Speculation: Armchair GM - Offseason Thread (Summer Edition)

[5th Line Fanatic]

70+ point potential wingers are not a dime a dozen

Actually, they are. And, KJ isn't a 70 point winger. He's currently a 40 point winger.

 

[CBJx614]

I wouldn't go long term on a winger until we have our center ice positions settled. 6'1" 178 lb wingers are a dime a dozen. Give him a bridge deal, I have no fear of losing him.

Look at what he's doing on the ice, not where he's lined up on faceoffs.

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

He's closer to Datsyuk (a center) than he is to a dime a dozen winger.

When he starts playing Center, I'm open to changing my mind.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Actually, they are. And, KJ isn't a 70 point winger. He's currently a 40 point winger.

Good thing I said potential then.

 

[koteka]

He's closer to Datsyuk (a center) than he is to a dime a dozen winger.

Id say, if he isn’t a center, then he is closest to Gaudreau and we already have one of those.

 

[majormajor]

Id say, if he isn’t a center, then he is closest to Gaudreau and we already have one of those.

I'll take two.

 

[koteka]

I'll take two.

Two would be nice, but you can only use so much of the cap for wingers.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Two would be nice, but you can only use so much of the cap for wingers.

KJ may be a winger but his game isn’t just based around being a winger. He can do everything. You can’t be too fixated on “center” or “winger.” Just keep great hockey players

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

Good thing I said potential then.

Correct, and I'm not locking up a long term multi-million dollar winger on potential. Prove it son, then we'll pay you. You wanna walk, fine. We'll go get Timo Meier or someone like him who has proved it for pennies on the dollar. Wingers are easy to get. Centers are not.

 

[traffic cone]

Patrick Kane is a winger. Brandon Dubinsky is a center.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Correct, and I'm not locking up a long term multi-million dollar winger on potential. Prove it son, then we'll pay you. You wanna walk, fine. We'll go get Timo Meier or someone like him who has proved it for pennies on the dollar. Wingers are easy to get. Centers are not.

Pennies on the dollar? Didn’t he just sign a 8 year 8.8 per contract? KJ will be a better player than Meier and will make less if they sign him next summer

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

Patrick Kane is a winger. Brandon Dubinsky is a center.

I'm not sure what your point is. We traded a franchise winger for Dubinsky. I'd love to have a winger like Kane too.

Pennies on the dollar? Didn’t he just sign a 8 year 8.8 per contract? KJ will be a better player than Meier and will make less if they sign him next summer

They gave up squat to get him. Paid big to sign him after he had proved his value and they are set at Center.

I'm not saying take KJ out and shoot him. I'm saying prove it son and then we'll pay you big bucks.

 

[traffic cone]

I think the way many GMs think and the way narrative has been in recent years is that you need to have a strong number one center (or two), an elite number one defenseman and an elite goalie when building the team.

I think that because of those pieces get paid the big bucks that you can actually build a ”sneaky good” lineup when investing on good play driving wingers, deep d-core rather than top guys (maybe with specialists; no need for same guys playing PP and PK) and a good goalie tandem rather than a Vezina level starter.

 

[squashmaple]

I think the way many GMs think and the way narrative has been in recent years is that you need to have a strong number one center (or two), an elite number one defenseman and an elite goalie when building the team.

I think that because of those pieces get paid the big bucks that you can actually build a ”sneaky good” lineup when investing on good play driving wingers, deep d-core rather than top guys (maybe with specialists; no need for same guys playing PP and PK) and a good goalie tandem rather than a Vezina level starter.

I’d argue that the goaltender is the least important part. Vasilevskiy is the only truly elite goalie to win the Cup in the last decade, and some of them have been mediocre goalies who got hot behind a hit team at exactly the right time (Hill, Binnington, and Kuemper come to mind). The Blackhawks and Pens dynasties weren’t built on goaltending, either.

Not that we should be having this conversation yet.

 

[koteka]

I think the way many GMs think and the way narrative has been in recent years is that you need to have a strong number one center (or two), an elite number one defenseman and an elite goalie when building the team.

I think that because of those pieces get paid the big bucks that you can actually build a ”sneaky good” lineup when investing on good play driving wingers, deep d-core rather than top guys (maybe with specialists; no need for same guys playing PP and PK) and a good goalie tandem rather than a Vezina level starter.

I think you need solid centers including one really good one and defense that can hold leads and shut down the other team when needed. I am hoping we have the guys that develop into centers. I don’t see us building a defense than can hold leads. If we had 4 guys that could play defense well plus Boqvist and some of the other Bs like Blanks and Berni, I’d feel pretty good about our direction. Once you have your centers and a competent defense then you can look to splurge on wings.

 

[Farmboy Patty]

I think you need solid centers including one really good one and defense that can hold leads and shut down the other team when needed. I am hoping we have the guys that develop into centers. I don’t see us building a defense than can hold leads. If we had 4 guys that could play defense well plus Boqvist and some of the other Bs like Blanks and Berni, I’d feel pretty good about our direction. Once you have your centers and a competent defense then you can look to splurge on wings.

There is no way that you’re going to be able to build a competitive roster unless you take some risk with signing some young talents to longer (=cheaper) deals in time. If KJ shows progress this year, lock him down for multiple years. That’s how you might afford to fill the holes in the line-up that are missing. KJ is only going to become more expensive as time goes on and he’ll still be on the team.

 

[CBJx614]

I'm not sure what your point is. We traded a franchise winger for Dubinsky. I'd love to have a winger like Kane too.

They gave up squat to get him. Paid big to sign him after he had proved his value and they are set at Center.

I'm not saying take KJ out and shoot him. I'm saying prove it son and then we'll pay you big bucks.

Sometimes GMs need to take a gamble on a player to keep everyone together. Going long term on a guy like KJ might look suspicious at first, but 8x8 in 4 years will be chump change if the cap rises as expected and that will be a below market value as long as he's producing 70ish pts. Otherwise, you're going to overpay and you'll never be able to keep all the talent we have coming up.

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

Sometimes GMs need to take a gamble on a player to keep everyone together. Going long term on a guy like KJ might look suspicious at first, but 8x8 in 4 years will be chump change if the cap rises as expected and that will be a below market value as long as he's producing 70ish pts. Otherwise, you're going to overpay and you'll never be able to keep all the talent we have coming up.

I hear your point. If this was an org that was loaded down the middle and on D, sure by all means take a shot on a young winger. But, we are not an org like that. We've won jack squat with the current group. In three years we might find out we don't want to keep them all together.

We also might find out the cap isn't going up like everyone thought. I've yet to hear a decent argument for how they are going to replace the Regional Sports Network money.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

they need to move at least two of the B-name defensemen

Boqvist
Bean
Berni
Blankenburg
Bpeeke

 

[Farmboy Patty]

they need to move at least two of the B-name defensemen

Boqvist
Bean
Berni
Blankenburg
Bpeeke

I’d add Bgoodbranson to that list

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

they need to move at least two of the B-name defensemen

Boqvist
Bean
Berni
Blankenburg
Bpeeke

That has been our standard thinking for several months now. (Although from your list, technically Berni doesn't need to be moved."

 

[cbjthrowaway]

I’d add Bgoodbranson to that list

clear oversight on my part, revised list below:

Boqvist
Bean
Berni
Blankenburg
Bpeeke
gudBranson
provorov if he's Bad

 

[BB88]

Just a side note...expect KJ's contract to be similar next year.

You go longterm with KJ.

Need that Devils model rather than bridge model

 

[BB88]

I wouldn't go long term on a winger until we have our center ice positions settled. 6'1" 178 lb wingers are a dime a dozen. Give him a bridge deal, I have no fear of losing him.

& if you decide to keep him you realize you are paying him millions more per year when your contending window is open

 

[Farmboy Patty]

You go longterm with KJ.

Need that Devils model rather than bridge model

I agree 100%