russian paper and explained what the hazing was....... there was no taming down.. I mean maybe more inclusive hazing??? maybe

No idea about the Russian story a d you dont provide details so hard to comment but hazing has been banned in almost every college and many junior teams.

Even if there is some rite of passage it is far removed from what used to be standard practice. Generally teams want kids to feel part of the team right away.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Really? Boedker had a more points and a higher points per game total than Turris last season.

Both Turris and Boedker were healthy scratches at times towards the end of last season too. This, is despite Turris averaging more TOI and more PP time than Boedker.

edit: Also, yes, I understand points aren't the "be all end all", but if Turris is not producing, he's not bringing anything else to the table either. He's not an energy guy, he's not a physical presence, nor is he a PK specialist either.

Turris was a pretty good defensive center when he was here. Not Bergeron level of course but he played a very positionally sound and support heavy defensive game.

 

[BonkTastic]

Well, maybe his sample size would be bigger if he wasn't a healthy scratch.

Maybe when we find out WHY he's been healthy scratched, we'll have enough context to avoid making rash, immature bad comparisons.

 

[Silencio]

I know he already addressed this, but it's a relief to see D.J. being corroborated as a good guy.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

It's All Your Fault: Here's What's Happening With Kyle Turris

Looks like Turris has gone the way of Boedker and Ryan in Nashville.

I was laughed at when I said the Turris contract would be worse than Bobby Ryan's. He's only on year 2 of this 6x6 deal. At least Ryan is much closer to the end of his contract before getting perma-scratched.

Still could have got a 1st for him at the TDL which would have been the smart thing to do . Of course we would have kept our 1st in that case as well. Would be sitting better now if it went down like that

 

[BondraTime]

No idea about the Russian story a d you dont provide details so hard to comment but hazing has been banned in almost every college and many junior teams.

Even if there is some rite of passage it is far removed from what used to be standard practice. Generally teams want kids to feel part of the team right away.

Update: Allegations of hazing in Sherbrooke – LHJMQ

Russian's story of multiple, serious sexual assaults was never corroborated, or at least there was no evidence found by a 3rd party investigating firm, as of last week when the investigation was completed. There was hazing, and Sherbrooke were in the wrong, but unless everyone else present lied (which is definitely possible of course, especially with this type of stuff) the serious, serious, serious sexual assault seems to have never occoured.

Yaroslav Alexeyev describes sexual assault in QMJHL hazing rituals

Possible the 16/17 year old's wouldn't want to come forward, I know I wouldn't. The Russian opted out of the rookie party by paying 20 bucks.

I'm going to believe the Russian, as making something like that up is sociopathic.

 

[swiftwin]

Turris was a pretty good defensive center when he was here. Not Bergeron level of course but he played a very positionally sound and support heavy defensive game.

I agree he was defensively responsible, but I wouldn't call him a defensive specialist.

 

[OD99]

Update: Allegations of hazing in Sherbrooke – LHJMQ

Russian's story of multiple, serious sexual assaults was never corroborated, or at least there was no evidence found by a 3rd party investigating firm, as of last week when the investigation was completed. There was hazing, and Sherbrooke were in the wrong, but unless everyone else present lied (which is definitely possible of course, especially with this type of stuff) the serious, serious, serious sexual assault seems to have never occoured.

Yaroslav Alexeyev describes sexual assault in QMJHL hazing rituals

Thanks for this.

You are probably the most knowledgeable on junior teams here and I am curious about your thoughts on hazing taking place currently and how it compares to even 10 years ago.

 

[BonkTastic]

... but I wouldn't call him a defensive specialist.

Nobody did in the first place.

 

[BondraTime]

Thanks for this.

You are probably the most knowledgeable on junior teams here and I am curious about your thoughts on hazing taking place currently and how it compares to even 10 years ago.

I took part in a couple junior rookie parties, 1 for a team in the Q as a rookie (at 18, and only on the roster for 2 weeks to fill in for the guys at NHL camps), and 2 in the SJHL. Both involved drinking a ton, had to eat some gross stuff, wore diapers for 1, dresses for another. Rookies were able to opt out, nothing involving anything sexual in nature, nothing causing any harm to anyone (outside of excessive drinking). Was basically a drinking party with 5 guys in a stupid costume.

Coaches knew of nothing that was going on, and both the coaching staffs and GM had explicitly said that nothing was to happen with regards to a rookie party.

There is no doubt that rookie hazing gets taken way, way to far many of the times. There is no place for any kind of assaults, sexual assault, verbal assaults, etc. I had fun at the rookie parties I attended, but if there was any of the above going on, I wouldn't have.

I have no problem removing them, completely, from hockey. They cause a lot more negatives than positives. At best it's a night out getting bombed with your teammates, which happens every other weekend, at worst you see or hear of sexual assaults, assaults, young boys becoming frightened and ashamed.

All it takes is a couple of asshats, giving them a platform to perform isn't a good idea.

The CHL hasn't done a good job, as I've heard of quite a few bad stories involving rookie parties over the past ~15 or so years, and never any player discipline.

I don't think there has been a significant change in rookie parties over the past 15 years.

 

[OD99]

Interesting...not sure what I think now. I recall hearing real horror stories but that's probably 30 years ago now.

Appreciate the input.

 

[BondraTime]

Interesting...not sure what I think now. I recall hearing real horror stories but that's probably 30 years ago now.

Appreciate the input.

There are still horror stories, no doubt about that.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I know he already addressed this, but it's a relief to see D.J. being corroborated as a good guy.

I don't really care either way for DJ, but I'm glad at least a couple coaches in the OHL worked to put their foot down to stop at least the worst stuff with hazing. I know the 67's also took steps with Kilrea a few years ago when the Aliu story broke. It's difficult to get rid of this stuff completely, but the more voices added to the cause the better.

 

[JD1]

Turris is infinitely better than either of Boedker or Ryan. You're ignoring a criminally immense amount of context with this take.

I don't think the situations are comparable in almost any context outside of "they have been scratched".

In what way is he infinitely better than Ryan?

Is it his inferior career ppg?
His 160 career goals to Ryans 250?
His no 30 goal seasons to Ryan's four?
His being drafted 3OA to Ryan's 2OA?
His inability to play the boards or in traffic?

I think the missing context here is Ryan's ab surgery and 9 documented broken hand / finger injuries more than offset Turris's career injury history and I'll go a step further and attribute a lot of Ryan's decline to injury whereas i dont think you can really say that with Turris

 

[BonkTastic]

In what way is he infinitely better than Ryan?

... In that he's currently healthy and conceivably could be for the foreseeable future, and Ryan might never again be anything more than a shell of a hockey player?

I don't really want to pick on Ryan's difficult life situation to win an internet argument today, so can we agree to just not continue this particular comparison out of respect for the current status of Bobby Ryan, and common decency in general?

I like Ryan. I don't want to speak poorly of the guy during what is surely a difficult point in his life. He doesn't deserve that.