Around the League - 2023 Offseason Edition

[henchman21]

I think on the ideal team Zegras is a 2C

Don't see franchise material there but I've been wrong before

If you don’t see sky high offensive talent, you’re either ignoring it or denying it.

 

[Foppa2118]

Regardless of potential, I think it's objectively a mistake to give Zegras a rumored $9.5M deal long term, when he's played three seasons and has a career high of 65 points in 81 games.

That has the chance to really cripple your future cap wise if he doesn't get better. Plenty of super talented forwards never became franchise centers or got to the elite level of the NHL.

He'd have to increase his production from a 65 point player to a 90-100 point player in order for $9.5M to be a steal too, so the reward isn't really worth the risk IMO.

And if he signs a bridge deal, then splits the difference and becomes an 80 point player, instead of a 90-100 point player, is he really going to be able to command more than $9.5M? Mikko makes $9.25M and he was already a pt/gm+ player when he signed at just a few months older than Zegras is now.

People also like to compare Zegras and Byram and use that as a reason why Bo would be hard to sign, but look how different their contract negotiatons were?

Both need to prove themselves more, but Bo said he was happy to get his bridge deal signed early in the summer, while Zegras is on the edge of holding out for a massive deal he hasn't really earned yet.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Regardless of potential, I think it's objectively a mistake to give Zegras a rumored $9.5M deal long term, when he's played three seasons and has a career high of 65 points in 81 games.

That has the chance to really cripple your future cap wise if he doesn't get better. Plenty of super talented forwards never became franchise centers or got to the elite level of the NHL.

He'd have to increase his production from a 65 point player to a 90-100 point player in order for $9.5M to be a steal too, so the reward isn't really worth the risk IMO.

And if he signs a bridge deal, then splits the difference and becomes an 80 point player, instead of a 90-100 point player, is he really going to be able to command more than $9.5M? Mikko makes $9.25M and he was already a pt/gm+ player when he signed at just a few months older than Zegras is now.

People also like to compare Zegras and Byram and use that as a reason why Bo would be hard to sign, but look how different their contract negotiatons were?

Both need to prove themselves more, but Bo said he was happy to get his bridge deal signed early in the summer, while Zegras is on the edge of holding out for a massive deal he hasn't really earned yet.

I don’t think Zegras is holding out for long term deal. He’s fine with a bridge deal, he’s just holding out for a deal that isn’t insulting.

 

[MacKaRant]

Regardless of potential, I think it's objectively a mistake to give Zegras a rumored $9.5M deal long term, when he's played three seasons and has a career high of 65 points in 81 games.

That has the chance to really cripple your future cap wise if he doesn't get better. Plenty of super talented forwards never became franchise centers or got to the elite level of the NHL.

He'd have to increase his production from a 65 point player to a 90-100 point player in order for $9.5M to be a steal too, so the reward isn't really worth the risk IMO.

And if he signs a bridge deal, then splits the difference and becomes an 80 point player, instead of a 90-100 point player, is he really going to be able to command more than $9.5M? Mikko makes $9.25M and he was already a pt/gm+ player when he signed at just a few months older than Zegras is now.

People also like to compare Zegras and Byram and use that as a reason why Bo would be hard to sign, but look how different their contract negotiatons were?

Both need to prove themselves more, but Bo said he was happy to get his bridge deal signed early in the summer, while Zegras is on the edge of holding out for a massive deal he hasn't really earned yet.

I agree with this. When I see Jack Hughes, I see a superstar talent with a somewhat fragile body that might not hold up over his career. When I see Zegras, I see something like the final evolution of Rob Schremp who can do crazy things with the puck and has an incredibly high skill ceiling, but hasn't yet shown he can consistently impact the game or play at both ends of the risk effectively. I wouldn't want to commit that amount of money to him either until I see whether he's the one who will be carrying the mail on that Ducks team.

 

[Alienblood]

Zegras has all the makings of a legit franchise center. Pay the man, or at the very least TRY and pay the man. If the rumored lowball offers are to be believed, I don't blame Z if he ends up requesting a trade.

Anaheim's continually cash-strapped owner had no issue overpaying washed-up vets, but he balks at the prospect of paying that kind of money for a top player during his prime years? I get the hesitancy but he really should have sold the team a long time ago.

nah if they saw it that way they would sign him. They are entertaining offers to trade him. He is a a bad attitude 1 trick pony

Personally I would trade him before he becomes more of a headache.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

Of course, as a Zegras, you would hold out for a contract like that if you know Anaheim is willing.



But it's a nonsense deal from Anaheim unless they are afraid of him leaving the earliest possible.

 

[Foppa2118]

I don’t think Zegras is holding out for long term deal. He’s fine with a bridge deal, he’s just holding out for a deal that isn’t insulting.

I'm just going off what was said here the other day. I would think if it took this long to get a deal done, chances are he's trying to get more than a bridge deal, and the bridge deal offer from the team wouldn't be insulting at this point, but who knows.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I'm just going off what was said here the other day. I would think if it took this long to get a deal done, chances are he's trying to get more than a bridge deal, and the bridge deal offer from the team wouldn't be insulting at this point, but who knows.

IIRC Anaheim is offering like 3/4per for 3 years. Which is insanely low for a bridge deal.

 

[Foppa2118]

IIRC Anaheim is offering like 3/4per for 3 years. Which is insanely low for a bridge deal.

I'm hesitant to believe that's what the current offer is. Maybe earlier in the summer, but I don't see why Anaheim would insist on a 3 year bridge, when 2 year is by far the norm.

Especially any number in the $3's for three years when it's almost October. That just doesn't seem realistic. That's not really a fair contract for a 65 point player, let alone one with the potential to be better, and I would think Verbeek knows that.

 

[UncleRisto]

I went to look at Anaheim on CapFriendly, saw that Alex Stalock is on a +35 contract, and almost had an aneurysm.

 

[Foppa2118]

I'm hesitant to believe that's what the current offer is. Maybe earlier in the summer, but I don't see why Anaheim would insist on a 3 year bridge, when 2 year is by far the norm.

Especially any number in the $3's for three years when it's almost October. That just doesn't seem realistic. That's not really a fair contract for a 65 point player, let alone one with the potential to be better, and I would think Verbeek knows that.

To add to this, Alex Newhook is from the same 2019 draft and just got $2.9M x 4 with a 33 point career high.

Hard to see why Anaheim would be insisting on a three year deal in the $3M's this late in the off season. They must know that's not realistic for a 65 point player that has potential to be better.

They've got $16.6M in cap space with a 22 man roster too. Why would they risk alienating a high profile player on their team with an insulting offer?

Will be interesting to see how this gets resolved, but my guess is the hangup is probably more on Zegras side than Anaheim's.

 

[The Abusement Park]

To add to this, Alex Newhook is from the same 2019 draft and just got $2.9M x 4 with a 33 point career high.

Hard to see why Anaheim would be insisting on a three year deal in the $3M's this late in the off season. They must know that's not realistic for a 65 point player that has potential to be better.

They've got $16.6M in cap space with a 22 man roster too. Why would they risk alienating a high profile player on their team with an insulting offer?

Will be interesting to see how this gets resolved, but my guess is the hangup is probably more on Zegras side than Anaheim's.

https://x.com/Felix_Sicard/status/1704694167522488363?s=20

I can't find the original tweet right now, but Lavoie was saying this. And I think Lebrun said there was a ~3mil gap between the parties so that all kind of adds up. And the 3 year bridge would just be doing the same thing that Tkachuk, EP, and Boeser did so it's not that out of the ordinary.

 

[Foppa2118]

https://x.com/Felix_Sicard/status/1704694167522488363?s=20

I can't find the original tweet right now, but Lavoie was saying this. And I think Lebrun said there was a ~3mil gap between the parties so that all kind of adds up. And the 3 year bridge would just be doing the same thing that Tkachuk, EP, and Boeser did so it's not that out of the ordinary.

The only way this makes sense to me is if Zegras camp hasn't budged in negotiations all summer, and Verbeek doesn't want to be the one doing all the moving, so he's waiting for a reasonable counter offer first.

Otherwise there's literally no reason to expect a deal in the $3M's. It makes so little sense, especially with Newhook getting $2.9M with a 33 point career high, that it's hard to believe. It would mean Verbeek is a terrible GM, which maybe he is, I don't know.

All three of those players signed big money three year deals though, so they're not really comparable to a three year deal for $3-4M per. Boesser got $5.875M back in 2019 then $6.65M on the current three year. Tkachuk got $7M and EP got $7.35M.

These are player friendly, because they get paid well in the short term, but don't get locked into that number, so they can maximize their earnings. $3-4M for a 65 point player doesn't do this. It leaves money on the table short term.

It makes sense for the team to try to get a three year bridge, but if your star player still isn't signed in late September, it doesn't make any sense not to drop that to a two year, or one year deal to get it done.

 

[Balthazar]

Columbus outshooting STL 22-9 but losing 3-1.

 

[The Kingslayer]

They wouldn't have to trade either. Bratt and/or Mercer as part of a package deal could get the job done, then go with the best 1-2-3 center tandem in the league.

I wouldnt trade Mercer for Zegras straight up but thats just me. Im bullish on Mercer.

 

[Alienblood]

I wouldnt trade Mercer for Zegras straight up but thats just me. Im bullish on Mercer.

neither would I and I doubt Jersey would either

 

[the_fan]

When I hear Jack Edwards doing play by play, I wanna pull out all my finger nails, shave my head and stick it in boiling water, then just cut off my ears so I don’t have to hear him again

 

[Chiarelli]

If you don’t see sky high offensive talent, you’re either ignoring it or denying it.

I think the only franchise guys from 2019 are Hughes and Seider to this point

 

[UncleRisto]

I think the only franchise guys from 2019 are Hughes and Seider to this point

Other than Byram, of course.

 

[Gumballhead]

What if Zegras is ultimately just overconfident Drouin?

 

[Pokecheque]

I wouldnt trade Mercer for Zegras straight up but thats just me. Im bullish on Mercer.

Well…I would. But I’m bullish on Zegras.

 

[henchman21]

I think the only franchise guys from 2019 are Hughes and Seider to this point

I’d say as of today, those are the only two that have reached that level. But it wouldn’t shock anybody to have Zegras be a 1C that is a 90++ point guy. He’ll have flaws and cocky AF… but that’s a guy teams would love to build around.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I'm not and have never been that high on Zegras so I certainly get Anaheims unwillingness to give him a long term deal yet, but I would certainly trade Mercer to get him.


My guess on where Zegras ends up is a high end 2C/low end 1C in the mold of a ~75 point guy without much of a 2-way game.


All the same I'd love to see the Avs be the team that shocks everyone and traded for him. If he's willing to sign a 3 year bridge deal for say ~$6M he would be a great 2C here behind Mack for the next 3 years and maybe that's the situation where he does unlock 1C upside. Never gonna happen though.

 

[AvsGuy]

I think the only franchise guys from 2019 are Hughes and Seider to this point

I see this sentiment around here a lot and don't really share it - Hughes is franchise for sure and just keeps ascending, but Seider doesn't strike me as THE guy you build a team around. You can certainly build your defense around him, but I think there are maybe a couple of true "franchise defensemen" in the league and he's not quite one of them

If he becomes the RHD version of prime Victor Hedman then yes