Blue Jays Discussion: Alright, no more discontent. Just baseball | ST in Mtl: StL @ Tor | Mar 26/27 7pm ET/4pm PT

[Hoverhand]

I think I disagree. When we traded Reyes he was a 32 year old SS with 2.3 years left on a deal paying him 55 million(22+22+4 mil buyout + 7 mil pro-rated for end of 2015). He was a 1 fWAR player to that point in the year. 3.5 the prior year, 2.2 the year before that. Tulo is a 33 year old SS with 3 years left at 58 million(20+20+14+4 mil buyout), was a 0 fWAR player last year. 2.9 and 2.4 the 2 years prior.

If you don't believe that this Tulo is the real Tulo then I guess you hope it's better, but he hasn't been vintage Tulo for 3 years now. What we see is probably what we get unfortunately, and it's probably worse than what we had left with Reyes who was younger, owed less money for less time, and had better results leading up to that point.

I really don't want to believe that we're to that point yet, but we might be.

I think he was referring to the off-field stuff with Reyes.

I was referring to the off field thing and maybe im wrong. They likely would've just released him and went with a Goins type until they found a decent replacement in free agency.

But at face value, the PR mess of dealing with off field abuse is an excruciating headache to the management and the fans.

 

[Hoverhand]

Hernandez reminds me of Grichuk a little - Grichuk is a better defender and base runner but Hernandez could potentially bring more power.

I'm very excited to see how Grichuk's power responds to the AL East, He knocked out 22 in the NL Central. If he has a full season in this batting lineup, 30 dong season is a possibility.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I really think Tulo has had some tough luck with injuries since coming to the Jays. First running into our 2B and fracturing his collarbone, then running to first base and turning his ankle. Both plays were him playing all out and were fluke injuries. I still believe he provided more for us the past 3 seasons then Reyes ever would have. And I still believe that he will contribute at a better then average level when he returns to heath for the duration of his contract. It looks bad yes because he hasn't been on the field. But I do believe there still is value in him being on our team moving forward. And he will have a Tulo like season this year when he returns. I have a feeling.

It was the collarbone, and the collision was with Kevin Pillar's adamantium chin (still hate you, Kevin).

Regardless, the "Tulo-like" seasons are gone. The best you can hope for is a 2015/2016 production level season (i.e. 100 wRC+, ~2.5fWAR), which would be perfectly acceptable.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Tulo is the Lupul of the Jays
Travis too

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Tulo is the Lupul of the Jays
Travis too

Tulo played 125+ Games with 500+ PA's in the two season preceding 2017.

 

[theaub]

I can't really be mad at the Tulo move. Whether it was progression to the mean from a historic offense (likely) or CLUBHOUSE LEADERSHIP (unlikely but not impossible) they played like .700% ball when he showed up and were undoubtedly the best team in the league. Then they messed it up in the playoffs. C'est la vie.

 

[Discoverer]

I can't really be mad at the Tulo move. Whether it was progression to the mean from a historic offense (likely) or CLUBHOUSE LEADERSHIP (unlikely but not impossible) they played like .700% ball when he showed up and were undoubtedly the best team in the league. Then they messed it up in the playoffs. C'est la vie.

That's basically my stance, too. The last couple years were always likely to look bad, but it was worth it. It was a win-now move, and those always come with consequences down the road.

 

[Bjindaho]

Also, Ryan Goins posted a higher WAR than Reyes down the stretch.

While he put up a 1 with us, he actually had become an albatross to the point where we could not afford him to be on the field.

 

[phillipmike]

 

[hoc123]

Obviously this should also mean Vlad Jr goes with him to New Hampshire

 

[Discoverer]

Not surprising. The idea of keeping them in Dunedin to start the year never really made sense.

 

[Lisa Needs Braces]

I wonder if Vlad is also being sent to New Hampshire.

Assuming both play to their potential, do you call them up in September if the jays are out? Or do you let them be and challenge them to either make the roster or be first call up in 2019?

 

[Discoverer]

I wonder if Vlad is also being sent to New Hampshire.

Assuming both play to their potential, do you call them up in September if the jays are out? Or do you let them be and challenge them to either make the roster or be first call up in 2019?

If they play to their potential there's a decent chance they're up before September.

 

[hoc123]

Jays' Guerrero, Bichette to open in Double-A - Article - TSN

As said, Bichette will open in AA and so will Guerrero Jr. Nate Pearson will also start in Dunedin.

 

[phillipmike]

As expected Vladdy is joining him.

 

[phillipmike]

Hope this isnt a sign of things to come but i googled "Nate Pearson" and a pic of Billy Koch came up;

 

[Nineteen67]

Hope this isnt a sign of things to come but i googled "Nate Pearson" and a pic of Billy Koch came up;

View attachment 106881

Yikes.....I hope your google box is broken.....

 

[Hoverhand]

I can't really be mad at the Tulo move. Whether it was progression to the mean from a historic offense (likely) or CLUBHOUSE LEADERSHIP (unlikely but not impossible) they played like .700% ball when he showed up and were undoubtedly the best team in the league. Then they messed it up in the playoffs. C'est la vie.

I agree with pretty much all of this, using prospect capital for a clear upgrade at SS for a world series run was the right decision at the time.

 

[canucksfan]

Nice to see Pearson start in Dunedin.

 

[zeke]

fangraphs positional power rankings.

3B 1st
C 9th
2B 11th
SS 11th
CF 12th
1B 12th
RF 13th
LF 15th
DH 9th (of 15)

One stud position, surrounded by a bunch of average to good.

DH the weakest spot but more just below average than bad.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

fangraphs positional power rankings.

3B 1st
C 9th
2B 11th
SS 11th
CF 12th
1B 12th
RF 13th
LF 15th
DH 9th (of 15)

One stud position, surrounded by a bunch of average to good.

DH the weakest spot but more just below average than bad.

I think we'll see the team ranked ahead of where they are when all is said and done at 2B and RF.

Anticipating break-outs + full seasons (4.5+ fWAR) from Travis and Grichuk in their age 26/27 seasons.

 

[Discoverer]

I think we'll see the team ranked ahead of where they are when all is said and done at 2B and RF.

Anticipating break-outs + full seasons (4.5+ fWAR) from Travis and Grichuk in their age 26/27 seasons.

Not negative enough. Try again.

 

[Discoverer]

fangraphs positional power rankings.

3B 1st
C 9th
2B 11th
SS 11th
CF 12th
1B 12th
RF 13th
LF 15th
DH 9th (of 15)

One stud position, surrounded by a bunch of average to good.

DH the weakest spot but more just below average than bad.

Yep. People want stars everywhere, but having no obvious weaknesses is just as important as having real strengths.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Not negative enough. Try again.

Aww geez. Um, let's see. Travis gets hurt in his first PA, disappears for the rest of the year, and Grichuk catches the Bautista virus, grows a beard, and is worth -0.5 fWAR.

Also, Shapiro sucks.

 

[Discoverer]

Aww geez. Um, let's see. Travis gets hurt in his first PA, disappears for the rest of the year, and Grichuk catches the Bautista virus, grows a beard, and is worth -0.5 fWAR.

Also, Shapiro sucks.