Friedman: Anaheim and Detroit talking trade?

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Duck fans what's Shea Theodores ceiling? Would Mantha+Detroit's 2017 2nd round pick be enough for him. Was just wondering if he could possibly a piece that we could flip to Winnipeg along with other pieces for Trouba.

Ceiling, he certainly has the skills to be a top pairing dmen, my biggest knack on him( same as fowler basically) is that he lacks a physical edge to his play, and seems to be over powered down low. He skates well, has a great shot, great vision and great passing ability.. his offensive upside is very high, and I think what we will have to wait and see on is how he transitions defensively in the NHL, he has looked a little cautious/nervous at times when he was up with the ducks but that is natural, I'm hoping he gets to come back up with the club because I really like what I saw from and having him behind fowler and lindholm gives us incredible LHD depth. His passing shooting and vision also make him a great power play asset.

I think the team is very high on Theodore and id say he is the least likely out of Larsson(tho I think RC likes Larsson a lot) Montour and him, but that being said if we feel like fowler can be signed back in Anaheim that could potentially make Theodore expendable... if he was expendable tho I think there would be a # of teams bidding on him(oilers, leafs, wings, sabers etc). So value wise idk but wed def be looking for an equally skilled wing/center roughly same age id assume.

 

[DavidBL]

As a Ducks fan I would be open to the idea of moving one of our young D for a similar upside Forward. I'm not super familar with Detroits needs other than they want to upgrade their D. I would assume Detroit would prefer a Right sided D but I have seen a lot of interest in Fowler and Theodore. If we compared our prospects to similar players on the Roster id say Theo is closest to Fowler while Montour is closer to Vats. Its kind of the obvious comparison but it also gives us a sense on who could be more available. Vats is signed 4 more years while Fowler is only sogned for 2. So the Ducks might need to replace Fowler sooner than Vats. So my question is which playsr would you prefer style wise. Fowler or Vats?

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Ceiling, he certainly has the skills to be a top pairing dmen, my biggest knack on him( same as fowler basically) is that he lacks a physical edge to his play, and seems to be over powered down low. He skates well, has a great shot, great vision and great passing ability.. his offensive upside is very high, and I think what we will have to wait and see on is how he transitions defensively in the NHL, he has looked a little cautious/nervous at times when he was up with the ducks but that is natural, I'm hoping he gets to come back up with the club because I really like what I saw from and having him behind fowler and lindholm gives us incredible LHD depth. His passing shooting and vision also make him a great power play asset.

I think the team is very high on Theodore and id say he is the least likely out of Larsson(tho I think RC likes Larsson a lot) Montour and him, but that being said if we feel like fowler can be signed back in Anaheim that could potentially make Theodore expendable... if he was expendable tho I think there would be a # of teams bidding on him(oilers, leafs, wings, Sabres etc). So value wise idk but wed def be looking for an equally skilled wing/center roughly same age id assume.

Thanks for the assessment on Shea Theodore, Sounds pretty good. I would assume if Holland was looking to deal Mantha to Anaheim though i'm sure if he's really wanting to trade him just yet. I would've to assume that either Montour or Theodore would be the ones he would be seeking. Pretty much Mantha for Montour straight up should be fair value and Mantha+2nd rounder for Theodore.

 

[Ingvar]

As a Ducks fan I would be open to the idea of moving one of our young D for a similar upside Forward. I'm not super familar with Detroits needs other than they want to upgrade their D. I would assume Detroit would prefer a Right sided D but I have seen a lot of interest in Fowler and Theodore. If we compared our prospects to similar players on the Roster id say Theo is closest to Fowler while Montour is closer to Vats. Its kind of the obvious comparison but it also gives us a sense on who could be more available. Vats is signed 4 more years while Fowler is only sogned for 2. So the Ducks might need to replace Fowler sooner than Vats. So my question is which playsr would you prefer style wise. Fowler or Vats?

We are kind of overstacked on RHD in our prospect pool. We have only 3 prospects of note shooting left - Ouelett (bound to trade or waivers in the future IMO), Hicketts (who isn't likely to reach NHL being 5'8") and Cholowski (who is a few years away). I would prefer Theodore.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Tatar
Sheahan
Vahatalo(http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=174971)

For

Vatanen
Mahura

 

[KaseMeOutside]

You have to realize how different their value was from the start. Montour is actually older than Mantha but was still drafted a year later and in the 2nd round compared to the 1st. Now sure, Montour has done nothing but increase his value since then while Mantha's value took a hit when he started slow in the AHL. But I wouldn't say it's enough to completely erase the value discrepancy. It's not all about the point totals.


Kind of an out of context comparison. Mantha has an extra AHL season that he started by having to recover from a serious injury. His point totals were admittedly lackluster early on but he also worked a lot on rounding on his game and these days is a much more complete player, while his point totals have been steadily increasing to the point where has been PPG+ for most of this year. He's also getting his 2nd NHL call-up now while Montour is still untested in the NHL. Why, I wonder is Montour not getting the chance if he is as good defensively as Theodore and like Gostisbehere offensively?


Realistic? 30+30 top 6 winger. But he definitely has all the tools to do even more. The guy is a very underrated playmaker and has all the scoring tools in the world (reach, soft hands, wrist shot, slapshot). Classic example of a prospect that just needs to put it all together, which it now looks like he is doing or is very close to. Even playing in the top 6 next to Datsyuk last season he did not look out of place at all, the statline may not have been anything to write home about but he passed the eye test.

Montour is 5 months older the age thing really is a bad argument

 

[dracom]

Tatar
Sheahan
Vahatalo(http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=174971)

For

Vatanen
Mahura

No interest in that deal. Those two Detriot prospects aren't interesting enough of an add to Tatar for us to trade Vats and Mahura (who has been a big surprise).

 

[Vatican Roulette]

No interest in that deal. Those two Detriot prospects aren't interesting enough of an add to Tatar for us to trade Vats and Mahura (who has been a big surprise).

Thats fine.

Sheahan is not a prospect. He also plays left wing and center.

Another prospect can be discussed.

 

[dracom]

Thats fine.

Sheahan is not a prospect. He also plays left wing and center.

Another prospect can be discussed.

My bad, not sure why I thought he was a prospect.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Wouldn't be against a deal of Mantha for Montour.

Though if possible i would rather do Mantha+Detroit's 2017 2nd round pick for Theodore instead.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

My bad, not sure why I thought he was a prospect.

Nope 219 career games and 88 points overall for Sheahan, I think this is like his 4th year or so.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Wouldn't be against a deal of Mantha for Montour.

Though if possible i would rather do Mantha+Detroit's 2017 2nd round pick for Theodore instead.

I think on a value stand point

Theodore > Mantha > montour... so I think if it was montour Wed add.

A 2nd and Mantha is prob more then enough for Theodore just depends on how much we want to keep him

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I think on a value stand point

Theodore > Mantha > montour... so I think if it was montour Wed add.

A 2nd and Mantha is prob more then enough for Theodore just depends on how much we want to keep him

Looks good, Would be curious if a deal is around sending Mantha to Anaheim would be curious of the return. Would it be Montour+ for Mantha or Mantha+2nd for Theodore would more or less see Holland going after Theodore then Montour. But like you said it just depends on how high Murray is on Theodore more or less.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

My bad, not sure why I thought he was a prospect.

Hey, it happens, no worries.

Does it change your mind about the proposal?

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

trading mantha for mountour is stupid

we dont need a dman prospect, we need a NHL dman

we can draft a dman prospect with out top 13 pick this summer if we want

we need a young NHL proven dman or forget it

 

[liquiduck]

trading mantha for mountour is stupid

we dont need a dman prospect, we need a NHL dman

we can draft a dman prospect with out top 13 pick this summer if we want

we need a young NHL proven dman or forget it

If that were the case then Friedman and the Anaheims scouting staff are wasting there time. Anaheim isn't selling any of their current NHL defensemen. Especially for prospects.

 

[liquiduck]

Hey, it happens, no worries.

Does it change your mind about the proposal?

It's not a bad proposal, but I don't see Anaheim trading any of their NHL defensemen right now. http://mynhltraderumors.com/nhl-rumors-toronto-maple-leafs-cam-fowler-anaheim-ducks-ny-islanders/2016/11/11/

 

[dracom]

Hey, it happens, no worries.

Does it change your mind about the proposal?

I think I still have to say no. Mostly due to cap reasons. With Tatar coming off his current deal, he would need a good raise. Then the next year we would have both Fowler and Sheahan coming off their deals and looking for a new contract. Just doesn't seem like a smart move to grab players we might not be able to re-sign when we're trading a guy away who is signed to a good long term deal.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

It's not a bad proposal, but I don't see Anaheim trading any of their NHL defensemen right now. http://mynhltraderumors.com/nhl-rumors-toronto-maple-leafs-cam-fowler-anaheim-ducks-ny-islanders/2016/11/11/

If Anaheim wants to stay pat with their D core, I can't argue with that.

Just wanted to toss out something I thought might work and get feedback.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

I think I still have to say no. Mostly due to cap reasons. With Tatar coming off his current deal, he would need a good raise. Then the next year we would have both Fowler and Sheahan coming off their deals and looking for a new contract. Just doesn't seem like a smart move to grab players we might not be able to re-sign when we're trading a guy away who is signed to a good long term deal.

My initial thought on extensions is, cross that bridge when you come to it.

Things change year to year.

Tatar should get around 5 million.

Sheahan, I don't know how he'll progress, so I can't comment. Even if he stays the same player, he's valuable, and won't make much more than his current deal.

Also, with the amount of defensive prospects Anaheim has in their stable, I wouldn't worry too much about re-signing UFA's.

 

[dracom]

My initial thought on extensions is, cross that bridge when you come to it.

Things change year to year.

Tatar should get around 5 million.

Sheahan, I don't know how he'll progress, so I can't comment. Even if he stays the same player, he's valuable, and won't make much more than his current deal.

Also, with the amount of defensive prospects Anaheim has in their stable, I wouldn't worry too much about re-signing UFA's.

That's fair. Though with the struggle we just had because of the budget, I'm admittedly more concerned about future budget problems instead of crossing the bridge when we come to it.

 

[Emerald Duck]

Duck fans what's Shea Theodores ceiling? Would Mantha+Detroit's 2017 2nd round pick be enough for him. Was just wondering if he could possibly a piece that we could flip to Winnipeg along with other pieces for Trouba.

At this point I think he will be a Top 4 PP specialist. His 2-way game is developing well so he might become a top 2 dman but it is a little early to project that high.

IF the Ducks can re-sign Fowler, then Theodore can be available. We would have Lindholm, Fowler and Larsson as LHD, so I could see Theodore (or Larsson) available in the right deal. It's tough to really project either Theodore or Martha based on their limited NHL resume and to determine who adds a pick at this point, but it is realistic to form some type of trade around these two prospects..

 

[Vatican Roulette]

That's fair. Though with the struggle we just had because of the budget, I'm admittedly more concerned about future budget problems instead of crossing the bridge when we come to it.

I really wouldn't worry about future deals with Anaheim's cap structure. They have a great prospect core that has substance.

Fowler can be replaced internally.
Vatanen can be replaced internally.

With less cap hits, with IMO, the same results.

 

[liquiduck]

At this point I think he will be a Top 4 PP specialist. His 2-way game is developing well so he might become a top 2 dman but it is a little early to project that high.

IF the Ducks can re-sign Fowler, then Theodore can be available. We would have Lindholm, Fowler and Larsson as LHD, so I could see Theodore (or Larsson) available in the right deal. It's tough to really project either Theodore or Martha based on their limited NHL resume and to determine who adds a pick at this point, but it is realistic to form some type of trade around these two prospects..

To me it comes down to who Anaheim decides to move this summer( a move will happen). If they move Vats( or plan to) then Theodore is the guy likely available. If they move Fowler, then common sense says
Montour is the guy more likely to move.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

To me it comes down to who Anaheim decides to move this summer( a move will happen). If they move Vats( or plan to) then Theodore is the guy likely available. If they move Fowler, then common sense says
Montour is the guy more likely to move.

I hope if we do move 1 of the big 3 its vats, fowler has really stepped up his game and seems to do really well under RC. Lindholm is just too good and too young to move(Larsson potential is super high also). I feel like Theodore could play RD if we needed him too, he seems to have a versatile skill set .