Are you feeling more or less optimistic about the leafs future since Dubas took over?

[Dekes For Days]

Left side: Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott; Right side: Holl, Sandin, Liljegren

26-year-old star KHL defenseman Lehtonen will likely be in there over Liljegren, assuming no moves.

A very underrated group.

 

[deletethis]

The most genius solutions always contain 2 rookies playing out of position.

 

[member 300185]

The only two checks against Dubas is the Mitch Marner contract and the backup goalie debacle, though Dubas resolved that nicely.

In order to get this team to where it needs to be, it might require a tough move, such as moving off Marner and his contract.

It’s always a TBD scenario. Dubas has shown he can be aggressive to bring in pieces when it’s needed. Muzzin suited our needs. Clifford suited our needs. Campbell suited our needs.

One thing that impresses me a ton is Dubas’ recruitment abilities. He seems to be the best GM we’ve had in this regard. Whether it’s bringing over Russian/Euro FA’s, or going after CHL overagers, or even traditional FA’s, he seems to be really good at getting guys to see the appeal of joining the organization.


At the end of the day, none of us have actual answers. We all have ideas of what we want done, but ifs and buts don't matter.


So two things I’m looking at right now;
1. There’s a hard move coming in the future. Who will it be and what will it return.
2. Andersen is in his last year of his deal. I’m all for extending him, but I’m very weary of giving goalies long term deals, especially given his play this year. Do we extend him? Trade him and acquire a different goalie via FA (Lehner) or trade (Murray, Jarry, Fleury).

He folds like a cheap suit in the big games. No thanks to Anderson.

 

[Dekes For Days]

The most genius solutions always contain 2 rookies playing out of position.

Lehtonen has come out and said that he is fully comfortable on either side; even saying that at times, he prefers his off side. He played a full season on the right. 26 years old playing in professional leagues is also not your typical rookie. Dermott could also play the right side instead of Sandin.

You're dismissing a group while seemingly knowing very little about them.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Start mapping out the parade route:

Left side: Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott; Right side: Holl, Sandin, Liljegren

Plus the obligatory 25 games of Marincin.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Plus the obligatory 25 games of Marincin.

Or Liljegren...
Or Rosen...

All more than capable 7th or lower defensemen.

 

[Bomber0104]

Start mapping out the parade route:

Left side: Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott; Right side: Holl, Sandin, Liljegren

Rielly and Muzzin both on their own have more NHL experience (in games played) than Dermott, Holl, Sandin, Lilegren, Rosen and Lehtonen combined.

Yikes.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Or Liljegren...
Or Rosen...

All more than capable 7th or lower defensemen.

Nope. Marincin.

We'll never be clear of him.

 

[ottomaddox]

Every organization has a Marincin. Too good for the AHL, but never a great NHLer.

 

[deletethis]

Ask any NHL defender whether he thinks he can play the other side. Guarantee that most of them say they can because you don't get there by not believing in your abilities. It's hard to play the other side at the highest level. It's even harder when you're new to the level.

 

[All Mod Cons]

The most genius solutions always contain 2 rookies playing out of position.

I think ideally you'd have
Rielly xxxx
Muzzin xxxx
Dermott/Sandin/Lehtonen/Holl mixture as the 3rd pair.

They're still 2 RHD away from going deep imo. Not sure how they get them though. Regardless of who play what side, i'd say we have 2 top 4 dmen for sure next season. The rest are just hopefuls. Which if we're supposedly going for it, is a risk.

 

[deletethis]

Every organization has a Marincin. Too good for the AHL, but never a great NHLer.

Also who looks like a high quality player in the AHL and the NHL preseason.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Ask any NHL defender whether he thinks he can play the other side. Guarantee that most of them say they can because you don't get there by not believing in your abilities.

He doesn't just think. He's done it.

 

[deletethis]

I think ideally you'd have
Rielly xxxx
Muzzin xxxx
Dermott/Sandin/Lehtonen/Holl mixture as the 3rd pair.

They're still 2 RHD away from going deep imo. Not sure how they get them though. Regardless of who play what side, i'd say we have 2 top 4 dmen for sure next season. The rest are just hopefuls. Which if we're supposedly going for it, is a risk.

Right on. Exactly my point. And hence the cap crunch the team faces looking for Mr. xxxx and Mr. xxxx-2 this summer. Those players will cost in other areas. I do think it's possible that only Mr. xxxx is acquired in the off-season then Mr. xxxx-2 is picked up near the trade deadline.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Every organization has a Marincin. Too good for the AHL, but never a great NHLer.

Everyone used to bitch at Babcock for ever playing Marincin. Now we've just come to accept him.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Every organization has a Marincin. Too good for the AHL, but never a great NHLer.

This is true. Every organization doesn't endlessly complain about their 7th-9th defenseman though.

 

[deletethis]

Mikko Lehtonen has played in the NHL? News to me.

No, he's played the right side in a league that's the level of the AHL on a giant ice surface.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Right on. Exactly my point. And hence the cap crunch the team faces looking for Mr. xxxx and Mr. xxxx-2 this summer. Those players will cost in other areas. I do think it's possible that only Mr. xxxx is acquired in the off-season then Mr. xxxx-2 is picked up near the trade deadline.

Yeah, they can definitely get in with just one upgrade and then look to get the 2nd guy as a rental at the deadline. That would be my plan.

 

[deletethis]

Everyone used to bitch at Babcock for ever playing Marincin. Now we've just come to accept him.

Well, now the internet-approved coaching and GM messiahs are still using the whipping boy. You've got nothing but acceptance at this point.

 

[ottomaddox]

Everyone used to bitch at Babcock for ever playing Marincin. Now we've just come to accept him.

Come to accept him? I don't cheer when he coughs up the puck, makes a boneheaded play, or takes a bad penalty. I just know that every team has their worst player and their #7 D.

 

[ACC1224]

Start mapping out the parade route:

Left side: Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott; Right side: Holl, Sandin, Liljegren

Not the GM's fault, there's nothing he could do about it.
Have you seen Tampa's cap or what Lou Lam has done in NY?

 

[deletethis]

Yeah, they can definitely get in with just one upgrade and then look to get the 2nd guy as a rental at the deadline. That would be my plan.

It's a typical plan: have Leafs' nation clamouring (and the media egging us on) for a 2nd pairing right side vet as the GM puts on a brave, calm face when asked about the subject. Then the GM pulls the trigger on a deal in the spring that solidifies the defense for a Cup run.

 

[Mess]

My God, that defence.

Yikes !!!! ... Due to both the Leafs salary cap management and failed attempts to improve the RHD position both Barrie and Ceci are going to walk as UFA.

That leaves Justin Holl a 28 year old journeyman Dman as Leafs only and best right hand dman standing for next year.

Leafs are hoping a previously undrafted 26 year old Mikko Lehtonen who has never played a minute in the NHL can immediately jump in and play a top 4 role. We have to hope this turns out better than the Igor Ozhiganov former KHL experiment did, because you never know how these "free wallets" will turn out. If it doesn't work out however no big deal as he will be turning 27 and be a UFA at seasons end. However we're asking a LHD to switch sides and hit the ground running as a Top 4 Dman playing 20 minutes a night against top line opposition players.

That leaves youngster Liljegren who has 11 NHL games experience as the only right side Dman on the Leafs depth chart.

The LHD will have Rielly, Muzzin and youngster Sandin with unsigned RFA Dermott with Marincin and Rosen as spares.

Our Leafs already surrendered the 5th most goals against this year, and that was with NHLer's Barrie and Ceci, and now we're hoping "addition by subtraction" somehow the Leafs defense gets better next year.

We're seriously suppose to be optimistic about Leafs future going forward and being serious Cup contenders with a right side Defense of Holl, Lehtonen and Liljegren, that is closer to a Marlies AHL quality defense than NHL one?

 

[IPS]

Ask any NHL defender whether he thinks he can play the other side. Guarantee that most of them say they can because you don't get there by not believing in your abilities. It's hard to play the other side at the highest level. It's even harder when you're new to the level.

Basic zone exit plays become much more difficult for both guys when it's 2 lefties. A lot easier to ring it around the boards to your right handed partner who can immediately start looking for exit passes on his forehand than to ring it around to a lefty who needs to corral the puck and adjust position to start looking for exits. Some guys know how to do it real well (Hjalmarrson and Hainsey are good examples of LHD who know the ins and outs of playing the right side) and others are barely adequate.

Anyone who's expecting Lehtonen (with no NHL experience) to come in here and seamlessly play the right side (some people have slated him on the top pair?!) with no issues is being a little too optimistic. The defense still needs a ton of help.

 

[Dekes For Days]

The rest are just hopefuls. Which if we're supposedly going for it, is a risk.

The rest are:

-Player in his prime, who already played most of the year in the top-4 on the shutdown pairing.
-Player in his prime, who is one of the best defensemen in the next best professional league in the world.
-Young player, who already got a taste of the NHL, who is one of the best defensive prospects in the world.
-Young player, who effectively took on a lot of extra responsibilities through significant injuries this year.

There are always risks and question marks going into every year for every team. I don't know why some expect the Leafs to be perfect, unlike every other team in the league.