Speculation: Armchair GM - Offseason Thread (Summer Edition)

[cbjthrowaway]

apparently anaheim's front office gave a crazy lowball offer (<4m aav) to trevor zegras. reading between the lines, it looks like they're willing to bet on carlsson/mctavish as their 1-2 duo of the future.

i know he doesn't fit the "what we need" archetype, but… man, i'd be all over that. maybe he's not a true 1C – i think he's talented enough to get there – but having a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch eventually would be absurd. could surround fantilli with playmakers on one line (i.e. johnny and kj) and let zegras carry L2 with a shooter (laine) and north/south forechecking wing (jenner/tex). would also give a lot more juice to my "5F power play" posts.

seems like a good opportunity to consolidate some of their roster pieces + futures into a long-term lineup piece.

 

[GoJackets1]

apparently anaheim's front office gave a crazy lowball offer (<4m aav) to trevor zegras. reading between the lines, it looks like they're willing to bet on carlsson/mctavish as their 1-2 duo of the future.

i know he doesn't fit the "what we need" archetype, but… man, i'd be all over that. maybe he's not a true 1C – i think he's talented enough to get there – but having a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch eventually would be absurd. could surround fantilli with playmakers on one line (i.e. johnny and kj) and let zegras carry L2 with a shooter (laine) and north/south forechecking wing (jenner/tex). would also give a lot more juice to my "5F power play" posts.

seems like a good opportunity to consolidate some of their roster pieces + futures into a long-term lineup piece.

This is just my opinion, but I feel like we potentially already have our own version of Zegras in Johnson that we don't need to give up assets for.

 

[NotCommitted]

This is just my opinion, but I feel like we potentially already have our own version of Zegras in Johnson that we don't need to give up assets for.

Yeah obviously Zegras is more proven in that he already has two 60+ point seasons in the NHL but honestly at this very moment I wouldn't do 1:1 trade Johnson for Zegras. 100% admit I haven't watched Zegras that much and I'm probably doing the whole "fan overrating his teams young players / prospects" thing but I like Johnson better

 

[Indy18]

Yeah obviously Zegras is more proven in that he already has two 60+ point seasons in the NHL but honestly at this very moment I wouldn't do 1:1 trade Johnson for Zegras. 100% admit I haven't watched Zegras that much and I'm probably doing the whole "fan overrating his teams young players / prospects" thing but I like Johnson better

I am probably in the minority but I think hes overhyped. Hes good and will get you points but he's better as a winger and honestly is kinda soft. Last year watching the ducks in tank bowl when he (and well the team) needed to get into another gear he kinda just folded. I get the same vibes where he would be an amazing regular season contributor but disappear bread style with the rangers in playoffs.

His contract though is worth watching as hes a good measure for what KJ will be getting.

 

[squashmaple]

apparently anaheim's front office gave a crazy lowball offer (<4m aav) to trevor zegras. reading between the lines, it looks like they're willing to bet on carlsson/mctavish as their 1-2 duo of the future.

i know he doesn't fit the "what we need" archetype, but… man, i'd be all over that. maybe he's not a true 1C – i think he's talented enough to get there – but having a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch eventually would be absurd. could surround fantilli with playmakers on one line (i.e. johnny and kj) and let zegras carry L2 with a shooter (laine) and north/south forechecking wing (jenner/tex). would also give a lot more juice to my "5F power play" posts.

seems like a good opportunity to consolidate some of their roster pieces + futures into a long-term lineup piece.

Speaking as a fan of both teams, I’d love to get Zegras over here. He’s got an incredible personality on top of his puck skills. Plus built in friendly rivalry with Jack Hughes? That markets itself.

Trading for him would be a classic Jarmo audacity move. I don’t really think it’s the right one, nor does Columbus really have what Anaheim would be looking for (their prospect pool is also extremely defense-heavy). But you can’t deny it would be very on brand for a GM who’s probably desperate for a win.

 

[stevo61]

Zegras is fun and all but overall he is not a good player and due to marketability he will eventually be paid more than he should. Big upside but definitely not someone we should be targetting

 

[JacketsDavid]

I get being opportunistic and when your team is really bad you need to do that.
But I don't think we should be giving up any assets for forwards. This is a growing year.
We have all new coaching, a new blue line (or at least healthy) and young centers that need to see if they are NHL centers.
Bottom line in my mind this team won't win with another top line forward. Our goaltending is likely well below average and the coaches need to implement a new system defensively that the defenders (and forwards) need to get accustomed to.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Zegras is fun and all but overall he is not a good player and due to marketability he will eventually be paid more than he should. Big upside but definitely not someone we should be targetting

Trading for him would be a classic Jarmo audacity move. I don’t really think it’s the right one, nor does Columbus really have what Anaheim would be looking for (their prospect pool is also extremely defense-heavy).

my counter to this is that, overrated or not, zegras fits the profile of someone the blue jackets should be targeting as a long-term piece.

• young (just 22)
• productive at center (65 points last year, 61 the year before that)
• high hockey IQ
• supposedly available

the drawbacks are that he might be best suited at wing and isn't a great two-way player… but the blue jackets have a ton of guys with similar drawbacks (kj, sillinger, roslovic, texier, marchenko, chinakhov) and in the pipeline (dumais, del bel belluz, whitelaw).

he's a uniquely good target for the blue jackets in that he fits the same timeline as those guys (marchenko's 23, chinny's 22, johnson will turn 21 early in the season) but he already has two years of good production and untapped upside.

what are the odds that one of sillinger, roslovic, texier or del bel belluz become 65 point centers? or the odds that chinakhov, marchenko, dumais or whitelaw become 65 point wingers, even? zegras is already that and has the potential to become quite a bit more.

i think he's a near-perfect target because:

1. i'm more comfortable betting on zegras being a legit top six center (because he already is) than sillinger
2. a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch with kj on the wing is far more appealing to me than a fantilli-sillinger 1-2, or a fantilli-johnson-sillinger 1-2-3 given that those guys still have a lot of development ahead of them.
3. he would simultaneously improve the team in the present (vastly) and near future without shortening the window.

jarmo lamented after trading dubois that young scoring line centers never become available outside of the draft – this is the rare instance where one of them is.

 

[BB88]

The wings are pretty full in the top6 already without Zegras. Not worth the price it would take.

They have basically 4/5 longterm top6 wingers in the system

1. Gaudreau
2. Laine
3. Johnson
4. Marchenko
5. (Jenner, in time)

my counter to this is that, overrated or not, zegras fits the profile of someone the blue jackets should be targeting as a long-term piece.

• young (just 22)
• productive at center (65 points last year, 61 the year before that)
• high hockey IQ
• supposedly available

the drawbacks are that he might be best suited at wing and isn't a great two-way player… but the blue jackets have a ton of guys with similar drawbacks (kj, sillinger, roslovic, texier, marchenko, chinakhov) and in the pipeline (dumais, del bel belluz, whitelaw).

he's a uniquely good target for the blue jackets in that he fits the same timeline as those guys (marchenko's 23, chinny's 22, johnson will turn 21 early in the season) but he already has two years of good production and untapped upside.

what are the odds that one of sillinger, roslovic, texier or del bel belluz become 65 point centers? or the odds that chinakhov, marchenko, dumais or whitelaw become 65 point wingers, even? zegras is already that and has the potential to become quite a bit more.

i think he's a near-perfect target because:

1. i'm more comfortable betting on zegras being a legit top six center (because he already is) than sillinger
2. a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch with kj on the wing is far more appealing to me than a fantilli-sillinger 1-2, or a fantilli-johnson-sillinger 1-2-3 given that those guys still have a lot of development ahead of them.
3. he would simultaneously improve the team in the present (vastly) and near future without shortening the window.

jarmo lamented after trading dubois that young scoring line centers never become available outside of the draft – this is the rare instance where one of them is.

The problem is if you can never trust Zegras defensively he’ll never be a C on a good team.

 

[stevo61]

my counter to this is that, overrated or not, zegras fits the profile of someone the blue jackets should be targeting as a long-term piece.

• young (just 22)
• productive at center (65 points last year, 61 the year before that)
• high hockey IQ
• supposedly available

the drawbacks are that he might be best suited at wing and isn't a great two-way player… but the blue jackets have a ton of guys with similar drawbacks (kj, sillinger, roslovic, texier, marchenko, chinakhov) and in the pipeline (dumais, del bel belluz, whitelaw).

he's a uniquely good target for the blue jackets in that he fits the same timeline as those guys (marchenko's 23, chinny's 22, johnson will turn 21 early in the season) but he already has two years of good production and untapped upside.

what are the odds that one of sillinger, roslovic, texier or del bel belluz become 65 point centers? or the odds that chinakhov, marchenko, dumais or whitelaw become 65 point wingers, even? zegras is already that and has the potential to become quite a bit more.

i think he's a near-perfect target because:

1. i'm more comfortable betting on zegras being a legit top six center (because he already is) than sillinger
2. a fantilli-zegras 1-2 punch with kj on the wing is far more appealing to me than a fantilli-sillinger 1-2, or a fantilli-johnson-sillinger 1-2-3 given that those guys still have a lot of development ahead of them.
3. he would simultaneously improve the team in the present (vastly) and near future without shortening the window.

jarmo lamented after trading dubois that young scoring line centers never become available outside of the draft – this is the rare instance where one of them is.

We need 1 more top 6 guy or really hope Marchenko takes major strides but either way I dont think Zegras is the guy to target. Especially for what it would cost. I dont think we project to be a team that struggles offensively so even if we target someone with a little more edge but less offensive upside that would be more ideal.

We still dont know what we have in Sillinger and even Texier at this point. I get jumping on an oppurtunity when it presents itself but this aint it. Also long term I think Johnson > Zegras in overall impact. May not score as much (yet to be seen) but will do more overall to help his team

 

[I3LI3]

Zegras is fun and all but overall he is not a good player and due to marketability he will eventually be paid more than he should. Big upside but definitely not someone we should be targetting

entirely disagree about ‘he’s not a good player’ … zegras is definitely good. he’s just not great.

 

[koteka]

I only mention this as a thought exercise, but what could we offer outside of KJ, Jiricek, and Fantilli that could get it done? They have some good D prospects. My guess is our offer starts at 2024 1st, Sillinger, Dumais, and a Russian forward of their choice. Do they hang up the phone? Does another team just go the offer sheet route and the Ducks end up with a bunch of firsts?

 

[stevo61]

entirely disagree about ‘he’s not a good player’ … zegras is definitely good. he’s just not great.

Overall. Hes poor defensively if you even get him trying at all, he a headcase that when things go bad he either snaps and puts his team on the PK or he just floats around the ice. Uber talented in the offensive zone, once Anaheim gets going 90-100 points wouldnt surprise me but when you look at the other parts of the game hes a wreck that will need a lot of coaching. Hes basically what some believe Laine is.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

I get being opportunistic and when your team is really bad you need to do that.
But I don't think we should be giving up any assets for forwards. This is a growing year.

he's still 22 years old – so it can still be a 'growing' year with him.

on top of that, his current level is higher than what you hope most of those 'growing' assets (sillinger, chinakhov, marchenko).

We have all new coaching, a new blue line (or at least healthy) and young centers that need to see if they are NHL centers.

i'd rather keep kent johnson on the wing and have a very good center who still fits the timeline in zegras than force kent johnson into a center role.

 

[stevo61]

Fun fact: Zegras led both Anaheim and Columbus in PIMs. Those PIMs were not from his elite toughness either

 

[cbjthrowaway]

My guess is our offer starts at 2024 1st, Sillinger, Dumais, and a Russian forward of their choice.

one of peeke/roslovic would go back for cap purposes, just depends whether or not they want a piece that could temporarily replace zegras in the top six (roslovic) or a piece with youth + term who could be a complimentary piece rounding out the lineup without blocking their defensive prospects (peeke).

beyond that, as you said, it'd be a first round pick and some of their young pieces. sillinger and dumais both make sense to include, as do guys like chinakhov, del bel belluz, whitelaw, etc.

would anaheim turn down an offer of sillinger + peeke + dumais + a 2024 1st (top-3 protected) and either a 2025 2nd or a prospect (whitelaw//dbb)? maybe. i know most wouldn't want to part with the 2024 pick, but unless it's in the top three i don't think the odds are great that it ends up being more valuable than zegras is right now.

They have basically 4/5 longterm top6 wingers in the system

1. Gaudreau
2. Laine
3. Johnson
4. Marchenko
5. (Jenner, in time)

The problem is if you can never trust Zegras defensively he’ll never be a C on a good team.

i think the team would be better off having fantilli and zegras centering the first four names on that list, putting the fifth (jenner) on the third line, and running the traditional two scoring/two checking lines. could build some nasty checking lines with guys like jenner, voronkov, texier, etc.

as for the "can't trust zegras enough defensively to be a center on a good team" thing – the capitals won a cup with kuznetsov playing the same style as a 2C behind a do-everything 1C in backstrom. the goal is to replicate that with fantilli as the top dog. malkin stinks defensively, too, but is massively impactful behind crosby.

 

[stevo61]

one of peeke/roslovic would go back for cap purposes, just depends whether or not they want a piece that could temporarily replace zegras in the top six (roslovic) or a piece with youth + term who could be a complimentary piece rounding out the lineup without blocking their defensive prospects (peeke).

beyond that, as you said, it'd be a first round pick and some of their young pieces. sillinger and dumais both make sense to include, as do guys like chinakhov, del bel belluz, whitelaw, etc.

would anaheim turn down an offer of sillinger + peeke + dumais + a 2024 1st (top-3 protected) and either a 2025 2nd or a prospect (whitelaw//dbb)? maybe. i know most wouldn't want to part with the 2024 pick, but unless it's in the top three i don't think the odds are great that it ends up being more valuable than zegras is right now.


i think the team would be better off having fantilli and zegras centering the first four names on that list, putting the fifth (jenner) on the third line, and running the traditional two scoring/two checking lines. could build some nasty checking lines with guys like jenner, voronkov, texier, etc.

as for the "can't trust zegras enough defensively to be a center on a good team" thing – the capitals won a cup with kuznetsov playing the same style as a 2C behind a do-everything 1C in backstrom. the goal is to replicate that with fantilli as the top dog. malkin stinks defensively, too, but is massively impactful behind crosby.

Kuznetsov was a beast for that playoffs though and they also had a lot surrounding those guys. Adding Zegras to Johnson, Gaudreau and Laine is a lot of skill but not a lot of bite. We'd rack up regular season wins but Id fear we would be another version of the Leafs

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Kuznetsov was a beast for that playoffs though and they also had a lot surrounding those guys. Adding Zegras to Johnson, Gaudreau and Laine is a lot of skill but not a lot of bite. We'd rack up regular season wins but Id fear we would be another version of the Leafs

zegras, johnson, gaudreau and laine isn't a very physical group, you're right. but that's four forwards out of 12 in the lineup. fantilli, jenner, voronkov, marchenko, texier and kuraly all add physicality, that's 6 guys. that leaves two spots – can either add another pure physical guy (olivier), an energy guy (danforth), a burner (foudy, robinson), goal scoring (chinny), or a youngster (by then, dbb/dumais). they could add a veteran or two.

imo it boils down to this: are the blue jackets more likely to win (now and in the future) with cole sillinger at 2C, or with trevor zegras? to me, it's zegras for both.

 

[VT]

I'd be more interested to see how Zegras would play in the PO. Our problem is not the offense, not even the center anymore, but the goaltending, because of Tarasov's injuries.

 

[BB88]

one of peeke/roslovic would go back for cap purposes, just depends whether or not they want a piece that could temporarily replace zegras in the top six (roslovic) or a piece with youth + term who could be a complimentary piece rounding out the lineup without blocking their defensive prospects (peeke).

beyond that, as you said, it'd be a first round pick and some of their young pieces. sillinger and dumais both make sense to include, as do guys like chinakhov, del bel belluz, whitelaw, etc.

would anaheim turn down an offer of sillinger + peeke + dumais + a 2024 1st (top-3 protected) and either a 2025 2nd or a prospect (whitelaw//dbb)? maybe. i know most wouldn't want to part with the 2024 pick, but unless it's in the top three i don't think the odds are great that it ends up being more valuable than zegras is right now.


i think the team would be better off having fantilli and zegras centering the first four names on that list, putting the fifth (jenner) on the third line, and running the traditional two scoring/two checking lines. could build some nasty checking lines with guys like jenner, voronkov, texier, etc.

as for the "can't trust zegras enough defensively to be a center on a good team" thing – the capitals won a cup with kuznetsov playing the same style as a 2C behind a do-everything 1C in backstrom. the goal is to replicate that with fantilli as the top dog. malkin stinks defensively, too, but is massively impactful behind crosby.

Zegras has never reminded you of Malkin and that’s an insane comparison overall.
Prime Malkkn was a top3 player in the league at times right there with Crosby.

Zegras is just straight up unplayable right now as a top6 C on a contending team.

 

[koteka]

imo it boils down to this: are the blue jackets more likely to win (now and in the future) with cole sillinger at 2C, or with trevor zegras? to me, it's zegras for both.

Now definitely. Future - most likely Zegras. But if Sillinger becomes a hard to play against 2C (better version of Boone), he might be better for a Cup run than crazy offensive talent Zegras.

Our problem is not the offense, not even the center anymore,

Until I see us running out 3 genuine honest-to-goodness centers that make CBJ fans and other teams say “The Jackets are strong down the middle”, center is still a problem. We have a saying “Don’t count your chickens before they hatch.”

 

[NotWendell]

Speaking as a fan of both teams, I’d love to get Zegras over here. He’s got an incredible personality on top of his puck skills. Plus built in friendly rivalry with Jack Hughes? That markets itself.

Trading for him would be a classic Jarmo audacity move. I don’t really think it’s the right one, nor does Columbus really have what Anaheim would be looking for (their prospect pool is also extremely defense-heavy). But you can’t deny it would be very on brand for a GM who’s probably desperate for a win.

I would LOVE to get Zegras.

 

[LetsGOJackets!!]

Lets take a pause here. The Ducks & Jackets are both developing clubs. They are not parting with their #1 line centre. They may be lowballing him & he may end up demanding a trade and that would then be another story, but right now he is centering Henrique & Terry. Not being traded for scraps.. Our 1st's in the next two drafts - if we were parting with them I would think Lindholm would have been a logical target

 

[614 CBJ]

I would LOVE to get Zegras.

He's a sideshow

Not a winner

 

[CBJx614]

The cost to get zegras isn't worth it.