Around the NHL — Episode XLXVI

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frightenedinmatenum2

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I am shocked that teams haven't taken advantage of this before. It seems like there could be an equilibrium where it makes sense for both the player and the team. I am also shocked that Melnyk didn't try this. By 2015, with both his health and finances, he had to know that he wasn't going to own the team in the long run. Maybe using deferred payments could have allowed the Senators to bridge the gap with a player like Mark Stone, without leaving Melnyk reasonable to pay it.
 

frightenedinmatenum2

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Ugh, this just seems like a real headache to me... So, defer payment, enjoy a lower cap hit through a players prime, then trade the player in the last year to sell off the deferred payment liability to a team that can afford it and wants to buy picks.

I hope the league puts some serious guardrails on this and quick.

Teams already trade cap. I don't think that's a problem.

It may be an issue with the NHLPA if teams start using it regularly, and it cuts into the 50 percent going to other players. Imagine if 1/5th of their chunk of HRR is going to pay former stars for not playing.

The big consequence of this if it catches on is that it is going to inflate player salary/terms, the same way that signing bonuses did. Teams now have to give signing bonuses to every superstar, enough so to make their contract buyout proof.

What I think will happen is that players are going to start expecting some additional deferred money in excess of what they originally would have asked for without it.

Deferred money would be a great strategy for a team like Pittsburgh or Washington that have a very obvious expiry date coming up. Cap space in later seasons for a team in their position is less valuable than cap space today.
 

thinkwild

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That Jarvis contract raises so many questions. If Draisaitl defers millions as they said making his cap hit $10mil instead of $14mil, that $30 mil that was deferred just never gets counted against the cap? That cant be right, i must be missing something.

A new owner would have to agree to the terms i guess. Lots of risk for the players too, deferring all that and then getting bought out for one. But i guess there are situation as they described where some players may be willing to allow that. But something doesnt seem right to me yet.
 

Micklebot

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Teams already trade cap. I don't think that's a problem.
This feels different, a team using their cap space to take on a bad contract for picks comes with a penalty to their available cap space for the remaining term.

In this scenario, you could take on a guy in the offseason who is an upcoming UFA in Jul, so no cap issue, but with say 10 mil of deferred payments, and get picks for your trouble. Its literally trading cash for picks.
 
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HoweHullOrr

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Ugh, this just seems like a real headache to me... So, defer payment, enjoy a lower cap hit through a players prime, then trade the player in the last year to sell off the deferred payment liability to a team that can afford it and wants to buy picks.

I hope the league puts some serious guardrails on this and quick.
This seems bizarre. Just add all the payments that would be made to the player as part of the contract and then divide by the number of years to calculate the cap hit regardless if some of the money is deferred. It seems like this should be both simple and clear. Unless there’s something I’m missing, I don’t understand why the NHL is messing around with this and would include this as part of the CBA.
 

frightenedinmatenum2

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Shane Doan Deferred Salary and Bonuses Explained​


By CapFriendly Jul. 23, 2016 at 3:26 p.m.
Tweets by @CapFriendly
Chalk one up for John Chayka and Terrance Bross: last week the Arizona Coyotes GM and Player Agent for Shane Doan put the finishing touches on a new 1 year contract extension for the Coyotes captain.



At first glance, the 1 year deal is structured how one would expect for the 39 year old veteran who is returning for his 21st season in the National Hockey League (all of which have been spent with the Winnipeg/Arizona organization).



The contract includes a standard Base Salary and a Signing Bonus; as well as a Performance Bonus consisting of games played (a provision made available in the CBA for 35+ contracts consisting of 1 year; Doan earns the bonus(es) if he plays a set number of games). The contract also includes a No Movement Clause (NMC), preventing a trade or loan without his consent. However, the unique and interesting aspect of this deal is due to the actual numbers of the contract, and the breakdown stipulating how the monetary value of Doan’s salary and bonuses will be paid. As previously reported, Doan’s contract includes base salary with a Deferred Signing Bonus and Deferred incentives that will end up bringing the total value of the deal to $5 million.



Now you might be asking yourself “what is a deferred signing bonus and incentives?” Well, you’re not alone. We at CapFriendly asked ourselves that very same question given that we had yet to come across such a contract since the site launched, and because deferred salary is rare in general. Now that we have determined the detail, we’ll break it down and explain based on our analysis and research of the CBA, as well as information received from various sources.



Base Salary: Doan’s Base Salary for 2016-17 is $2,500,000 and will be paid in its entirety throughout the course of the season per the regularly scheduled NHL payment periods.



Signing Bonus: Doan also receives a Signing Bonus in the amount of $1,376,134. On face value that appears to be an odd number for a Signing Bonus; however, what’s important to note is that this is the Net Present Value of the Signing Bonus if it were to be paid in the 2016-17 league year. However, given that the amount is to be paid as Deferred Salary, Doan (and his agent) are able to take advantage of CBA 50.2 (a) (ii) (A) “Deferred Salary”:

Deferred Salary CBA explanation




What this means is that because Doan’s Signing Bonus is defined as Deferred Salary, and will be paid at a later date once the contract has expired, the $1,376,134 is subject to interest, and the interest rate is calculated at the 12 month LIBOR rate (which per www.global-rates.com was roughly 1.2695% on July 11th) + 1.25%, for a total of 2.5195%.



When the 2.5195% interest rate is applied to the payment schedule in Doan’s contract, the actual final monetary result is $1,500,000:

  • $250,000 payable in 2017 (Net Present Value $243,856.05)
  • $250,000 payable in 2018 (Net Present Value $237,863.09)
  • $250,000 payable in 2019 (Net Present Value $232,017.41)
  • $250,000 payable in 2020 (Net Present Value $226,315.39)
  • $250,000 payable in 2021 (Net Present Value $220,753.51)
  • $250,000 payable in 2022 (Net Present Value $215,328.31)


Performance Bonus: Same holds true for Doan and his Games Played Bonus which has a face value of $963,438. Again, that might seem like an odd number for a Performance Bonus, but Arizona and Bross have agreed to pay the Performance Bonus as a Deferred Bonus, with the above value again defined as the Net Present Value if the Games Played were achieved and paid within the 2016-17 league year.



When the 2.5195% interest rate is applied to the performance bonus, the actual final monetary result is $1,000,000, with a payment schedule as follows:

  • $500,000 payable in 2018 (Net Present Value $487,712.09)
  • $500,000 payable in 2019 (Net Present Value $475,726.17)


So what does this all mean? It means that Doan’s contract for the 2016-17 season has the following breakdown:

Doan Contract Breakdown






The result of which spawns 2 very interesting results for the Arizona Coyotes:

  • The Arizona Coyotes end up with a slightly lower cap hit ($3,876,134) and annual average (AAV) ($4,839,572) as opposed to if they didn’t defer the salary and were forced to pay Shane Doan the entire $5,000,000 in the 2016-17 league year (of which Doan was seeking).


  • For a team like the Arizona Coyotes operating on budget, and who at the time of the signing were at $51M in committed salary expenses for the 2016-17 season, reducing the amount of actual dollars expended from $5,000,000 to $2,500,000, while deferring the remainder to a later date is beneficial. It gives the team more flexibility, and allows them to sign the player they couldn’t afford to lose.


In the end, the Shane Doan contract is a reflection of the how smart and innovative general managers are thinking outside the box when looking at structuring new deals in a Salary Cap system and the modern day NHL.
 
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Sens of Anarchy

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That Jarvis contract raises so many questions. If Draisaitl defers millions as they said making his cap hit $10mil instead of $14mil, that $30 mil that was deferred just never gets counted against the cap? That cant be right, i must be missing something.

A new owner would have to agree to the terms i guess. Lots of risk for the players too, deferring all that and then getting bought out for one. But i guess there are situation as they described where some players may be willing to allow that. But something doesnt seem right to me yet.
 

BankStreetParade

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I am shocked that teams haven't taken advantage of this before. It seems like there could be an equilibrium where it makes sense for both the player and the team. I am also shocked that Melnyk didn't try this. By 2015, with both his health and finances, he had to know that he wasn't going to own the team in the long run. Maybe using deferred payments could have allowed the Senators to bridge the gap with a player like Mark Stone, without leaving Melnyk reasonable to pay it.
Teams can't take advantage of something players haven't really wanted, up until this point. It's way way way better financially to get as much of your salary upfront and in as condensed a period of your contract as possible. The benefits of compounding interest far far outpace any possible perks from deferred payment.

Calculate the compound interest on a return even just indexed to the SP500 (multimillionaire athletes have more complex investment opportunities that typically yield higher returns) for a front-loaded contract and how much it would take in extra deferred payment for the values to come close to lining up.

Tavares' contract is a good case study. From July 1, 2018 until July 1, 2020, he was paid $42.89M. Invest his money as it comes in and see where you end up at the end. How does that compare to the deferred salary math?
 

frightenedinmatenum2

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This feels different, a team using their cap space to take on a bad contract for picks comes with a penalty to their available cap space for the remaining term.

In this scenario, you could take on a guy in the offseason who is an upcoming UFA in Jul, so no cap issue, but with say 10 mil of deferred payments, and get picks for your trouble. Its literally trading cash for picks.

I don't think it is any different than how we have seen the value of players change based on when a signing bonus is paid (Senators overpaying for Stepan because his signing bonus was paid). That was a pick for cash by proxy.

As SensOfAnarchy uncovered, the money does go against the cap. There is just a different formula to account for the value of cash in the future vs cash today.

This is assuming deferred money is not prorated based on how long the player spent on each team that held the contract, and the final team that holds the contract gets stuck with it.

I don't think the league should handcuff the ability of teams to make deals based around selling picks for cash by proxy, because it does help with parity. As misguided as the Stepan acquisition was, if he was actually the player Dorion hoped he was getting (the player Stepan was years earlier), that is an example of selling a pick helping with parity. The Senators added what they hoped would be a top 6 or middle 6 center without paying market value.

Teams can't take advantage of something players haven't really wanted, up until this point. It's way way way better financially to get as much of your salary upfront and in as condensed a period of your contract as possible. The benefits of compounding interest far far outpace any possible perks from deferred payment.

Calculate the compound interest on a return even just indexed to the SP500 (multimillionaire athletes have more complex investment opportunities that typically yield higher returns) for a front-loaded contract and how much it would take in extra deferred payment for the values to come close to lining up.

Tavares' contract is a good case study. From July 1, 2018 until July 1, 2020, he was paid $42.89M. Invest his money as it comes in and see where you end up at the end. How does that compare to the deferred salary math?

I don't disagree with the assessment that players don't want it, but you have to acknowledge that we have seen players take hometown discounts, or we have seen players take less money to win.

What I am surprised by is that this tool has apparently only been used once to execute a hometown discount (Shane Doan).

So this isn't something that is going to appeal to every situation, but it seems like a very good tool for if a player is willing to take less to win now.
 

thinkwild

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Ahh, ok thanks that makes a little more sense. Im still having trouble today getting my brain to work through this one lol. They are amortizing the NPV of the deferred amount over the years of the contract? So the team overall pays less in cash and less in cap hit than had they structured it normally? Part of me thinks ok this is just good agent stuff, but part of me feels suspicious that something isnt fair here but i cant put my finger on it yet.
 

Micklebot

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Ahh, ok thanks that makes a little more sense. Im still having trouble today getting my brain to work through this one lol. They are amortizing the NPV of the deferred amount over the years of the contract? So the team overall pays less in cash and less in cap hit than had they structured it normally? Part of me thinks ok this is just good agent stuff, but part of me feels suspicious that something isnt fair here but i cant put my finger on it yet.
I believe Team actually pays more cash, the cap hit is just discounted using Libor rate

So a cap hit of 900k applied today might mean a true cash payment of 1 mil tomorrow.

The Shan Doan example above is long but pretty clear. A 1.35m bonus cap hit was actually made up of 6 differed payments of 250k totalling 1.5 mil after the contract expired.
 

thinkwild

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I believe Team actually pays more cash, the cap hit is just discounted using Libor rate

So a cap hit of 900k applied today might mean a true cash payment of 1 mil tomorrow.

The Shan Doan example above is long but pretty clear. A 1.35m bonus cap hit was actually made up of 6 differed payments of 250k totalling 1.5 mil after the contract expired.
Ahh thanks, missed that post somehow. Getting clearer. Im still undecided whether i like it and think its fair or whether its a loophole destined to soon be fixed. Prob ok.
 

Micklebot

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Ahh thanks, missed that post somehow. Getting clearer. Im still undecided whether i like it and think its fair or whether its a loophole destined to soon be fixed. Prob ok.
Makes me think of RCA agreements, which are typically done for the tax advantages, not sure how those work with these,
 

thinkwild

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Makes me think of RCA agreements, which are typically done for the tax advantages, not sure how those work with these,
I remember reading something from Havlat's old agent Alan Walsh about those Retirement Compensation agreements. There are some saying that it doesnt quite make your taxes equivalent to Florida and you have to be willing to withdraw money slowly from it to get the low tax rate. Presumably you could put all your deferred money in an RCA which sounds similar to an RRSP. There are many investment vehicles good agents can use. Maybe that's why Stu changed agents, more for the investment advice?
 

frightenedinmatenum2

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I was digging and trying to figure out why players change agents, and the entire logic behind it. The conclusion I have come to is that with Claude Lemieux being a former Devil, this is an inside job to force us to accept Kevin Bahl, a top 10 protected 2028 1st, and the UFA rights to Damon Seversen for Brady Tkachuk.
 
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Golden_Jet

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I was digging and trying to figure out why players change agents, and the entire logic behind it. The conclusion I have come to is that with Claude Lemieux being a former Devil, this is an inside job to force us to accept Kevin Bahl, a top 10 protected 2028 1st, and the UFA rights to Damon Seversen for Brady Tkachuk.
Not happening, Staois is smarter than that poor offer.
 

frightenedinmatenum2

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I remember reading something from Havlat's old agent Alan Walsh about those Retirement Compensation agreements. There are some saying that it doesnt quite make your taxes equivalent to Florida and you have to be willing to withdraw money slowly from it to get the low tax rate. Presumably you could put all your deferred money in an RCA which sounds similar to an RRSP. There are many investment vehicles good agents can use. Maybe that's why Stu changed agents, more for the investment advice?

Maybe if his agent advised him to take the Senators previous offer rather than playing out the season, he resents that? Had he played out the season, he would have been in a position to get the same AAV while only giving up 1 UFA season.

Looking at how this team has performed since the start of the rebuild, I would not be enthused about being advised to give up that much control over my prime if I was Stutzle. He only has modest trade protection, and if we miss the playoffs again and are forced into a re-tool, he's stuck here for years sitting through the same thing Chabot and Tkachuk had to.

Signing a year early might have cost him 10's of million dollars, and more importantly control over his career.

Obviously, there is no way to know. It could be something as mundane as he met Claude through mutual colleagues, and liked his "vibe" (that's the word kids use now). I'm basing the above on nothing other than guessing. There have been no reports that Stutzle is upset about his extension or feels short changed. I just look at the timing of it all, it's like selling your house and then a year later the market shoots up and you're stuck in a long-term lease for a new place that you're unsure about.

Not happening, Staois is smarter than that poor offer.

I thought maybe I would add Sharangovich to the deal, maybe with us kicking in a 3rd, but I didn't want to be too much of a homer.
 

Sens of Anarchy

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Always nice to hear from Boro. He should have been a vet here helping with leadership and truculence with the young Sens back when Dorion let him (and Demelo) walk in favor of lesser vets that helped the young group very little. Dorion failed at his big dream rebuild opportunity. Anyone can sell players and get high picks but to graduate so many young players and provide them with so little quality veteran leadership to show them the way not just tell them is just dumb. They needed that early in this process.

"Some great young pieces here, but haven't played a lot of winning hockey. Winning games early in the season, winning games when you're mathematically eliminated from playoffs is entirely different than being in the hunt, whether it's chasing or trying to hold on to a spot. I think that's overlooked a lot.

"You see a lot of young guys go on a heater at the end of the year when they're out of the playoffs. Take it from a guy who's played, that's pretty easy hockey to play. Not a lot of consequences. I think management did a good job of bringing in guys who are battle tested to try to help shepherd this group."

The fools gold points and then the we were right there conclusions . x points out .. we'll get 'em next year.
 

thinkwild

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And maybe part of the reason Dorion failed at his rebuild opportunity was that he tried to complete it before he left instead of loading the team up with prospects for the next guy. Then he may have had a legacy closer to Marshall Johnson. Finding the prospects was supposed to be his forte, what he was given the chance to do to restore his rep after being forced like Milbury with Wang to sell everything off and run a cap floor team. But he got eager.
 

Sens of Anarchy

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And maybe part of the reason Dorion failed at his rebuild opportunity was that he tried to complete it before he left instead of loading the team up with prospects for the next guy. Then he may have had a legacy closer to Marshall Johnson. Finding the prospects was supposed to be his forte, what he was given the chance to do to restore his rep after being forced like Milbury with Wang to sell everything off and run a cap floor team. But he got eager.
He did try that but his roster construction was poor and the Sens lost on his big game hunting deals.
 
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