Around The NHL: Part XXXI

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Oilers gonna get an ugly win. Wish we could pull that off. With us it’s either cruise to victory or major abortion

 

[bl02]

Kotkaniemi takes a selfish unsportsmanlike penalty that leads to a 3-2 pp goal for Vancouver. Wonder if he gets scratched next game?

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Kotkaniemi takes a selfish unsportsmanlike penalty that leads to a 3-2 pp goal for Vancouver. Wonder if he gets scratched next game?

He was sent down to the AHL for less last year

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I didn't even realize that Ryan Miller was still in the league.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Vancouver’s power play is obnoxiously good

 

[bl02]

JT Miller saving the Canucks bacon. The Canucks lose three legit players including a terrific goalie to division opponents. What could go wrong? lol

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

JT Miller is elite AF

 

[bl02]

Fun overtime in Vancouver. All of Montreal's young players like Kotkaniemi, Suzuki, Romanov seeing ice time. Hope we get to see Lafreniere and Kakko and maybe even Miller in overtime this year.

 

[bl02]

JT Miller is elite AF

He looks really really good. His passing elite

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Miller even converts in the shootout

 

[ThirdEye]

No guarantee he would’ve had the same development curve here, but Rangers botched that one for sure. Finally drafted a forward with higher than middling top 6 potential in forever and gave him away for scraps.

Imagine him in place of Strome right now. And yes, it’s ok to cry

 

[NYSPORTS]

No guarantee he would’ve had the same development curve here, but Rangers botched that one for sure. Finally drafted a forward with higher than middling top 6 potential in forever and gave him away for scraps.

Imagine him in place of Strome right now. And yes, it’s ok to cry

probably not but that was an awful trade. Both he and our Captain for players we’re still hoping on.

 

[Mandar]

No guarantee he would’ve had the same development curve here, but Rangers botched that one for sure. Finally drafted a forward with higher than middling top 6 potential in forever and gave him away for scraps.

Imagine him in place of Strome right now. And yes, it’s ok to cry

how comfy is that armchair?

 

[ThirdEye]

how comfy is that armchair?

That's why I prefaced my post by saying no guarantee that he would've had the same development curve. At the time the Miller add caused some head scratching but was somewhat understandable given the circumstances. In hindsight though we got fleeced. Actually, I probably wouldn't even call it that because I doubt the Canucks knew they were getting an eventual point per game player. Just a shitty outcome for us at the end

 

[Edge]

Something tells me the 2019-21 JT Miller conversations as a Ranger would feel eerily similar to the 2019-21 Ryan Strome conversations on these boards.

 

[Boris Zubov]

Something tells me the 2019-21 JT Miller conversations as a Ranger would feel eerily similar to the 2019-21 Ryan Strome conversations on these boards.

You're still dying on that hill.

 

[Edge]

You're still dying on that hill.

Taking a look at this board, and reactions from Canucks fans, yes. Yes I am.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Does anyone think JT Miller would have been what he was here? Just remember he didn't really do much on an historic Tampa team. The lightbulb just went on for him in Vancouver, no way to be able to project that. I remember someone saying he was a better player than Kreider, I don't think that was the case on the Rangers.

 

[LokiDog]

Something tells me the 2019-21 JT Miller conversations as a Ranger would feel eerily similar to the 2019-21 Ryan Strome conversations on these boards.

That may be true... they’re the same age. Miller has 59 more points in 12 more games for his career, although Miller has scored 20+ goals 4x and 50+ points 3x and seems a bit more of an actual late bloomer than fools gold, they are certainly similar in a few ways. People did call Miller bozo here for brain dead plays and penalties.

But Miller has also linearly improved in each of his NHL seasons where Strome is much more easily described as “wildly inconsistent”. Miller has had very linear progress with a recent break out into a new tier. They do seem prone to the same types of mistakes, but I imagine Miller would be given a much longer leash here simply due to being a much more physical and engaged player. May still lose his coverage or make totally boneheaded decisions at time, but he’s got a lot more sandpaper (which this team does lack, but also the fans eat up).

My personal feeling is Miller has been more consistent and while he’s benefiting from playing now with some great talent in Vancouver, he’s been a consistent 45-55 point guy since becoming an NHL regular. Strome has been a 35 point player, aside from last season and his sophomore season. He’s also never broken 20 goals while Miller has 22+ four times so far.

 

[LokiDog]

Does anyone think JT Miller would have been what he was here? Just remember he didn't really do much on an historic Tampa team. The lightbulb just went on for him in Vancouver, no way to be able to project that. I remember someone saying he was a better player than Kreider, I don't think that was the case on the Rangers.

He had 65 points in 94 games for Tampa. Not all world, but definitely not bad. 57 point pace.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

He had 65 points in 94 games for Tampa. Not all world, but definitely not bad. 57 point pace.

On that team that's on par with his Rangers performance. He was always better than Namestnikov but he wasn't what he is now.

 

[Edge]

That may be true... they’re the same age. Miller has 59 more points in 12 more games for his career, although Miller has scored 20+ goals 4x and 50+ points 3x and seems a bit more of an actual late bloomer than fools gold, they are certainly similar in a few ways. People did call Miller bozo here for brain dead plays and penalties.

But Miller has also linearly improved in each of his NHL seasons where Strome is much more easily described as “wildly inconsistent”. Miller has had very linear progress with a recent break out into a new year. They do seem prone to the same types of mistakes, but I imagine Miller would be given a much longer leash here simply due to being a much more physical and engaged player. May still lose his coverage or make totally boneheaded decisions at time, but he’s got a lot more sandpaper (which this team does lack, but also the fans eat up).

My personal feeling is Miller has been more consistent and while he’s benefiting from playing now with some great talent in Vancouver, he’s been a consistent 45-55 point guy since becoming an NHL regular. Strome has been a 35 point player, aside from last season and his sophomore season. He’s also never broken 20 goals while Miller has 22+ four times so far.

To be clear, I'm not saying Strome is the better player than Miller.

I just think that Miller's bone-headed plays, and lack of hockey sense is largely masked by a team that is tailor-made for someone like him. Outside of that system, he's probably still very close to that 22 goal, 50 some odd point player we remember. Because when you watch him, especially against better teams, there's very little that's actually changed.

 

[Edge]

He had 65 points in 94 games for Tampa. Not all world, but definitely not bad. 57 point pace.

Was also demoted the fourth line and benched after a hot start on a high-octane offensive team.

Which is part of the point. It's not to say Miller is awful, but I think there's this mystique that he's re-invented himself (say like Ryan Graves) or that's become a great player.

When you watch him, he really hasn't though.

 

[LokiDog]

Was also demoted the fourth line and benched after a hot start on a high-octane offensive team.

Which is part of the point. It's not to say Miller is awful, but I think there's this mystique that he's re-invented himself (say like Ryan Graves) or that's become a great player.

When you watch him, he really hasn't though.

I agree. I’m not on the Miller train. Going back to your first response, I think Miller would generally be 20+ goal, 50+ point Miller on most teams with consistency, but I don’t buy the better than point per game explosion as more than the result of a good fit, as you said. That said, Strome without Panarin is a 15 goal, 35 point player so clearly (as you also said) Miller is the more consistent/better player. Same types of mistakes and decision making problems.

I agree on Graves as well. He got a major reputation boost playing on a, frankly dominant Avs team (I mean, it HAS to just be a matter of time before they’re in the SCF). He got a nice pay day out of it as well but Avs fans are already hoping he’s expansion fodder. Even if they weren’t projecting Byram to take his spot, he’d be sitting on their bottom pair the rest of that contract.

 

[Edge]

I agree. I’m not on the Miller train. Going back to your first response, I think Miller would generally be 20+ goal, 50+ point Miller on most teams with consistency, but I don’t buy the better than point per game explosion as more than the result of a good fit, as you said. That said, Strome without Panarin is a 15 goal, 35 point player so clearly (as you also said) Miller is the more consistent/better player. Same types of mistakes and decision making problems.

I agree on Graves as well. He got a major reputation boost playing on a, frankly dominant Avs team (I mean, it HAS to just be a matter of time before they’re in the SCF). He got a nice pay day out of it as well but Avs fans are already hoping he’s expansion fodder. Even if they weren’t projecting Byram to take his spot, he’d be sitting on their bottom pair the rest of that contract.

And to your points, circling back to the original question, no I don't think Miller does what he's doing in Vancouver if he's still here. I'll even venture he doesn't do it in Tampa either.

I think two trades in 15 months served as a wakeup call for him, but I also think the changes to his game are fairly modest and probably owe more to what Vancouver has in place than any great progress Miller himself has made.