Proposal: ANA / MTL at the draft

[slybel]

Nope, we moved on.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Great. Another thread where Habs fans can say Zegras is overrated and shouldn’t garner more than a Tim Hortons gift card and a 7th

I guess it depends on whether you also get the free Tim Hortons trading cards on top of the gift card. These are grossly underrated

How?
Reinbacher was a top5 pick in a better draft than this year... Safe to say he'd be the 1st or 2nd dman dtafted this year after Levshunov

Zegras aint worth that

I think it’s safe to say that there’s ~4 D this year that scouts seem to move around quite a bit. Reinbacher would be in that group where a team might like him more than all other D while another team might have him 3-5.

The only real Reinbacher and Lev clearly has over the other ones is they’re RHD and there is a premium attached to those players.

I think you could argue that buium, dickinson, and silayev would be picked before reinbacher (not saying they're definitely better, but I think "safe to say" is a stretch)

Exactly.

 

[Habs Halifax]

It's even worse than that.

Habs fans are obsessed with wanting him at a very low price.

Yup, it's a business and we are pretend GM wantabees. If the situation was reversed, you would do the same.

* Some Habs fans would offer 60 pts traded value. Nothing more, nothing less. I'm in this group.

* Ducks fans want 60-80+ of trade value. Nothing less. The narrative sent back is you keep him if you don't get the asking price. Fair, but lets not pretend there is no risks to that. Because if there is team/player disconnect, it becomes a distraction and if he has another season like the last one, his trade value gets worse. Chances he rebounds and all this media/fan noise goes away? Not sure but certainly possible as well. It can go two ways, not just one.

* Other Habs fans pass. They are not even interested because he is a skilled perimeter type and probably fades in the playoffs when the going gets rough.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Yup, it's a business and we are pretend GM wantabees. If the situation was reversed, you would do the same.

* Some Habs fans would offer 60 pts traded value. Nothing more, nothing less. I'm in this group.

* Ducks fans want 60-80+ of trade value. Nothing less. The narrative sent back is you keep him if you don't get the asking price. Fair, but lets not pretend there is no risks to that. Because if there is team/player disconnect, it becomes a distraction and if he has another season like the last one, his trade value gets worse. Chances he rebounds and all this media/fan noise goes away? Not sure but certainly possible as well. It can go two ways, not just one.

* Other Habs fans pass. They are not even interested because he is a skilled perimeter type and probably fades in the playoffs when the going gets rough.

- he is already a 60+ player, it’s very biased to assume he is incapable of scoring more than he already has in both his full seasons. Not to mention he’s played on an anemic offense and power play during that time… 65 points is borderline amazing with everything going against him

- duck fans have no intention of trading him, you’d have a tough time finding a thread made by duck fans offering zegras for anyone, or asking the value of zegras because 95% think he should be a core piece

- “probably”…. So basically you have no clue and Hoping shit sticks if you say it enough

And lastly…. Pv goal is to build a winning hockey club if there is a trade where zegeas is moved that makes us better then sure maybe he moves him….. but guess what beck 26 and a scrap piece ain’t that.

Maybe it’s Montreal fans that need to look at it from both sides…. But generally your fan base isn’t exactly known for that on these boards

 

[Galaxydoggystyle]

Can someone just lock this thread? its getting into an obvious pissing match that is going no where.

 

[CanadienShark]

It's even worse than that.

Habs fans are obsessed with wanting him at a very low price.

We're obsessed with every good player at a low price.

 

[Habs Halifax]

- he is already a 60+ player, it’s very biased to assume he is incapable of scoring more than he already has in both his full seasons. Not to mention he’s played on an anemic offense and power play during that time… 65 points is borderline amazing with everything going against him

- duck fans have no intention of trading him, you’d have a tough time finding a thread made by duck fans offering zegras for anyone, or asking the value of zegras because 95% think he should be a core piece

- “probably”…. So basically you have no clue and Hoping shit sticks if you say it enough

And lastly…. Pv goal is to build a winning hockey club if there is a trade where zegeas is moved that makes us better then sure maybe he moves him….. but guess what beck 26 and a scrap piece ain’t that.

Maybe it’s Montreal fans that need to look at it from both sides…. But generally your fan base isn’t exactly known for that on these boards

His career average prorated to 82 games is 60 pts. Yes he had a 61 and 65 point seasons but then 15 in 31 this past season. This past season just doesn't disappear. What does he do from this point forward? You're going to say he easily can produce 60-80+ and others are going to say, possible but that is hoping the players improves.

Today, his trade value is what he has done. 211 games and at age 23... you usually know what kind of player they are. But you will give me the MacKinnon break out narrative. Those are exceptions but they are not the general rule.

The value I would offer is a 60 pts forward. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

His career average prorated to 82 games is 60 pts. Yes he had a 61 and 65 point seasons but then 15 in 31 this past season. This past season just doesn't disappear. What does he do from this point forward? You're going to say he easily can produce 60-80+ and others are going to say, possible but that is hoping the players improves.

Today, his trade value is what he has done. 211 games and at age 23... you usually know what kind of player they are. But you will give me the MacKinnon break out narrative. Those are exceptions but they are not the general rule.

The value I would offer is a 60 pts forward. Nothing more, nothing less.

And why would PV do that when the team is significantly better when zegras is in the line up

 

[Rec T]

And why would PV do that when the team is significantly better when zegras is in the line up

Don Quixote had better luck tilting at windmills than you trying to apply logic to dearly held preconceived notions...

Lock this up, Z is going nowhere without a premium asset coming back. Montreal doesn't want to pay that - which is fine, but you don't get him for scraps either & need to accept that rather than getting offended that other teams don't want to fill your roster for peanuts (not directed at any one particular poster, just in general).

 

[tomd]

I wish there was a way I could hide all "Trade proposal" and "Value of" threads.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Habs picked Reinbacher instead of Michkov, and now they need to prove it was a worthy pick. Zegras isn't the provement...

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I wish there was a way I could hide all "Trade proposal" and "Value of" threads.

Just avoid trade boards on non free agent/deadline days

 

[FiveTacos]

His career average prorated to 82 games is 60 pts. Yes he had a 61 and 65 point seasons but then 15 in 31 this past season. This past season just doesn't disappear.

It doesn't disappear, but you also choose to ignore that he played injured for all but 11 of those games ... And he had 8 in those 11 games.

What does he do from this point forward? You're going to say he easily can produce 60-80+ and others are going to say, possible but that is hoping the players improves.

Well I guess McTavish and Carlsson are even cheaper to acquire then, since they've been less productive. I do think better teammates/PP and zero improvement still likely yields a 70 point guy. I don't really consider that significant, except insofar as to say his situation went from awful to good.

Today, his trade value is what he has done. 211 games and at age 23... you usually know what kind of player they are.

Well then I never want to hear another single F'ing thing about how good 23yo Caufield or Newhook or any other Hab will be in the future. They are what they are, right?

But you will give me the MacKinnon break out narrative. Those are exceptions but they are not the general rule.

Nylander actually tracks nearly identically to Zegras. That's probably best case. Worst case barring more injuries is a 2nd line C/W. No one's expecting Zegras to be an MVP level guy like MacKinnon.

 

[Gliff]

Can someone just lock this thread? its getting into an obvious pissing match that is going no where.

No way. We still need 20 more pages.

Then another thread will open and we start all over again!

 

[A Loyal Demidog]

No way. We still need 20 more pages.

Then another thread will open and we start all over again!

I’m A Loyal Dog, and I approve this message.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

It doesn't disappear, but you also choose to ignore that he played injured for all but 11 of those games ... And he had 8 in those 11 games.



Well I guess McTavish and Carlsson are even cheaper to acquire then, since they've been less productive. I do think better teammates/PP and zero improvement still likely yields a 70 point guy. I don't really consider that significant, except insofar as to say his situation went from awful to good.



Well then I never want to hear another single F'ing thing about how good 23yo Caufield or Newhook or any other Hab will be in the future. They are what they are, right?



Nylander actually tracks nearly identically to Zegras. That's probably best case. Worst case barring more injuries is a 2nd line C/W. No one's expecting Zegras to be an MVP level guy like MacKinnon.

True, logic checks out
Caufield is a 60 point, 1 dimensional, pp merchant getting paid 7.85 mil for 7 seasons
What’s the cap dump price of caufield to Anaheim…. Maybe we should bring caufield to Anaheim instead of Montreal bringing zegras there.

Newhook 35 point player
Kirby dach 32 point player

Despite having 77 points last year at 24, Suzuki is only a 64 point player also.

0 flaws in this logic

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Nope, we moved on.

And yet these threads dominated by Habs fans telling us how bad Z is while making garbage offers for him continue to flourish.

 

[General Fanager]

Yea no chance The Habs do this.

Take BPA at #5 no matter what and they can play with 26th and other assets to move up.

 

[General Fanager]

It's even worse than that.

Habs fans are obsessed with wanting him at a very low price.

Not all Hab fans want him.

 

[Crazy8oooo]

20 point Dach was valued at a 13 and 66 pick by Montreal.

30 point Newhook was valued at 31 and 33 along with a defenseman by Montreal.

60 point Zegras, with double the production of both players respectively, is somehow only valued at the 26th pick and a surplus defenseman by Montreal fans.

I really hope Montreal’s GM doesn’t feel differently than the Montreal fans because I’m in the group that wants Zegras to be a part of the Ducks future. Keep the offers low so he remains a Duck!

 

[Kimota]

There's a difference between "We are interested in Zegras" to "you will lose Reinbacher for it"

 

[MTL Dirty Birdy]

I would be open to trade the following for Zegras:

- 26th OV
- 1 of Mailloux/Matheson (I know he's not really a need for ANA, considering his age, but he can be flipped and is easily worth a mid-1st)
- Dvorak (UFA in 2025)
- 1 of Mesar/Tuch/Farrell

I know it's mostly a quality for quantity trade, but ANA could either take Mailloux or take Matheson and flip him + 26th for maybe Devils 10th OV? And they get a good prospect in 1 of Mesar/Tuch/Farrell, and a warm body in Dvorak.

Zegras isn’t worth 3 firsts and a DVO. IMO that’s too much for what he’s shown so far

 

[A Loyal Demidog]

I know I'm in the minority, but I do like Zegras a lot. Since Anaheim don't want quantity (perfectly understandable), I would honestly offer:


- Zegras
- 3rd overall pick (2024)
- 32nd overall pick (2024)


- Reinbacher
- 5th overall pick (2024)
- MTL 2nd round pick (2025)

The difference between 3rd and 5th overall this year isn't much. And I doubt 32nd this year to a very high 2nd next year will be much difference either. But, at least this allows MTL to use their 26th and 32nd picks to trade up this draft, and get the player they want with the 3rd overall.

I know Reinbacher can be fantastic, but Zegras is in the right age group with Suzuki/Caufield, etc. He's also great friends with them, and knows MSL super well. I feel he might be a fantastic add to the Habs.

 

[FiveTacos]

- Zegras
- 3rd overall pick (2024)
- 32nd overall pick (2024)


- Reinbacher
- 5th overall pick (2024)
- MTL 2nd round pick (2025)

The difference between 3rd and 5th overall this year isn't much. And I doubt 32nd this year to a very high 2nd next year will be much difference either. But, at least this allows MTL to use their 26th and 32nd picks to trade up this draft.

If the Ducks are giving up Zegras AND the 3oa AND another late 1st, they'll be going after a big name. Other big names have been traded for less.

 

[dracom]

I know I'm in the minority, but I do like Zegras a lot. Since Anaheim don't want quantity (perfectly understandable), I would honestly offer:


- Zegras
- 3rd overall pick (2024)
- 32nd overall pick (2024)


- Reinbacher
- 5th overall pick (2024)
- MTL 2nd round pick (2025)

The difference between 3rd and 5th overall this year isn't much. And I doubt 32nd this year to a very high 2nd next year will be much difference either. But, at least this allows MTL to use their 26th and 32nd picks to trade up this draft, and get the player they want with the 3rd overall.

I know Reinbacher can be fantastic, but Zegras is in the right age group with Suzuki/Caufield, etc. He's also great friends with them, and knows MSL super well. I feel he might be a fantastic add to the Habs.

So we’re giving up all the better assets in this deal? No thanks.