Around the League '18-'19

[SettlementRichie10]

I know it’s an unpopular opinion, but I would have liked to see Lombardi have the chance to right the ship after 16/17. I don’t have anything rational to support this, to be honest. I just feel like he was learning from his mistakes, and facing the reality of the Kings no longer being legit contenders. Lucic really wanted to stay in LA, but Lombardi refused to budge on that 5 year, $4ish AAV offer. He was learning from his mistakes.

Then again, isn’t there a rumor that Dean was told by ownership to can Sutter, and refused? Then was fired as well? Maybe he wasn’t learning.

I still feel like Dean has forgotten more about hockey than this entire board collectively knows. He built an amazing team and didn’t know how to stay on top of the mountain, while simultaneously getting rocked by scandal after scandal. It is what it is.

The revisionist history and character assassination around here is ridiculous. Lombardi was a great GM for 7 years, then a not so great GM for 3.

I also still don’t buy this meme of “the league CHANGED, and Lombardi was stuck in the PAST,” as if speed and skill weren’t valued until 15/16, and toughness and physicality are suddenly useless. The 07 Ducks and 12 Kings would eat this current league alive.

These trends around the league are not an objective science. Speed and skill does not always trump toughness and physicality. These are all valuable assets if utilized in the right way, by the right players, in the right system. Just because there is no current team that is good enough at a heavy, physical game does not mean the style is useless or dead.

It’s a matter of time before we see another 12 Kings somewhere in the league, and everyone starts arms racing on physicality again. This is the way the league has cycled for decades now.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

dang it. I want to see a trade somewhere. Pacioretty or Karlsson. At least get something significant and breaking to discuss.

Summer slow season sucks.

Dog days of summer. I don't expect anything else cool until mid-August.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I know it’s an unpopular opinion, but I would have liked to see Lombardi have the chance to right the ship after 16/17. I don’t have anything rational to support this, to be honest. I just feel like he was learning from his mistakes, and facing the reality of the Kings no longer being legit contenders. Lucic really wanted to stay in LA, but Lombardi refused to budge on that 5 year, $4ish AAV offer. He was learning from his mistakes.

Then again, isn’t there a rumor that Dean was told by ownership to can Sutter, and refused? Then was fired as well? Maybe he wasn’t learning.

I still feel like Dean has forgotten more about hockey than this entire board collectively knows. He built an amazing team and didn’t know how to stay on top of the mountain, while simultaneously getting rocked by scandal after scandal. It is what it is.

The revisionist history and character assassination around here is ridiculous. Lombardi was a great GM for 7 years, then a not so great GM for 3.

I also still don’t buy this meme of “the league CHANGED, and Lombardi was stuck in the PAST,” as if speed and skill weren’t valued until 15/16, and toughness and physicality are suddenly useless. The 07 Ducks and 12 Kings would eat this current league alive.

These trends around the league are not an objective science. Speed and skill does not always trump toughness and physicality. These are all valuable assets if utilized in the right way, by the right players, in the right system. Just because there is no current team that is good enough at a heavy, physical game does not mean the style is useless or dead.

It’s a matter of time before we see another 12 Kings somewhere in the league, and everyone starts arms racing on physicality again. This is the way the league has cycled for decades now.

Amen.

But here's the thing--no one could build after the 'model' 2012 or 2014 Kings just like no one could model the Pens. That team's MO was big, tenacious, relentless, physical, but people forget they were also fast and skilled. The entire Pacific got bigger to handle us and not one of them has enjoyed success since. Seems like no one here remembers that arms race--Oilers getting physical players, SJ trying to get tougher (LOL), Ducks getting Kesler because they couldn't handle Kopitar ragdolling Getzlaf, and so on...The latest Pens have people going "it's a speed and skill league" but guess what, no one is drafting two generational superstars to surround with a bunch of fast scrubs that can handle an area pass and a sputtering inconsistent defense because that's a stupid arms race.

It's about putting together the best all-around team. Not the fastest. Not the biggest. Not the most skilled. Not the best defense. The team that can put it all together appropriately. Hence, why Washington has a Cup, and all those Penguin imitators are scratching their heads on the sidelines. I can't wait until the league gets physical again to a degree...because it just means that great skating and thinking defensemen (like Doughty) are able to plaster the hummingbirds that are trying to get too cute because they know they're untouchable due to the soft rules encouraging diving. I don't want a bunch of slugs out there, but god damn there is nothing more glorious than watching the prime Browns, Greenes, Richards, Stolls out there hammering everything that moves and making great plays. Give me that anyday over Malkin stickhandling until he gets stickchecked too hard then he gets to spear someone and hide behind a ref, or Jonathan Marchessault being the best skater in the league until he thinks he's going to lose the puck then goes down like someone broke his ankle. f***ing hate this version of the game, frankly. But I digress I did enjoy watching Washington crushing the hopes and dreams of several favorites for obvious reasons, and one of those reasons was blowing up this idea that there's "a model" to follow.

 

[King'sPawn]

I know it’s an unpopular opinion, but I would have liked to see Lombardi have the chance to right the ship after 16/17. I don’t have anything rational to support this, to be honest. I just feel like he was learning from his mistakes, and facing the reality of the Kings no longer being legit contenders. Lucic really wanted to stay in LA, but Lombardi refused to budge on that 5 year, $4ish AAV offer. He was learning from his mistakes.

Then again, isn’t there a rumor that Dean was told by ownership to can Sutter, and refused? Then was fired as well? Maybe he wasn’t learning.

I still feel like Dean has forgotten more about hockey than this entire board collectively knows. He built an amazing team and didn’t know how to stay on top of the mountain, while simultaneously getting rocked by scandal after scandal. It is what it is.

The revisionist history and character assassination around here is ridiculous. Lombardi was a great GM for 7 years, then a not so great GM for 3.

I also still don’t buy this meme of “the league CHANGED, and Lombardi was stuck in the PAST,” as if speed and skill weren’t valued until 15/16, and toughness and physicality are suddenly useless. The 07 Ducks and 12 Kings would eat this current league alive.

These trends around the league are not an objective science. Speed and skill does not always trump toughness and physicality. These are all valuable assets if utilized in the right way, by the right players, in the right system. Just because there is no current team that is good enough at a heavy, physical game does not mean the style is useless or dead.

It’s a matter of time before we see another 12 Kings somewhere in the league, and everyone starts arms racing on physicality again. This is the way the league has cycled for decades now.

I thought Lombardi's offer was similar to Edmonton's?

And wasn't Lombardi talking about locking up Bishop too?

I am grateful for what he's done, but it was also time to move on.

 

[Herby]

The 2014 team could have won in this years playoffs, a King-Stoll-Williams line, while lacking a bit in the speed department, still gave you a more than capable third line scoring option that you need to win right now. The centers, defenseman and goaltender were elite, the only weakness was the fourth line and lack of an elite wing (although Gaborik stepped up massively). I don't know about the 2012 team, I know I'm in the minority but I think the 2014 team was just so much better and it wasn't even close.

And had they lost to SJ in 2014 it's likely Gaborik, Greene and Richards all would have been done as Kings. They ended up accounting for $14 million in cap space the next season. I wonder what Dean would have done that off-season, maybe he just trades for Lucic a year earlier but man he would have had a ton of money to add to his insane core of Kopitar, Doughty, Quick and Carter. That's why I always dispute it when people say the Richards debacle ended up meaning nothing.

 

[The Tikkanen]

MLB you have a much bigger roster, more positions so you can swing and miss and still have a serviceable player for a long time. MLB has done a good job going international with heavy scouting but a lot of those players are signed when they are teens if they show potential. And the top Japanese players are posted for bidding wars so the scouting is already done. I also think the pressure for draft picks is much more in the NHL. The MLB draft is a small show on MLB network and teams take a long time to develop players and that's expected. NHL you're expected to produce right now or you're a bust. Teams are relying on these players to turn it around immediately, not 4 plus years down the road. If it came down to which GM position I would not want to be in on draft day it would be the NHL.

 

[Butch 19]

I didn't say it had to be a defenseman. In fact, I named forwards too. I pointed out how Lombardi got roasted for reaching at #4 over a consensus top player, when in actuality he didn't turn out to be so bad looking at his career.

My biggest problem is your multi-directional argument for why one player doesn't make Lombardi intelligent? Is it the pick itself? Because if yes, I showed you when looking at a career, he turned out pretty good. If it's because they lost him for nothing before he played a game in the NHL, that's a bit silly considering:
1) the Kings won the cup before they lost him
2) players get lost for nothing all the time. If you want a top 5 pick who went to another team before playing in the NHL: Blake Wheeler
3) if Hickey played just a game in the NHL before being waived you wouldn't have this argument. Why are we praising teams for playing young players too soon?

Not top 5 picks. The Coyotes received a compensatory second-round pick as a result of Wheeler signing elsewhere. The Kings got nothing for Hickey. Then he developed into a serviceable dman elsewhere - which shows his #4 selection by DL really was a total failure.

 

[deeshamrock]

That Wilson deal makes browns contract look like an absolute steal by comparison.

Caps GM thinking with heart , not head. Rewarding a pretty consistent dirty player for a handful of production. A player I think is overrated...

On the other hand , this deal I do like. Having seen him play a bit, he's a good d and will get better. Fair for both sides.

Six year deal for Skjei

 

[deeshamrock]

dang it. I want to see a trade somewhere. Pacioretty or Karlsson. At least get something significant and breaking to discuss.

Summer slow season sucks.

I think the SKinner , Patches trades are waiting on Karlsson.

And either Melnyk or Dorion are idiots. Only team Karlsson said he'd sign with are the bolts (Deal is rumored at 11.5 per x 7) and the SEns didn't like the pieces involved and trade fell thru. They even had the Knights willing to take Ryan. Now, every other GM knows that EK is headed to TB and the Senators won't be getting as much for a rental. They need to wake up and smell the rebuild. Move Duchene, EK for what you can get.
Patches is gone, probably end august. Still hearing the Panthers...
Skinner has a few teams interested. Canes need to move him for a top center if they can.

 

[Vamos Rafa]

Does anyone follow the Kings on IG and get friend requests from random Kings fan page accounts? It's getting annoying lol.

 

[Little Psycho]

Does anyone follow the Kings on IG and get friend requests from random Kings fan page accounts? It's getting annoying lol.

I've gotten like 5 already.

 

[Stimpythecat]

thank you for the latest info.

 

[YP44]

pro to wilson's contract: he is young
Con to Wilson's contract: Everything else about it.

 

[Johnny Utah]

Really bummed about Iginla. If he was 5 years younger I would have loved for the Kings to re-sign him.

He showed more heart in a handful of games then most of the team showed all year.

 

[BallPointHammer]

I wonder if his first move would be to bring back Dan Cloutier and promptly sign him to a contract extension.

Then John Zieler and Allyn Mac Auley. (those names are probably miss spelled)

 

[YP44]

I thought Lombardi's offer was similar to Edmonton's?

And wasn't Lombardi talking about locking up Bishop too?

I am grateful for what he's done, but it was also time to move on.

Nope Lombardi's offer to Lucic was much more reasonable than what Edmonton signed him for.

Looking at his last two deals to bring in Bishop and Iginla he definitely didn't give up much at all. I truly think he was starting to go into re-stocking the cupboard mode.

 

[Herby]

Lucic was offered 7 years or 8 years? The money is beside the point, it's yet another example that DL had no idea how to properly value players as they got older. Richards, $myth, Greene, Gaborik, Lucic. All of those mistakes other than $myth were made after the 2nd Stanley Cup.

I know a lot of people here think Luc stabbed DL in the back and wanted more power for himself or his buddy Blake, but the reality is the Kings as an organization couldn't afford another season or more of the disastrous mistakes that were made in the final 3 seasons. The same situation the Bruins were in, and both teams correctly moved on from cup winning GM's because things were trending the wrong way.

 

[Herby]

It's August 1st and Nick Shore remains un-signed.

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

Lucic was offered 7 years or 8 years? The money is beside the point, it's yet another example that DL had no idea how to properly value players as they got older. Richards, $myth, Greene, Gaborik, Lucic. All of those mistakes other than $myth were made after the 2nd Stanley Cup.

I know a lot of people here think Luc stabbed DL in the back and wanted more power for himself or his buddy Blake, but the reality is the Kings as an organization couldn't afford another season or more of the disastrous mistakes that were made in the final 3 seasons. The same situation the Bruins were in, and both teams correctly moved on from cup winning GM's because things were trending the wrong way.

8....years...

 

[Stimpythecat]

There was no way Lucic was going to accept that last offer from the Kings. Lucic was getting more from edmonton after just 6 years than what the kings offered in 8.

That last kings offer was more of a face saving "we tried" attempt.

 

[YP44]

Lucic was offered 7 years or 8 years? The money is beside the point, it's yet another example that DL had no idea how to properly value players as they got older. Richards, $myth, Greene, Gaborik, Lucic. All of those mistakes other than $myth were made after the 2nd Stanley Cup.

I know a lot of people here think Luc stabbed DL in the back and wanted more power for himself or his buddy Blake, but the reality is the Kings as an organization couldn't afford another season or more of the disastrous mistakes that were made in the final 3 seasons. The same situation the Bruins were in, and both teams correctly moved on from cup winning GM's because things were trending the wrong way.

I am a big DL supporter but no where have I seen people spinning this as a Luc Power move.

 

[The Tikkanen]

Lucic got a NMC too didn't he? Lombardi had his chances, him and Sutter's love affair with players who lacked talent to score goals at the NHL level did them in. He should have fired Sutter earlier, plugs like Dwight King, Jordan Nolan-all these players beloved by the Kings suddenly are so bad after they leave the Kings they can't even find a job. And we're still seeing this with Nick Shore last season.

 

[Herby]

Lucic got a NMC too didn't he? Lombardi had his chances, him and Sutter's love affair with players who lacked talent to score goals at the NHL level did them in. He should have fired Sutter earlier, plugs like Dwight King, Jordan Nolan-all these players beloved by the Kings suddenly are so bad after they leave the Kings they can't even find a job. And we're still seeing this with Nick Shore last season.

The Kings have not been able to ice a quality fourth line in years, it was even a huge weakness in 2014.

Torrey Mitchell another example, a guy playing regularly on a playoff teams bottom six and can’t even crack the NHL the next season, same situation with King and now Shore as well.

 

[KingCanadain1976]

lol at people knocking King now and yet when he was here i was lol at for doing it wow some people i tell yeah

 

[johnjm22]

Because of Lombardi, Phil Anschutz was spending more on the Kings payroll than any other owner in the NHL while getting a subpar on ice product.

Add that to the fact he had Mike Richards on the payroll until 2032, tried to re-sign Lucic and apparently refused to remove Sutter (which seems completely unprofessional IMO), and Lombardi had to be fired.

It's true that people around here are disrespectful and unappreciative of what he did in L.A., but there's also people that give him too much credit.