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All Purpose Mitch Marner Talk II

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Ok guys, stop underrating Mitch Marner. 94 points 2 years ago. 93 point pace last year when everyone thinks he played crappy. He's a franchise winger.
And yeah, people will point to Tkachuk's "cheaper" cap hit without even putting any thought into the fact Marner's deal is double the term.
 
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Maybe people should wait for Tkachuk to have a playoff series that isn't dogshit before anointing him some sort of playoff warrior.

Slewfooting people in the regular season is one thing, the refs protect him from any real payback. Once they put their whistles away in the playoffs, Tkachuk is neutered.
 
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Martin Skoula said:
Maybe people should wait for Tkachuk to have a playoff series that isn't dogshit before anointing him some sort of playoff warrior.

Slewfooting people in the regular season is one thing, the refs protect him from any real payback. Once they put their whistles away in the playoffs, Tkachuk is neutered.
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This. Peopel see him "Hitting" and playing "Griity" and think that makes him some playoff warrior LOL

I'll take the 90+ point forward thanks
 
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KyleDubasBoyGeniua said:
Ok guys, stop underrating Mitch Marner. 94 points 2 years ago. 93 point pace last year when everyone thinks he played crappy. He's a franchise winger.
And yeah, people will point to Tkachuk's "cheaper" cap hit without even putting any thought into the fact Marner's deal is double the term.
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That and for all the crap marner and the other leaf players get for their playoff shortcomings and lower than optimal production, Tkachuk a guy who has the stereotypical "built for the playoffs" playstyle is worse than Kapanen was for us in his last three playoff series. He has a measly 5 pts in 15 games. Underperformed 3 consecutive years now.

People apply our players short sample size of 25 playoff games for determining they wont ever do anything in the playoffs, so it's only fair the same can be done for tkachuck who disappears in production come playoffs.

He also didnt face Wsh, Bos, Bos in his first three playoff series (1st, 3rd, and tied for 2nd best teams in the league)

Tkachuk is an overrated player. He has zero all nhl team votes so far in his career. He has yet to distinguish himself from Gaudreau for best winger on that team. Marner is 2 tiers above him right now as a player.

Tkachuk is closer to nylander except nylander does seem to he rapidly progressing upwards after his last year while tkachuk stagnated.
 
Matthew Tkachuk has 3 goals and and 5 points in 15 playoffs gamers. What the hell are people talking about?
Marner has 21 points in 25 playoff games...
But Matthew Tkachuk is a playoff warrior?


Am I the only one that notices perception of players in other markets in just sugar coated and Leaf players just get the most crap?
 
Honestly, Tkachuk over Marner?
I can see Tkachuk being a good trade for Willie, as they are closer in value but Willie seems to be trending upwards after last season while Tkachuk’s antic has caught up to him as he is not smart enough like Marchand.
But Tkachuk over Marner, that’s really far off in values.
 
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IT's funny reading about the perception of Leaf players vs players in other markets. Then you dig into the numbers and see the truth.

21 points in 25 games in the playoff, but Marner is nota guy you can win with..
 
Marner aint as good as his ppg make him look like. This year he got points while sitting in the lockerroom. But Tkachuk is not close to Marner. And we should not trade Marner at all.
 
KyleDubasBoyGeniua said:
IT's funny reading about the perception of Leaf players vs players in other markets. Then you dig into the numbers and see the truth.

21 points in 25 games in the playoff, but Marner is nota guy you can win with..
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There is much more to this game, than putting up points. So far, Marner, Matthews, Nylander, haven't put together their full NHL games, to become ultimate winners. As I've previously in this thread, they have that capacity in them, as they've all done it elsewhere. But they haven't elevated fully in the NHL yet. I think he is a guy you can win with, but he hasn't shown that next level compete.
 
Fogelhund said:
There is much more to this game, than putting up points. So far, Marner, Matthews, Nylander, haven't put together their full NHL games, to become ultimate winners. As I've previously in this thread, they have that capacity in them, as they've all done it elsewhere. But they haven't elevated fully in the NHL yet. I think he is a guy you can win with, but he hasn't shown that next level compete.
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Neither has Tkachuk . Ands his numbers are worse. Why does it seem there's a different criteria for him?

Wjenever I see the argument "The game is more than points" it means the person compared to a Leaf player is worse and the lame "Overall" argument comes up to make up for it,
 
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KyleDubasBoyGeniua said:
Neither has Tkachuk . Ands his numbers are worse. Why does it seem there's a different criteria for him?

Wjenever I see the argument "The game is more than points" it means the person compared to a Leaf player is worse and the lame "Overall" argument comes up to make up for it,
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Find me a post, where I've even mentioned Tkachuk... you are bringing the wrong argument to the wrong person.

And the second point... you really are searching for an argument that isn't there... I'm not comparing to any other player out there, on any other team. My words are simply what they say, no hidden meaning, or story. I appreciate the prior discussion, but my words were clearly not discussing that conversation.
 
I don't think anyone is really comparing Tkachuk and Marners point totals in the playoffs. Tkachuk brings an element that this team is desperately missing which is why I'd make that deal.
 
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KyleDubasBoyGeniua said:
Neither has Tkachuk . Ands his numbers are worse. Why does it seem there's a different criteria for him?

Wjenever I see the argument "The game is more than points" it means the person compared to a Leaf player is worse and the lame "Overall" argument comes up to make up for it,
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Clearly you are replying to a person on my ignore list so I suspect this isnt the first lame argument made. These kind of folks are great at motherhood statements but wont stand by specific criticism of players because the claims are so tenuous and not supported by any real evidence.
 
Notsince67 said:
Clearly you are replying to a person on my ignore list so I suspect this isnt the first lame argument made. These kind of folks are great at motherhood statements but wont stand by specific criticism of players because the claims are so tenuous and not supported by any real evidence.
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Must be speaking of me, and of course, he's wrong again anyway....
 
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Leaf fans are not trading Marner for Tkachuk and Flames fans aren't trading Tkachuk for Marner or Nylander IMO. As @TMLAM34 said, Tkachuk brings an element that this team is desperately missing. Not only that, he brings it to your top 6 where Leafs are even more lacking this element.

Tkachuk plays on the edge like Kadri but I doubt Flames are going to ship him out for being suspended as the Leafs did Kadri.
 
ToneDog said:
Leaf fans are not trading Marner for Tkachuk and Flames fans aren't trading Tkachuk for Marner or Nylander IMO. As @TMLAM34 said, Tkachuk brings an element that this team is desperately missing. Not only that, he brings it to your top 6 where Leafs are even more lacking this element.

Tkachuk plays on the edge like Kadri but I doubt Flames are going to ship him out for being suspended as the Leafs did Kadri.
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I do not agree that Kadri and Tkatchuk play on similar edges... I think if Kadri brought the same heart and intensity game in and game out that Tkachuk brings, then Kadri would have not been moved. Problem with Kadri is that his intensity was inconsistent and often would be mostly retaliatory... resulting in poorly timed penalties, and suspensions. Though maybe if he was better insulated with tough players, he would have been more physical game in and game out. Tkatchuk brings his crazy physical play every single game. Obviously there is a huge difference in their sizes too.

We really need a "Captain" to emerge this year... we need someone to step in with heart. I think Matthews might be slowly emerging into that role. He was moving a lot in the playoffs, he was using his body, he was being physical sometimes. I don't see behind the scenes, but I think the Leafs made a mistake not making Matthews the captain and "face of the franchise". I think he is the type who thrives under pressure and responsibility. The fact that he has to share an A with Marner is ridiculous. Guessing there is something Dubas and Shanahan do not like about his personality, because I cannot think of any other reason why they would be treating a generation talent like Matthews this way (and potentially running him out of town).
 
ToneDog said:
Tkachuk plays on the edge like Kadri but I doubt Flames are going to ship him out for being suspended as the Leafs did Kadri.
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Different scenarios. Kadri wasn't moved for a couple of suspensions. He was moved as a result of issues since being drafted, internal suspension, internal discipline issues.... that date back to 2010-11.... It was eight-nine years of internal, and of course external suspensions too... but it wasn't just the suspensions.

“We like Nazem Kadri. His teammates like him. It’s time for him to start making better decisions,” Shanahan told reporters at the time. “There comes a point where you’ve got to grow up. … We expect a certain level of professionalism. It’s time for [Kadri] to start making better decisions. There’s a history here.” That was 2015.

If Tkachuk had internal run ins, internal suspension, public calling out for being immature, and it lasted at least eight years, he'd get moved... anyone would.
 
ACC1224 said:
Element that is missing for sure but you don’t move a Marner for it.
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Honesty whatever element he has he hasnt shown it in the playoffs yet either. His play declines fast come playoffs. Production drops like a rock, his gives it away 2x more than he takes away (10 vs 5) and he is a negative player through his first 3 runs.

Right now Tkachuk has not shown the maturity in his game to be a trusted playoff performer. He takes unesscary penalties and loses focus of his role on the team getting goaded by other players.

He wont ever be worth marner but his play this year regular season + playoffs included was not better than Nylander's by much even if factoring his physcial aspect.

I like his younger brother's game much better. If we ever did deal marner I'd target a deal around Brady k Tkachuk++ rather than Matthew Tkachuk (though I generally see marner putting it all together next year and finishing with an Hart level season)
 
hamzarocks said:
Honesty whatever element he has he hasnt shown it in the playoffs yet either. His play declines fast come playoffs. Production drops like a rock, his gives it away 2x more than he takes away (10 vs 5) and he is a negative player through his first 3 runs.

Right now Tkachuk has not shown the maturity in his game to be a trusted playoff performer. He takes unesscary penalties and loses focus of his role on the team getting goaded by other players.

He wont ever be worth marner but his play this year regular season + playoffs included was not better than Nylander's by much even if factoring his physcial aspect.

I like his younger brother's game much better. If we ever did deal marner I'd target a deal around Brady k Tkachuk++ rather than Matthew Tkachuk (though I generally see marner putting it all together next year and finishing with an Hart level season)
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I’d take him in a heartbeat, not for Marner though, that’s silly. Exactly the type of player the Leafs are missing
 
The biggest thing with Marner is the opposition can play him like they use to play Sergei Berezin. You knew Berezin was going to shoot, just like you know Marner is going to pass. I really think Marner tried to change this up more to keep the opposition on their toes, but he just has such a weak shot.
 
moon111 said:
The biggest thing with Marner is the opposition can play him like they use to play Sergei Berezin. You knew Berezin was going to shoot, just like you know Marner is going to pass. I really think Marner tried to change this up more to keep the opposition on their toes, but he just has such a weak shot.
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Very odd comparison imo Berezin had 1 big year in his entire career. The past 2 and a half seasons Marner has been one of the most productive players in the entire NHL. There was no sign last year anyone figured him out. If you're a great passer you will be able to always pass. Same with Gretzky, Oates, Thornton ETC
 
ToneDog said:
Leaf fans are not trading Marner for Tkachuk and Flames fans aren't trading Tkachuk for Marner or Nylander IMO. As @TMLAM34 said, Tkachuk brings an element that this team is desperately missing. Not only that, he brings it to your top 6 where Leafs are even more lacking this element.

Tkachuk plays on the edge like Kadri but I doubt Flames are going to ship him out for being suspended as the Leafs did Kadri.
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Kadri did something no player in NHL history has. To make it sound like he got 1 typical suspended is really not accurate.
You won't care muchw hen Kerfoot puts up his best year ever this year.
 
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