Analyzing Dubas's Performance - III

[RoadWarrior]

I'd add a third:

3) Barrie is a better than what he showed with the Leafs this season

If he scored 15 goals and 60 points, it probably wouldn't been as crucified.

For me it's the fact that Dubas dealt our best asset for only 1 year of a RHD. I mean given how it turned out, it's a blessing that he's not here for more than 1 season. But that still leaves a big hole on the blue line.

No. Barrie was always a liability at even strength. His second assists on the PP are meaningless.

If they had more depth on D they could have moved him to the wing.

 

[rumman]

Don’t forget Brett Pesce.

yup, if the Leaf were without their best offensive forward and their best defensive D man there's no way they take Boston to 7 games, no way, no how..................

 

[sparxx87]

I think it comes down to a conflict of objectives.

Shanny -> remediate the relationship, we want them to be here for the next 12+ years
Lou -> get them to the number I need in the short term, all players are replaceable

It's pure conjecture on my part, but I think Lou and Shanahan were in direct philosophical conflict when it comes to how to handle the core, and the strategic direction of the team.

Agreed. Add in that Shanahan’s new guy would come in and have philosophical conflict with the coach for however long, and you’ve had a recipe for failure in play for a few years now.

We’re used to the Leafs being a disappointment but it burns a little more when we see a much, much more talented group on the ice.

 

[sparxx87]

yup, if the Leaf were without their best offensive forward and their best defensive D man there's no way they take Boston to 7 games, no way, no how..................

Well I’d say Slavin is their best defensive defender but Pesce is excellent in his own right so that doesn’t undersell his contributions.

He’s a huge loss for their team.

 

[ToneDog]

yup, if the Leaf were without their best offensive forward and their best defensive D man there's no way they take Boston to 7 games, no way, no how..................

They needed better goaltending. Riemer making a dumb play in game #4 turned that series around. I can see a deal around Andy and a Leaf forward to the Canes for a dman and a gritty forward.

 

[4thline]

Agreed. Add in that Shanahan’s new guy would come in and have philosophical conflict with the coach for however long, and you’ve had a recipe for failure in play for a few years now.

I think keeping the core here long term played a role in that, but also that the "on-ice" philosophical conflict is a different one than many think.
People project tough physical hockey because of where he sits relative to Dubas and all his "gud pro" talk, prime Babcock's MO has always been turn the other cheek tactical hockey with a lot of the fire, fun, and aggression coached out of his players. People project him as a Sutter at the WJC's- fantastic defensively but also tough as nails and hard to play against, but people forget that he took a team that could have run the tournament of rink in every facet of the game (physicality/offense/defense) and coached them to an (albeit tactically perfect) series of passive 2-1 wins, and that his Red Wings post HOF group were the biggest push overs in the league.

I fully expect the visible "give a shit" of this team -push back, aggression, sticking up for each other- to increase a lot, because it already has.

 

[Notsince67]

Contract signings are measured by when they are signed; not by future unknown cap numbers or production. The only one to actually sign under an official projection was Matthews, which would have put him at 14%. Teams have general ideas of how the cap projects forward, but 2017 was the biggest jump it had had in years, which was not immediately expected.

.

I'll bite. Whose official projection? Evolving wild had a projection that was quite a bit lower.

 

[Gallagbi]

I'll bite. Whose official projection? Evolving wild had a projection that was quite a bit lower.

I'm expecting the NHL and Bill Daley. They usually release projected Cap numbers around the new year to owners and GMs.

I think the projection was $83M for this year, but came in lower.

 

[diceman934]

Every one supported his worse trade on here except me. I hated the Kadri trade as we got a soft as butter turn over machine on defence who was no better then Gardiner was and in most ways was far worse. He bailed On the team in game 5. Gardiner played with a bad back.

Our gm told the coach to play Barrie on the top pp unit when we had a far superior D man to do this. This will cost us money or Rielly himself. Dubas was not ready to be a gm he cost us a 1st round draft pic this year as he overpaid on all contracts. People blaming Lou are ridiculous as he never gave away those contracts.

 

[biotk]

Failed to mention that Canes missing Svechinkov or that Canes lack depth to begin with

Canes are a good team but they don't have fire power of the Leafs.

Leafs last year had 2 40 goal scorers down the middle and 2 chances to close out the series and one at home

Or that the Canes won two series last year and won their play-in this year, whereas the Leafs have lost the first round 3-years in a round followed by losing their play-in. So three out of five vs zero out of four. No one has ever said that good teams can't lose a round. But if your team can't win a round they are probably not a good team.

 

[rumman]

I fully expect the visible "give a shit" of this team -push back, aggression, sticking up for each other- to increase a lot, because it already has.

what unit of measurement are you using for millimeters?

 

[supermann_98]

How?

By ... you know ... winning?

 

[ShaneFalco]

It's funny, because COL is an analytics driven team that wanted Dubas in charge.

 

[Leaf Fans]

By ... you know ... winning?

He didn't win here.

 

[ToneDog]

It's funny, because COL is an analytics driven team that wanted Dubas in charge.

Sakic got lucky. No way Dubas wins the Duchene trade.

 

[rumman]

Sakic got lucky. No way Dubas wins the Duchene trade.

and overpays Rantanen.............

 

[fahad203]

It's funny, because COL is an analytics driven team that wanted Dubas in charge.

They had shown interest, that doesn't mean he would have gotten the job.
Every team goes through 3 0r 4 candidates before they make their selection

Sakic would have seen right through him.

 

[ACC1224]

After 3 versions of this thread it seems the vast majority thinks he's done a poor job but shouldn't be replaced just yet.
That about sums it up?

 

[Notsince67]

Every one supported his worse trade on here except me. I hated the Kadri trade as we got a soft as butter turn over machine on defence who was no better then Gardiner was and in most ways was far worse. He bailed On the team in game 5. Gardiner played with a bad back.

Our gm told the coach to play Barrie on the top pp unit when we had a far superior D man to do this. This will cost us money or Rielly himself. Dubas was not ready to be a gm he cost us a 1st round draft pic this year as he overpaid on all contracts. People blaming Lou are ridiculous as he never gave away those contracts.

cough
Salary Cap: - Marner contract discussion XVIII (continued)

 

[rumman]

After 3 versions of this thread it seems the vast majority thinks he's done a poor job but shouldn't be replaced just yet.
That about sums it up?

Yup keeping Dubas is the right move even if he's done a poor job?

 

[All Mod Cons]

They had shown interest, that doesn't mean he would have gotten the job.
Every team goes through 3 0r 4 candidates before they make their selection

Sakic would have seen right through him.

Except us

 

[ACC1224]

View attachment 362523

Yup keeping Dubas is the right move even if he's done a poor job?

Right move will be determined over time. If the backward trend continues, it's a mistake not to let him go now.
He turns things around and it was best they were patient.
The day he was hired you had to know that no matter how bad things got he would be given lots of time.

Scary thing is how much damage can he do turning things around?

 

[diceman934]

cough
Salary Cap: - Marner contract discussion XVIII (continued)

We hated the trade. I said that He was Gardiner but I liked Gardiner better as he complete harder.

 

[rumman]

Right move will be determined over time. If the backward trend continues, it's a mistake not to let him go now.
He turns things around and it was best they were patient.
The day he was hired you had to know that no matter how bad things got he would be given lots of time.

Scary thing is how much damage can he do turning things around?

I've seen nothing to make me feel comfortable with him fixing "this," AND his end of season comments indicate my suspicions are probably correct............

 

[diceman934]

After 3 versions of this thread it seems the vast majority thinks he's done a poor job but shouldn't be replaced just yet.
That about sums it up?

He has been historically bad. He got muzzin that is were the good stopped. Trading away all our grit for softness would be good if he was running a bathroom company. Keeps a goalie we used to tank with. Traded away Kadri and Brown who both played hard and replaced them with charmin. Sign players to historically bad over payments. I hated the trade for petan as we had a useful pk player and competitor and traded him for a ahl player who was useful as a player to hold the bench to the ground. Babcock was not my favorite coach but he handcuffed him so bad it was laughable.