OT: Around the NHL: That Bedard kid is okay at hockey

[AuroraBorealis]

Oilers: "We HaVe No FoRwArD dEpTh!"

Also Oilers: "Let's put McDavid and Draisaitl on the same line instead of allowing each to carry their own line to add more depth"

Can that still be said after they added Kane and Hyman?
They probably wouldn't be on a line together if EK was healthy.

And honestly I'm not questioning the coach if they score 6.
Their problem is Puljujarvi is absolute trash this year, and there's a hole in the top 6. He's sitting on one goal in 29 games.

 

[canadianguy77]

Jesus. Draisaitl 5 points tonight.
51 in 30 games, but still 8 back of McD

Definitely one of the best duos in NHL history.

They won’t be considered one of the best duos until they can get their team to the promised land.

 

[AlphaMikeFoxtrots]

I watched a lot of them earlier this year and they were basically Sid & Geno it from back in the day. Playing on separate likes but then putting them out there together before commercial breaks such. I haven’t caught a lot of their games recently so they might be rolling them together more often.

From commentary elsewhere it sounds like they play more apart than together, now, but I admittedly don't watch them much.

They score a lot of PPG together, though, which is great for regular season stats.

 

[66-30-33]

I see 800 goals for Ovy...retires at 900+ probably.

Another 4 points for McDavid? now we are gonna hear once again he's better then Gretzky and Mario combined.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Drai has turned out way better than scouting, right? Like. Was he projected to be THIS good?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Can that still be said after they added Kane and Hyman?
They probably wouldn't be on a line together if EK was healthy.

And honestly I'm not questioning the coach if they score 6.
Their problem is Puljujarvi is absolute trash this year, and there's a hole in the top 6. He's sitting on one goal in 29 games.

They still default to going back to McDavid/Draisaitl even with a healthy lineup the very second the duo has a scoreless game. It's like they're more concerned with making sure those two keep racking up their points than actually building chemistry with the two on separate lines.

 

[Pancakes]

Ovechkin seems like he is going to pass Gretzky for sure. Even if he declines somewhat he's only got 94 to go. If he finishes this season with 50 (seems likely) then that would leave him at 830 going into next season. I think Ovechkin could manage to score 64 more goals by the time he turns 40. And if he declined enough to not do so, I think he'd just play until he was 44 or something to break it anyways.

Pretty amazing career. Crazy to have witnessed Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin so close to each other in draft years. They've delivered and then some on the hype.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

They still default to going back to McDavid/Draisaitl even with a healthy lineup the very second the duo has a scoreless game. It's like they're more concerned with making sure those two keep racking up their points than actually building chemistry with the two on separate lines.

I don't have the stats but I believe that was a thing before Kane only. He was pretty dominant with McD so far and they haven't really had reason to default to that.

I don't think it's about racking up points. It's about their scoring being so overwhelming together that it outweighs the balanced approach. Hard to argue that on nights like this.

Scoring is not why their record is like this. They are 1 back of the Western Conference lead in goals for.
The problems are team defense, the blue line and goaltending. Campbell is .875. Basically unusable.

 

[Pancakes]

I don't have the stats but I believe that was a thing before Kane only. He was pretty dominant with McD so far and they haven't really had reason to default to that.

I don't think it's about racking up points. It's about their scoring being so overwhelming together that it outweighs the balanced approach. Hard to argue that on nights like this.

Scoring is not why their record is like this. They are 1 back of the Western Conference lead in goals for.
The problems are team defense, the blue line and goaltending. Campbell is .875. Basically unusable.

23rd in 5v5 xgoals. 4th in 5v4 xgoals. They live off that powerplay and are kinda shitty 5v5. And yeah have bad goaltending.

McDavid and Drai are probably good enough to drag them into the playoffs, but hard to see them doing anything there. McDavid put up a 09 Geno type playoff performance last year and it still wasn't enough.

 

[Turin]

Drai has turned out way better than scouting, right? Like. Was he projected to be THIS good?

He was supposed to be German Thornton best case scenario. But then he started being an elite shooter

 

[OtherThingsILike]

They still default to going back to McDavid/Draisaitl even with a healthy lineup the very second the duo has a scoreless game. It's like they're more concerned with making sure those two keep racking up their points than actually building chemistry with the two on separate lines.

It doesn't help that they can't get enough wins to build up a large enough cushion that would allow for this type of experimentation.

 

[Icarium]

All the highlights from yesterday's games on the NHL's official youtube channel are at 480p. Just when I thought the NHL couldn't be any more amateurish.
At least they have a clip of Ovi's historic goal with better quality, maybe they decided no one was going to watch the rest of the highlights.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

23rd in 5v5 xgoals. 4th in 5v4 xgoals. They live off that powerplay and are kinda shitty 5v5. And yeah have bad goaltending.

McDavid and Drai are probably good enough to drag them into the playoffs, but hard to see them doing anything there. McDavid put up a 09 Geno type playoff performance last year and it still wasn't enough.

Kane and Hyman produced in the playoffs in a big way. It wasn't a full carry.
The scoring just died off vs Colorado in particular.

 

[Pancakes]

Kane and Hyman produced in the playoffs in a big way. It wasn't a full carry.
The scoring just died off vs Colorado in particular.

True. I just don't think Edmonton has enough there to win 4 series unless McDavid and Drai pop off in an 09 Geno/Sid kind of way. And like I said, even that might not be enough.

The 09 Pens didn't get a ton of depth scoring in the playoffs but they did control play 5v5. Edmonton has nothing like 09 Jordan Staal to just grind teams into dust while their top six gets goals. We had that.

Plus it's very hard to win in the playoffs if you don't control play 5v5. As we all know PP opps dry up the deeper in the playoffs you get, so if you can't dominate 5v5, you will have a real hard time winning without goaltending.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

No shit the Oilers are concerned with making sure McDrai rack up points. That organization's done a worse job of surrounding their megastars with talent than Shero did, and we saw *years* of guys like Taylor Pyatt, Mike Comrie, Jason Williams, Cal O'Reilly, Zach Boychuk, etc. on the wings in the top-6.

They kinda don't have a choice if they wanna win games. That team's not exactly winning on depth, so ride your workhorses and hope they can overwhelm the opposition.

That team's never gonna go anywhere and it's not McDrai's fault, imo. That organization is just incompetent from top to bottom, and they'll squander the career of those guys forever unless they force their way outta Edmonton.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Calen Addison is on pace for 45pts. Nice.

 

[66-30-33]

No shit the Oilers are concerned with making sure McDrai rack up points. That organization's done a worse job of surrounding their megastars with talent than Shero did, and we saw *years* of guys like Taylor Pyatt, Mike Comrie, Jason Williams, Cal O'Reilly, Zach Boychuk, etc. on the wings in the top-6.

They kinda don't have a choice if they wanna win games. That team's not exactly winning on depth, so ride your workhorses and hope they can overwhelm the opposition.

That team's never gonna go anywhere and it's not McDrai's fault, imo. That organization is just incompetent from top to bottom, and they'll squander the career of those guys forever unless they force their way outta Edmonton.

Those poor souls stuck with Jack Campbell for the playoffs...assume they wish Smith was not injured now.

Ovechkin seems like he is going to pass Gretzky for sure. Even if he declines somewhat he's only got 94 to go. If he finishes this season with 50 (seems likely) then that would leave him at 830 going into next season. I think Ovechkin could manage to score 64 more goals by the time he turns 40. And if he declined enough to not do so, I think he'd just play until he was 44 or something to break it anyways.

Pretty amazing career. Crazy to have witnessed Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin so close to each other in draft years. They've delivered and then some on the hype.

Imagine we drafted all 3 somehow?

Ovy-Crosby-??
??-Malkin-??

But 3 cups beats the unknown number we woulda had with those 3 unless it was more.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I know most here sort of dislike Ovechkin, but the bloke is a scoring machine and in an era where goalies aren't f***ing goofballs with trying to kick at pucks like the early 80's when Wayne was padding stats like EA NHL on Rookie mode, it's more impressive to me that Ovechkin has continued to be such a f***ing incredible goal scorer at this stage in his career where even the best goal scorers in the history of this sport would taper off to 20-30 goals around the same age he is.

Backstrom is hurt, Kuzsnortsov isn't even the same player anymore, Wilson isn't there, Mantha is largely a joke...yet there he is, at above a ppg and on pace to score 50 goals at 37. That to me is so impressive on its own, he's 37 and scoring at a pace that most players half his age could only dream of doing someday in their career.

Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin...still playing at elite levels in their mid 30's...the haters need to put their dislike of the player and the rivalry aside and enjoy this for what it is, right now for however long we get it for. Ovy has been quite lucky with his health though, Sid & Geno haven't and to still be as good as they are given how it could have gone (Geno with 2 major knee surgeries, other problems, Sid with his wrist, hernia, neck/concussions, etc).

I still don't find Drai & McWanker impressive at all. Draisaitl maybe more than McWanker as he's a complete player, but McWanker still relies heavily on his 2-way linemates to cover for him.

Edit: Gordie was a freak, at 43yrs old he's putting up 23 goals in 63 games in the NHL, lol. Jagr with 25 goals at 44, jeez.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, I think Ovechkin's a piece of shit for being Putlin's lapdog but he's the best goal scorer of all time imo. He's a one trick pony, and he's not gonna have the same team success as Sid's had in the NHL or International, but he's unbelievable at that one trick.

You gotta be some kinda monster to have one card up your sleeve and have everybody know exactly what you're gonna do (PP circle, etc) and still score goals in huge bunches for like 20 years.

He's had the benefit of staying healthy that neither Sid or Geno had, though. If those two managed to remain as relatively healthy as Ovechkin has, it wouldn't have ever been a conversation. Sid would be a good 200-300pts up.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

No shit the Oilers are concerned with making sure McDrai rack up points. That organization's done a worse job of surrounding their megastars with talent than Shero did, and we saw *years* of guys like Taylor Pyatt, Mike Comrie, Jason Williams, Cal O'Reilly, Zach Boychuk, etc. on the wings in the top-6.

They kinda don't have a choice if they wanna win games. That team's not exactly winning on depth, so ride your workhorses and hope they can overwhelm the opposition.

That team's never gonna go anywhere and it's not McDrai's fault, imo. That organization is just incompetent from top to bottom, and they'll squander the career of those guys forever unless they force their way outta Edmonton.

This is why I don't understand why the Oilers struggle so much. Like you said, Sid and Geno often had to play with lesser talent surrounding them during their prime, too. Sid won a scoring title with Kunitz and a rotation of wingers including Stempniak and Brian friggin' Gibbons on his line.

IMO, the massive difference between how the two clubs have operated is:
1-Almost always playing Sid and Geno on separate lines no matter what leads to the Pens having 2 scoring lines more often than not. You can put a Sheary or a Talbot or a Fedotenko on their wing and it allows you to play better players on L3 because they don't have to stack their line to succeed.
2-A better team committment to defense. It seems like the Pens understood that having only 2 elite offensive players meant the rest of the team had to be competent defensively and couldn't all just run and gun. The Oilers seem to just opt for the strategy of just running and gunning all night and hope for the best.

For Christ's sake, the year the Pens won the Cup in 2009 Sid had Kunitz and old man Guerin on his wing and Geno had Talbot and Fedotenko. Meanwhile, the Oilers have wingers like Hyman, Kane, and RNH (who they use on the wing) along with the likes of Yammamoto, Foegele, and Puljujarvi to balance out their attack. That's not a weaker forward unit than what the Pens had.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

This is why I don't understand why the Oilers struggle so much. Like you said, Sid and Geno often had to play with lesser talent surrounding them during their prime, too. Sid won a scoring title with Kunitz and a rotation of wingers including Stempniak and Brian friggin' Gibbons on his line.

IMO, the massive difference between how the two clubs have operated is:
1-Almost always playing Sid and Geno on separate lines no matter what leads to the Pens having 2 scoring lines more often than not. You can put a Sheary or a Talbot or a Fedotenko on their wing and it allows you to play better players on L3 because they don't have to stack their line to succeed.
2-A better team committment to defense. It seems like the Pens understood that having only 2 elite offensive players meant the rest of the team had to be competent defensively and couldn't all just run and gun. The Oilers seem to just opt for the strategy of just running and gunning all night and hope for the best.

For Christ's sake, the year the Pens won the Cup in 2009 Sid had Kunitz and old man Guerin on his wing and Geno had Talbot and Fedotenko. Meanwhile, the Oilers have wingers like Hyman, Kane, and RNH (who they use on the wing) along with the likes of Yammamoto, Foegele, and Puljujarvi to balance out their attack. That's not a weaker forward unit than what the Pens had.

I think it's as simple as Sid and Geno were just a cut above McDavid and Draisaitl (though the latter two are absolute juggernaut players in their own right, but the first two were special) and the organization put *just that much more* into surrounding them with talent. Particularly in goal, but MAF was already here and established before the other two.

 

[66-30-33]

Pens/Caps rivalry was epic.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Pens/Caps rivalry was epic.

That rivalry definitely had the sauce.

This is why I don't understand why the Oilers struggle so much. Like you said, Sid and Geno often had to play with lesser talent surrounding them during their prime, too. Sid won a scoring title with Kunitz and a rotation of wingers including Stempniak and Brian friggin' Gibbons on his line.

IMO, the massive difference between how the two clubs have operated is:
1-Almost always playing Sid and Geno on separate lines no matter what leads to the Pens having 2 scoring lines more often than not. You can put a Sheary or a Talbot or a Fedotenko on their wing and it allows you to play better players on L3 because they don't have to stack their line to succeed.
2-A better team committment to defense. It seems like the Pens understood that having only 2 elite offensive players meant the rest of the team had to be competent defensively and couldn't all just run and gun. The Oilers seem to just opt for the strategy of just running and gunning all night and hope for the best.

For Christ's sake, the year the Pens won the Cup in 2009 Sid had Kunitz and old man Guerin on his wing and Geno had Talbot and Fedotenko. Meanwhile, the Oilers have wingers like Hyman, Kane, and RNH (who they use on the wing) along with the likes of Yammamoto, Foegele, and Puljujarvi to balance out their attack. That's not a weaker forward unit than what the Pens had.

Andy Hilbert and Colby Armstrong are rocked to their core for the lack of mentions.

I think it's funny as well that Howard and other GM's and coaches in Edmonton have had zero idea of how to do it and there are examples if the Penguins, Kings, and Hawks (Gross) on how to do it. Malkin and Sid had to be the GOAT's on their lines and then you see blokes saying McWanker and Draisaitl are more generational and better than those two yet they need to be on each other's lines to pad stats. More so McWanker than Draisaitl really. RNH goes as the underrated player there now doing all of the dirty 2-way work for McWanker.

 

[Turin]

800 goals when your career started in the 2000’s against the best goaltending in league history is just silly. Congrats to the grape ape. He was an incredibly entertaining player to hate in his prime.

 

[Zirakzigil]

Kuzsnortsov isn't even the same player anymore